[maniacmartin]

Hi,

A friend of mine has his 16-25 railcard loaded onto his Oyster card to reduce the daily cap. He was travelling PAYG on the DLR and a Serco employee did a ticket check. After swiping his card, they asked to see his 16-25 Railcard.

Whenever I have had a ticket check on the DLR, I've never been asked to produce the 16-25 Railcard linked with my Oyster

Is there a requirement to carry your railcard when making Oyster PAYG journeys with a connected Oyster card?

[SS4]

Yes there is.

Normal railcard conditions apply (i.e. no railcard = no ticket)

edit: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tickets/18343.aspx

Click on the "How do I use it" tab and it mentions it (twice)

[MikeWh]

Originally Posted by maniacmartin

Hi,

A friend of mine has his 16-25 railcard loaded onto his Oyster card to reduce the daily cap. He was travelling PAYG on the DLR and a Serco employee did a ticket check. After swiping his card, they asked to see his 16-25 Railcard.

Whenever I have had a ticket check on the DLR, I've never been asked to produce the 16-25 Railcard linked with my Oyster

Is there a requirement to carry your railcard when making Oyster PAYG journeys with a connected Oyster card?

Yes there is. The only thing that a railcard discounted Oyster card is valid on without the railcard is buses and trams. You could probably get away with it between 0630 and 0930 on the basis that it isn't giving you any advantage, but outside those times you are either getting cheap fares or a cheap cap, or both.

[calc7]

What is the policy if you are unable to produce the railcard on such a check (but, if it makes a difference, the staff do not suspect fare evasion)?

I rarely carry my railcard on a daily basis, and certainly wouldn't if I were going on a night out. If "caught" is one able to produce it at a later date (as they capture the details when applying the discount, it should be verifiable that person with card = person with railcard)?

[SS4]

You'd not be travelling with a valid ticket as per the Railcard T&Cs. You'd get PFed or UPFN I suspect

[yorkie]

Originally Posted by calc7

What is the policy if you are unable to produce the railcard on such a check (but, if it makes a difference, the staff do not suspect fare evasion)?

In this case, in a Penalty Fare area, then a Penalty Fare would be applicable.

Elsewhere, a new single ticket would be payable.

Discretion can be shown of course.

Originally Posted by SS4

...or UPFN I suspect

If the customer is unable to pay the fare, it is possible a UFN may be issued (e.g. if travelling with East Coast), but be aware that some TOCs (e.g. FCC) would go straight for prosecution, as we have seen several times recently (and most recently only a couple of days ago!)

[causton]

Just note that I got checked on a bus once and they did check for my photocard! So you're not even safe on the buses!

[calc7]

Wow, I'm gonna carry my railcard all the time now!

[MikeWh]

Originally Posted by causton

Just note that I got checked on a bus once and they did check for my photocard! So you're not even safe on the buses!

Interesting. I guess if you've capped at a travelcard rate then technically you would need the railcard, but if only using buses for the day you would cap at the bus cap and should have no need for a railcard. I can see how it isn't obvious that a railcard would be required just to ride on red buses. I might have to pose that question to my contacts at TfL.

[34D]

Originally Posted by calc7

Wow, I'm gonna carry my railcard all the time now!

I am surprised by this. Had I been eligible for a railcard on my oyster I would have assumed that the discount being loaded was all that was required.

[lyesbkz]

Originally Posted by causton

Just note that I got checked on a bus once and they did check for my photocard! So you're not even safe on the buses!

Assuming it wasn't a rail replacement service, I'm surprised of the bus driver's knowledge regarding the railcard / need for a photocard.

Originally Posted by 34D

I am surprised by this. Had I been eligible for a railcard on my oyster I would have assumed that the discount being loaded was all that was required.

And I am equally surprised by this! Since Oyster is the equivalent to your ticket it seems obvious to me that, should you be making use of a railcard discount, you would need to be carrying your railcard too!

[34D]

Originally Posted by lyesbkz

Assuming it wasn't a rail replacement service, I'm surprised of the bus driver's knowledge regarding the railcard / need for a photocard.

I'm guessing this is TfL revenue rather than the driver?

[Brucey]

Originally Posted by 34D

I am surprised by this. Had I been eligible for a railcard on my oyster I would have assumed that the discount being loaded was all that was required (on the basis that it _is_ the discount card).

Same as when you buy a paper ticket, you still need the railcard to prove you are eligible for the discount.

[RJ]

Originally Posted by lyesbkz

Assuming it wasn't a rail replacement service, I'm surprised of the bus driver's knowledge regarding the railcard / need for a photocard.



And I am equally surprised by this! Since Oyster is the equivalent to your ticket it seems obvious to me that, should you be making use of a railcard discount, you would need to be carrying your railcard too!

You'd be surprised what knowledge some London bus drivers have. I've seen lone Groupsave and Railcard discounted paper Travelcard holders challenged on buses

As for the Oystercard, the photocard is still required. Those inspectors on the buses are on almost 40k and are very proficient in ensuring there are no irregularities.

[calc7]

I do find it slightly uncouth that there is no retrospective procedure whereby a genuine passenger can provide a railcard (and ID if necessary) to prove their innocence.