[fgwrich]

I presume the GOBLIN Still isnt justifying elecftrication then?

Railway Gazette‏@railwaygazette

TfL seeks expressions of interest in the supply of 8 x 3 or 4-car diesel trains for London Overground's Gospel Oak-Barking line from 2013

(From the railway gazettes twitter feed)

I wonder if these to supplement or replace the 172's then?

[anthony263]

From what I heard they wanted a centre carriage for the current London Overground class 172's together with perhaps some additional units to provide extra capacity.

[Failed Unit]

Originally Posted by anthony263

From what I heard they wanted a centre carriage for the current London Overground class 172's together with perhaps some additional units to provide extra capacity.

Surely on one supplier can do this? Would be shocked if a whole new train is cheaper than adding coaches to an existing one.

[anthony263]

Nothing to stop TFL ordering a complete new fleet of new dmu's from another train builder although I do agree that would be unlikely.

[ainsworth74]

Originally Posted by Failed Unit

Surely on one supplier can do this? Would be shocked if a whole new train is cheaper than adding coaches to an existing one.

You would think so wouldn't you? I would guess this will end up the same way as the Southern 377 deal did. Written in such a way that only one company can actually win a tender to supply the vehicles/units.

[HSTEd]

They could be planning to buy a new fleet of TfL specific (ie Cl378 style interior) DMUs and then cascade the Cl172s to whoever.

[jopsuk]

or get intermediate 172 carriages to the same spec as a relatively short term stop gap measure as electrification seems to be well beyoond when they'd like to go to three/four car operation. Perhaps once GOBLIN is electrified Chiltern might be interested in additional longer units...

[jcollins]

Just a thought it might be 8 x 4 car units but what if it's actually 16 centre carriages for LO with 8 x 2 car 172s for LM? With the LO units not having toilets that may be more logical than building new longer trains for LO and cascading the existing trains to LM.

[317666]

As I understand it, the reason that the London Overground Class 172s have 2+2 seating rather than longitudinal is so that one day they can be cascaded without having to have the internal layout changed to make them more suitable. It's possible that the new DMUs TfL are after may have a 378-style, longitudinal seated interior.

[jcollins]

Originally Posted by 317666

As I understand it, the reason that the London Overground Class 172s have 2+2 seating rather than longitudinal is so that one day they can be cascaded without having to have the internal layout changed to make them more suitable.

Seems strange they made them toilet less then as generally DMUs aren't used on frequent metro style services so it will be difficult to find them an alternative route without fitting toilets or permanently attaching them to other 172s with toilets - maybe even splitting them up in a similar way to how the 150/2s were split and used as centre carriages.

[fgwrich]

Originally Posted by jcollins

Seems strange they made them toilet less then as generally DMUs aren't used on frequent metro style services so it will be difficult to find them an alternative route without fitting toilets or permanently attaching them to other 172s with toilets - maybe even splitting them up in a similar way to how the 150/2s were split and used as centre carriages.

True, although as were seeing with Scotrails 320s that fitting a new Toilet Module, although probably not the easiest is possible.

And as LOROL is part operated by Chiltern / DB, perhaps thats why Chiltern only ordered 4 units - with future cascades of ex London Overground units in mind?

[Failed Unit]

Do the LOROL 172s have corridor connections?

[RPM]

Originally Posted by Failed Unit

Do the LOROL 172s have corridor connections?

Only within each unit. Not between units.

[ainsworth74]

Originally Posted by Failed Unit

Do the LOROL 172s have corridor connections?

No, though Bombardier are supposed to have said that it would be a very simple job to fit them (basically send them to Derby cut the current front off and fit a new one).

[John55]

The actual wording of the TfL notice on the Government Online website issued on 16/05/12 is;

TfL is seeking expressions of interest for the following Supplies and/or Services.
a) Provision of approximately eight 3-car DMUs suitable for operation on the Gospel Oak -Barking railway, without associated train-maintenance services
b) Provision of approximately eight 3-car DMUs suitable for operation on the Gospel Oak -Barking railway, with associated train-maintenance services
TfL may consider 4-car DMUs in lieu of 3-car, but does not envisage a fleet of mixed train length.
TfL has an aspiration to introduce longer trains from 2013.
This notice is for information and to help TfL gauge market interest.