Other Line Reopenings

Last Year the Line from Scunthorpe and from Hull was breached nr Hatfield that kept the biggest and busiest frieght route in the uk closed for most of the year.
However. Around Crowle (Nr Scunthorpe). Is a line called Axholme Joint.
It Ran from Haxey junction to Goole.
Now the Irony is most of the trackbed is intact bar the odd building.
The only two obstacles would be Bridges over tge Motorway and A18 .
Point is if it was reopened even as far as Crowle with a two Chords one linking East the other West.
The much needed avoiding route would be there.
The A161 and villages are chocked with countless lorries. If the rail was there these isolated places would over subscribe the railway very quickly.
Haxey junction takes you to doncaster and Lincoln.
And the line I mentioned would provide a path to remove more frieght of the Ecml.
Plus Scunthorpe would have a more Direct route to Lincoln and Beyond.
Northbound to Goole the track bed us almost clear and indeed a short length if double track can be found on the moor.
Weather that section is viable as a north south route from Lincoln to goole and onto to Hull or York might be very useful.
Does anyone else have any less well known lines they'd like to see restored

Is there a need (or will be in the forseeable future) for this line? If the only thing going for it is to avoid a repeat of the 'mishap' at Hatfield, then much like the 'Dawlish Avoiding Line' it will be unlikely. Indeed Hatfield is not likely to happen again possibly ever, whereas at some point in the future, the sea-wall at Dawlish WILL be breached again.

It would free the ECML from some freight, but the main obstacles you mention in the form of bridges would push the cost up a fair bit. In any case, post HS2 paths might not be at such a premium on the ECML south of the Selby area. If there was a rapid rise in freight traffic to/from East coast ports to/from the North West and Scotland things might look different.

As a reopening would it offer any great benefits from a passenger perspective?
Looking on Google maps, I can't see anywhere of significant population, and the line doesn't really offer anything for regional services either as it avoids the population centres of South Yorkshire. Leeds-Grimsby might be an option but I can't see the demand (or the rolling stock!) for it, at least not to push it ahead of other improvements elsewhere.

As for other reopenings, the Horbury curve would be one I'd welcome, but I can't see it happening for at least the next 10 years.

61653 HTAFC said:

Is there a need (or will be in the forseeable future) for this line? If the only thing going for it is to avoid a repeat of the 'mishap' at Hatfield, then much like the 'Dawlish Avoiding Line' it will be unlikely. Indeed Hatfield is not likely to happen again possibly ever, whereas at some point in the future, the sea-wall at Dawlish WILL be breached again.

It would free the ECML from some freight, but the main obstacles you mention in the form of bridges would push the cost up a fair bit. In any case, post HS2 paths might not be at such a premium on the ECML south of the Selby area. If there was a rapid rise in freight traffic to/from East coast ports to/from the North West and Scotland things might look different.

As a reopening would it offer any great benefits from a passenger perspective?
Looking on Google maps, I can't see anywhere of significant population, and the line doesn't really offer anything for regional services either as it avoids the population centres of South Yorkshire. Leeds-Grimsby might be an option but I can't see the demand (or the rolling stock!) for it, at least not to push it ahead of other improvements elsewhere.

As for other reopenings, the Horbury curve would be one I'd welcome, but I can't see it happening for at least the next 10 years.

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It's only enough been looked at by local councils. Indeed and fairly reliably the local channels (offical), Said they had genuinely been talking with Network rail
And other parties to see if it could be done.
Through Crowle there are two houses on the track bed and an extension on the old railway station which with part of the platform is still there.
Further along the new estate built their gardens in places over the trackbed.
This not approved by Council either.
As for would it be used and smaller population. Collectively it isn't .
Between all the villages and peripheral ones it could and would serve there is an immense need for public transport.
A questionnaire found almost unanimous support for it. As all the Isle as its known is along the line and jammed with enough collective population to meet the golden rule.
The old line carried local frieght and would again be well used.
Most stations are still there with platforms as well.
And oddly recently Surveyors allegedly Network rail where seen spray painting and surveying the remains of a bridge in Epworth.

*As a side not on my long (forgive me), post.
Thorne moor reserve had an extensive peat railway. We have found a loco and rolling stock. And with various official bodies involved we now have a fledgling
Heritage railway starting. With the hope of maybe reconnecting as far back as Crowle onto the moor. And some for of stations and visitor centre , for which. They really need help - volunteers and ideally some experienced heritage rail people to help save this veey unique bit of local and regional history.

onyxcrowle said:

Further along the new estate built their gardens in places over the trackbed.
This not approved by Council either.

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Sadly, if they've been there for more than 12 years it's theirs to keep (under the laws of adverse possession)

We need someone (who!) to police encroachment onto disused trackbeds.

34D said:

Sadly, if they've been there for more than 12 years it's theirs to keep (under the laws of adverse possession)

We need someone (who!) to police encroachment onto disused trackbeds.

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nearly, but not quite correct. I am assuming the land to be unregistered: http://www.landregistry.gov.uk/professional/guides/practice-guide-5

It is up to the rightful owner to police access and remove any "squatters", just as it is with any land.

DarloRich said:

nearly, but not quite correct. I am assuming the land to be unregistered: http://www.landregistry.gov.uk/professional/guides/practice-guide-5

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As am i.

DarloRich said:

It is up to the rightful owner to police access and remove any "squatters", just as it is with any land.

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Well no. Once someone has fenced off the land for 12 years they apply for title - at that point it becomes theirs.

Certainly though, during the 12 year period, the legal owner (who? BRB Residual/Highways Agency, a local council, etc etc) can dispossess them.

onyxcrowle said:

Last Year the Line from Scunthorpe and from Hull was breached nr Hatfield that kept the biggest and busiest frieght route in the uk closed for most of the year.

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Slight exaggeration there surely?

Kings Lynn to Swaffham line should reopen, most of the track bed is still there, with part of the line to Middleton Towers still in place and used daily for freight

The only obstacles I can think of is someone owns the former station the next stop on from Middleton Towers, a crossing over the A47 needs looking at and the bridge at Narbororough

Maybe the entrance and location in Swaffham needs looking at dont think the station can be at the original site though
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Cambridge to Mildenhall also can be looked at, scan most of the track bed is still in place

King's Lynn to Swaffham seems a bit pointless by itself - from my experience, all of the traffic is on the A47 for Norwich. There's not really an obvious rail alternative though, unless you want to go to Dereham and then down the Mid-Norfolk to Wymondham and then back up to Norwich, which makes it a 60 mile trip instead of 40.

Anyone got any thoughts on this? (Other than "No, not going to happen".)

Tobbes said:

King's Lynn to Swaffham seems a bit pointless by itself - from my experience, all of the traffic is on the A47 for Norwich. There's not really an obvious rail alternative though, unless you want to go to Dereham and then down the Mid-Norfolk to Wymondham and then back up to Norwich, which makes it a 60 mile trip instead of 40.

Anyone got any thoughts on this? (Other than "No, not going to happen".)

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Agreed it would never happen, however Swaffhams population is high and the fact that the X1 bus does a good trade between the towns means that there is a good chance it would pay for itself, I believe the X1 currently runs half hourly between the towns

Not forgetting Narborough on route also, although population isn't that of Swaffhams more like that of Watlington or Manea but would still do well none the less

One of the big challenges would be getting people change habits like leave the car at home and secondly choosing Kings Lynn rather than Norwich

onyxcrowle said:

It's only enough been looked at by local councils. Indeed and fairly reliably the local channels (offical), Said they had genuinely been talking with Network rail
And other parties to see if it could be done.

What?

Through Crowle there are two houses on the track bed and an extension on the old railway station which with part of the platform is still there.
Further along the new estate built their gardens in places over the trackbed.
This not approved by Council either.
As for would it be used and smaller population. Collectively it isn't .
Between all the villages and peripheral ones it could and would serve there is an immense need for public transport.

Immense?

A questionnaire found almost unanimous support for it.

Ah yes, a questionnaire! Everybody says they would use something - and then, when it's provided, they decide they'd rather stick with the car.

As all the Isle as its known is along the line and jammed with enough collective population to meet the golden rule.

And which 'Golden Rule' would that be then?

The old line carried local frieght and would again be well used.

By local freight? Please .....

Most stations are still there with platforms as well.

And probably failing all relevant modern health & safety requirements.

And oddly recently Surveyors allegedly Network rail where seen spray painting and surveying the remains of a bridge in Epworth.

Oh well, that's ok then ....

*As a side not on my long (forgive me), post.
Thorne moor reserve had an extensive peat railway. We have found a loco and rolling stock. And with various official bodies involved we now have a fledgling
Heritage railway starting. With the hope of maybe reconnecting as far back as Crowle onto the moor. And some for of stations and visitor centre , for which. They really need help - volunteers and ideally some experienced heritage rail people to help save this veey unique bit of local and regional history.

Click to expand...

Where to begin ????

See notes above in red.

34D said:

As am i.



Well no. Once someone has fenced off the land for 12 years they apply for title - at that point it becomes theirs.

Certainly though, during the 12 year period, the legal owner (who? BRB Residual/Highways Agency, a local council, etc etc) can dispossess them.

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Just been reading this on gov.uk

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/brb-residuary-ltd-has-been-abolished

BRB (Residuary) Ltd has been abolished

Organisation:
BRB (Residuary) Ltd
Page history:Published 30 September 2013 Policyxpanding and improving the rail networkTopic:Transport . ..

The organisations that have taken on BRBR’s functions and responsibilities.

BRB (Residuary) Ltd (BRBR) has been abolished with effect from 30 September 2013. It had been announced on 14 October 2010 that BRBR would be abolished following the Cabinet Office’s Public bodies review.

BRBR’s continuing functions have been dispersed to various successor bodies. The functions for which each successor body is now responsible, and their contact details are:

Highways Agency Historical Railways Estate

The Highways Agency Historical Railways Estate is now responsible for the historical railways estate (formerly known as the Burdensome Estate). This includes legacy bridges, abutments, tunnels, cuttings, viaducts and similar properties associated with closed railway lines, and sales.

Highways Agency Historical Railways Estate
Hudson House
Toft Green
York, YO1 6HP

Tel: 01904 524786
Email: [email protected]

London & Continental Railways Ltd

London & Continental Railways Ltd (LCR) is now responsible for former BRBR properties with development potential, or which might be used for future railway projects, office buildings (The Axis, Birmingham; The Railway Technical Centre, Derby; Piccadilly Gate, Manchester). LCR is also acting as the managing agent on behalf of DfT for Waterloo International Terminal, North Pole International Depot and Temple Mills Bus Depot.

London & Continental Railways
4th Floor
1 Kemble Street
London, WC2B 4AN

Email: [email protected]

Network Rail

Network Rail is now responsible for a small number of properties closely associated with the operational railway that should have transferred during railway privatisation or which should be maintained by the owner of the operational railway, various memorials commemorating those killed in railway accidents or rail employees killed during the world wars, and Old Dalby test track in Leicestershire and Nottinghamshire.

The full list of properties transferred to Network Rail is given in a schedule attached to the Statutory Instrument that abolished BRBR .
•Network Rail’s contacts

Rail Safety and Standards Board

The Rail Safety and Standards Board (RSSB) is now the owner and holder of the intellectual property rights of the ‘RDDS managed documentation’ (consisting of drawings and maintenance documents and reports, generally relating to rolling stock built before 1996).

Rail Safety and Standards Board
Block 2
Angel Square
1 Torrens Street
London, EC1V 1NY

Tel: 020 3142 5400
Email: [email protected]

Department for Transport

The Department for Transport (DfT) is now responsible for ill health claims from former British Rail (BR) employees.

General Counsel’s Office
Department for Transport
Great Minster House
33 Horseferry Road
London, SW1P 4DR

Tel: 0300 330 3000
Email: [email protected] or [email protected]

If it is unclear to which successor body an enquiry should be directed, or if the enquiry is about BR staff records, the DfT public enquiry helpline will be able to provide assistance and guidance: 0300 330 3000.
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onyxcrowle said:

And oddly recently Surveyors allegedly Network rail where seen spray painting and surveying the remains of a bridge in Epworth.

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Probably contractors rather than NR themselves who signed a contract with NR to carry out various jobs in the wider area five years ago, bear in mind a tender is normally put out at least (on average) two years before its awarded so make that 7 years, rather than the contractors risk being sued for not carrying out the work they agreed to they just complete it whether its pointless or not

Round here in Cambridgeshire they was still painting the fence on the crossing of the A47 on the Bramley line until about 6 years ago that's many years after the last train passed