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Unread 28th April 2012, 08:15   #31
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Another oddity - at 0926 when the St Pancras train leaves Lime St, it could reach London via Warrington BQ and the WCML much earlier than via Chesterfield.
As far as I can see the Warrington-Crewe-Euston line is open until 1100.
The fans would get another hour at Wembley that way...
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Unread 28th April 2012, 08:52   #32
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It might also be at capacity.
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Unread 28th April 2012, 12:44   #33
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Just a though, but if we assume that the EMT staff available only have "mainline" knowledge (i.e. the lines that the HST runs) and so they need a Northern driver/ guard for route knowledge on the Liverpool side of the route, what about the south western chord at Dore?

AFAIK no Northern services are scheduled to run it (even as ECS) - but its only a short section of line - would that be a problem?
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Unread 28th April 2012, 12:49   #34
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Emt drivers have knowledge of the Dore south curve, it is often used to catch up time and Sheffield passengers get dumped on.

Emt should know the entire route, as I said on an earlier post they must sign Newton-le-willows considering all EMT services are diverted around that way that weekend.
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Unread 28th April 2012, 13:21   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbtc View Post
Just a though, but if we assume that the EMT staff available only have "mainline" knowledge (i.e. the lines that the HST runs) and so they need a Northern driver/ guard for route knowledge on the Liverpool side of the route
EMT would just use someone from Nottingham to route Conduct, just like when 222 are used on Liverpool runs
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Unread 28th April 2012, 13:23   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas6187 View Post
EMT would just use someone from Nottingham to route Conduct, just like when 222 are used on Liverpool runs
I don't think they would have a problem, many Nottingham drivers sign the route and HSTs (for getting to Skegness)
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Unread 28th April 2012, 16:37   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hick View Post
Not Chiltern's area of concern really now they're not running to Wrexham, it's not really like the Shrewsbury situation.

The value for the franchise is to make sure that the maintenance schedules for the weekday mainline stock aren't compromised as I'm sure you're aware Chiltern runs one of the highest stock utilisations going.

This is also on top of the fact that the Wembley stock plan for use on the Chiltern route will use pretty much all the stock going spare and may even eat in to the normal weekend maintenance allowances.
However the loco hauled sets are at rest at weekends and one could be utilsed but saying that I think Chiltern will have their hands full as it is maybe
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Unread 28th April 2012, 18:33   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Failed Unit View Post
Emt drivers have knowledge of the Dore south curve, it is often used to catch up time and Sheffield passengers get dumped on.

Emt should know the entire route, as I said on an earlier post they must sign Newton-le-willows considering all EMT services are diverted around that way that weekend.
They do run that way at times (early morning ECS, late running, Bradway blockade etc), but those are 158 duties - are any of those drivers going to be doing HSTs too?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas6187 View Post
EMT would just use someone from Nottingham to route Conduct, just like when 222 are used on Liverpool runs
In which case (unless I'm missing something) they'd need HST staff (who know the line from Sheffield to London, Northern staff (who know the line through Chat Moss) and EMT staff (who know the Liverpool - Norwich bits of the line inc the chord at Dore) just to run one service?

So three sets of staff required at overtime rates (for a full shift) just to run one train?

Just something to bear in mind for those saying "why can't the railway simply run a diverted train for Liverpool fans" - nothing is ever "simple"...
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Unread 28th April 2012, 21:28   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbtc View Post
So three sets of staff required at overtime rates (for a full shift) just to run one train?
See post #35, if there's a will to do it, it can be done.
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Unread 28th April 2012, 21:34   #40
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Liverpool-Leicester worked by notts men who have hst and route knowledge, derby crew taking over at Leicester
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Unread 28th April 2012, 21:51   #41
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Most EMT crewe who sign through to Liverpool sign the Chat Moss route, as the early morning ECS is routed via Chat Moss
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Unread 28th April 2012, 22:42   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D1009 View Post
See post #35, if there's a will to do it, it can be done.
True, but its a lot more complicated than most people appreciate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by noddingdonkeys View Post
Liverpool-Leicester worked by notts men who have hst and route knowledge, derby crew taking over at Leicester
The train isn't scheduled to stop though (?)
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Unread 28th April 2012, 23:01   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcollins View Post
These two posts need to be read together and we need to remember two other things:
1. When the line via Warrington Central is closed, TPE divert via Newton-le-Willows while EMT always terminate short, which suggests EMT don't have route knowledge via Newton-le-Willows.
I signed Chat Moss last I looked...not all TPE crew who sign Liverpool do.

Anyway, if its a HST/Meridian, a Nottingham Regional Driver would route conduct a Derby Mainline Driver Liverpool to Sheffield and a Nottingham or Derby Regional Guard the same for the Derby or Sheffield Train Manager.

Then its normal London Working from there.
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Unread 28th April 2012, 23:14   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbtc View Post
True, but its a lot more complicated than most people appreciate.

The train isn't scheduled to stop though (?)
It does - http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/S40000/2012/5/5
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Unread 29th April 2012, 00:04   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D1009 View Post
See post #35, if there's a will to do it, it can be done.
Indeed. Also, people need to disabuse themselves of the idea that if a train makes a paper loss it will not run. Running this extra train is worth more than just the tickets sold to put Scouse bums on seats!
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