[Oswyntail]

It seems like the government policy has been to try to raise more tax with many relatively small changes rather than one big one, on the premise that adding VAT on optional items, such as pasties, would be more palatable to most than, say, raising income tax by 2%. After all, if putting VAT on a pasty makes a whopping hole in your finances, then you probably get it back from the NHS anyway. This does leave them open to multiple attacks, though, which is all the Opposition seem able to do, rather than suggest coherent alternatives.
Personally, i would rather have a government that were flexible enough to make changes in tactics within the chosen strategy (like this), rather than a completely inflexible monolith.

[Seacook]

Originally Posted by Mojo

I've sometimes had hot food at work - last night's dinner leftovers reheated, or a tin of soup from the supermarket (24p)!

How did you heat it? I have worked in offices where microwaves were made available, but such places are not universal.

Originally Posted by Mojo

In any case, with regards to eating out I couldn't answer that question as it depends on what your other expenses are and whether you're saving up for something and thus living on a budget. It's also nice to treat yourself sometimes; if you reward yourself with a luxury item of hot food from the local cafeteria every day, then what do you do on a day you actually deserve a treat?

Everyone lives on a budget. For some people, it is effectively unlimited; for most it is limited; for others it is extremely limited.

Fast food does not qualify as a luxury item and certainly not a treat in my book.

If you cannot know the extent of other people's income and expenses, then it is difficult to see how you can define the cost of a burger or a pasty as a luxury rather than everyday cost.

In my last job, there was a cafeteria on the premises but I took sandwiches and fruit for my lunch: not because I'm tight-fisted, but simply because the food on offer was less than appetising. I also made my own cups of tea, again because the cafeteria or machine varieties were unpalatable. For a treat, one of my group would buy some (expensive) cheese and we would share it. Now that was a luxury. Also, an error on the occasion we tried Stinking Bishop.

[Mojo]

Originally Posted by Seacook

If you cannot know the extent of other people's income and expenses, then it is difficult to see how you can define the cost of a burger or a pasty as a luxury rather than everyday cost.

Because it is possible to make a sandwich at home for less than the cost of a takeaway pasty. Eating is essential, but there are plenty of foods which one can get which cost less than an expensive takeaway. My objections are aimed at those who complain about a tax on an item they do not have to purchase, an item which many who are not well-off in society are unable to afford, and those who complain about how hard-up they are but make no effort to save money when it comes to buying everyday items such as food and drink.
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Originally Posted by Seacook

How did you heat it? I have worked in offices where microwaves were made available, but such places are not universal.

If you don't have a microwave to heat food, then don't eat hot food at lunch time.

[Yew]

Originally Posted by Mojo

Surely these ''hoi polloi'' cannot be that hard up if they can afford to eat out? The Daily Mirror website tells me the average pasty costs a whopping £1.49 with no VAT, is this correct?

I wouldnt really call a pasty 'eating out' its more the equivalent of a sandwich from tesco or something.

[Seacook]

Originally Posted by Mojo

Because it is possible to make a sandwich at home for less than the cost of a takeaway pasty. Eating is essential, but there are plenty of foods which one can get which cost less than an expensive takeaway.

It is possible to travel by bicycle or on foot for less than the cost of a car. Most people opt for the car because the costs are outweighed by the benefits. Going for the cheapest option is not always the wisest course. Let people make the choices that suit themselves best and do not expect them to be the same as yours.

[MattE2010]

I'm not a fan of Cameron or the modern Tory Party, however it seems to me like the man can do no right. With regard to the Leeds station incident, if he's been all over the country, has as much personal interest in railways as any other non-enthusiasts, and is a very busy man, can't he be forgiven for the error? I mean, he could well have done, but maybe it just wasn't Leeds, or maybe it was another chain, why do we assume he was lying? We seem to expect MPs to be immaculate and 100% correct all the time, yet when they do slip up or get something so trivial wrong, we pounce on them like they've made a catastrophic error. The same with Gordon brown, when he wrote that letter to the woman whose son had been killed on duty in Iraq, and he spelt her name wrong or similar, and he got torn a new one over it - he's only human, why can't people realise mistakes happen?

[Ivo]

I for one won't complain about this change - if only to stop being hampered by activists every time I enter a bakery!

Anyway, the tax idea was rather shortsighted, I have to agree - but it was an at least relatively sensible thing to do. Would people have complained to a similar degree had Labour attempted it?

I doubt it.

Originally Posted by MattE2010

I'm not a fan of Cameron or the modern Tory Party

You're not a fan of any "major" Party (more like second-rate ) though...

[Seacook]

Originally Posted by Mojo

If you don't have a microwave to heat food, then don't eat hot food at lunch time.

Or, alternatively, if you don't have a microwave to heat food and you are too short of money or are too miserly to pay the market price, then don't eat hot food at lunch time.

[SS4]

Originally Posted by Ivo

Anyway, the tax idea was rather shortsighted, I have to agree - but it was an at least relatively sensible thing to do. Would people have complained to a similar degree had Labour attempted it?

I doubt it.

I reckon they would have done. Brown could do no right in the eyes of the press, especially when circumstances beyond his control intervened. Blair may have got away with it but really the Iraq war destroyed the credibility of New "Labour"

also sausage rolls are delicious although greggs' ones are too greasy for me

edit: not for nothing were the press referring to labour as the tax party since their ideas largely revolved around charging more tax.

I'm certainly glad the tax has been repealed, many people are feeling the pinch these days and it will be reflected in food. Where before they may have got a meal deal for £3/4 they're now getting a pasty for £1.

[WelshBluebird]

Thank god they have seen sense.
Did they really expect greggs to check the temperature of each pasty as it is sold and charge a price that differs depending on the temperature? The initial idea was totally stupid and unworkable.

[jonmorris0844]

Originally Posted by 142094

I'm sure we could reduce MPs expenses by £75m a year and they wouldn't notice it.

How? The expenses are whatever are incurred, as long as they are legal.

Are you suggesting they don't get paid legitimate expenses? Imagine your employer refusing to pay your expenses so you're out of pocket.

[SteveP29]

Originally Posted by SS4

The opposition don't care about the country less than making the current government look bad; the same is true of all parties

Why should the opposition give details of what policies they'd implement?
The government would more than likely hijack them and use them for their own popularity.
The only time the opposition should state their policy is in their manifesto before a general or local elections
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Originally Posted by tbtc

If I run a hot food service I'd probably be annoyed that a rival business is able to undercut my prices by around 20%.

The undercut is actually only 16.6%
Apologies for being pedantic.
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Originally Posted by MattE2010

why do we assume he was lying? We seem to expect MPs to be immaculate and 100% correct all the time, yet when they do slip up or get something so trivial wrong, we pounce on them like they've made a catastrophic error. The same with Gordon brown, when he wrote that letter to the woman whose son had been killed on duty in Iraq, and he spelt her name wrong or similar, and he got torn a new one over it - he's only human, why can't people realise mistakes happen?

Because for the most part, polititians will say and do just about anything that makes them look popular (or believe that they are popular, remember W. Hague's baseball cap and god knows how many pints every night episodes)

If Camoron saw an opportunity to be popularist by saying that he ate pasties etc, he would take it, regardless of the outcome.
Do you think Gideon knows what the inside of a Greggs even looks like, never mind actually bought a pasty in there?

[Schnellzug]

Originally Posted by MattE2010

I'm not a fan of Cameron or the modern Tory Party, however it seems to me like the man can do no right. With regard to the Leeds station incident, if he's been all over the country, has as much personal interest in railways as any other non-enthusiasts, and is a very busy man, can't he be forgiven for the error? ?

Maybe he's angling as Portillo's replacement for the next season of GRJ, after the next election (or even before it, perhaps ... )

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If we're now talking, incidentally, about what it or isn't essential or a Luxury, based on how expensive it is, then heavens, rail travel must be the ultimate luxury, and so ought to be, by this
reasoning, taxed to the maximum, surely .....

And is buying a Pasty or a sandwich really "eating out", as if it's a three course dinner with a nice bottle of Chablis at Gordon Ramsey's place? Do people expect everyone to take little packed lunches in little plastic sandwich boxes whenever they set out on any journey, since it's such an extravagant luxury to buy a sandwich, sausage roll or bacon Bap?

[HST Power]

Originally Posted by SS4

If I were a cynic I'd suggest that it was to deflect attention from bigger tax loopholes going unclosed for various reasons. After all we know the Trade Union movement provides funding to Labour but who funds the Conservatives?

We have donor clubs, mainly Party Patrons and Team 2 Thousand. I had a letter from my club last week which said in massive bold letters 'We rely on your donations, the Unions fund Labour!'

[GB]

Originally Posted by jonmorris0844

How? The expenses are whatever are incurred, as long as they are legal.

Are you suggesting they don't get paid legitimate expenses? Imagine your employer refusing to pay your expenses so you're out of pocket.

Well it didn't work like that a couple of years ago.