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Old 11th January 2017, 12:37   #871
notverydeep
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There was an interesting display of the superior performance of the class 387s this morning. I noted 3 x 387 on 1P49 0733 Peterborough to London Kings Cross arrive at Finsbury Park a whole 4 minutes early into the up fast platform as my train left from platform 2.

According to Real Time Train this was from an on time start at Stevenage. The train was then held a whole 5 minutes to the correct departure time. I bet that annoyed the passengers, especially if they were standing! Wouldn't they be great trains if only they could match the seating configuration of a 365...?
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Old 11th January 2017, 13:57   #872
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Originally Posted by notverydeep View Post
There was an interesting display of the superior performance of the class 387s this morning. I noted 3 x 387 on 1P49 0733 Peterborough to London Kings Cross arrive at Finsbury Park a whole 4 minutes early into the up fast platform as my train left from platform 2.

According to Real Time Train this was from an on time start at Stevenage. The train was then held a whole 5 minutes to the correct departure time. I bet that annoyed the passengers, especially if they were standing! Wouldn't they be great trains if only they could match the seating configuration of a 365...?
Yes stick a 365 style seating layout, get rid of the ironing boards, and move the first class to the 365 position, and they'd be good as gold.

Having said that, I've been doing some measuring with GPS, and I can't see much performance difference between 365 and 387. Your train might just have had a clear run - 365s can just as easily run early if the signals are favourable, it only takes something else to be cancelled or otherwise not in the way.
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Old 11th January 2017, 14:03   #873
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Trust me, it's no great loss. They're a pain in the backside - metaphorically and literally.
I shall reserve judgment on the Class 387 seats for now, but for one thing I'll be glad to see the back of the bulky, cumbersome and awkward Class 317/321 seats.
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Old 11th January 2017, 15:34   #874
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When it does the East Coast to Cross Country and Grand Central to Great Western stuff, the following 'coach n of n' bit is about twice the volume.

I assumed the trains had noise sensors and adjusted accordingly, so I wonder if the sound files are themselves at different sound levels?

It's a total mess.
It is also a total embarasment - but shows the contempt GTR show to thier passengers! This should have got fixed by now - surely it is against the disable discrimination act? How is a blind person supposed to know if they are in the correct portion of the train.

Does the 1822 also do this? I know the 1722 does. I assume that it on all splitting trains. But this should have got reprogrammed / fixed by now or turned off as this is actually as bad as having no information at all.
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There will be quite a few 387s working towards London in the high morning peak, which is not going to please people who get a seat currently. On a more positive note a couple of 387 services will be going to 365, so a partial result for people who use those particular services. Still nothing north of Cambridge, I expect more big changes in the May timetable change when things will no doubt shuffle around again.

For those who wish to avoid the 387s, this is what I make to be the list of services off KX that will be 387s. This doesn't include Royston peak fasts, any non-stop Cambridges, fast Peterboroughs, or stuff terminating at Welwyn. Everything else will be 365s, unless any 317s or 321s hang on covering unavailable 365s/387s. A source tells me 2x321s are currently remaining on lease or hire covering for unavailable 365s, until further notice.

1x387
0604, 0652, 0704, 0734, 0904, 0934, 1004, 1204, 1234, 1334, 1404, 1504, 1534, 1653, 1918, 2004, 2034, 2104, 2204, 2252, 2304 (Mon to Thurs only), 2334 (Fridays only).

2x387 or 3x387
0834, 0952, 1552, 1650, 1713, 1722, 1743, 1752, 1822, 1823, 1852, 2022, 2122, 2322.
They are getting hard to avoid now

Be interesting what WGC shorts will convert.

for completeness the 1658 already is and should stay so as it forms half of the 1822, 1728 is a 365, 1758 is 2x 317s (so it may convert), I think most of the ones after this are 313s.

Last edited by Failed Unit; 11th January 2017 at 15:34. Reason: Double post prevention system
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Old 11th January 2017, 19:33   #875
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They've fixed it... I'm aboard 387119 on 2C32 1822 King's Cross to Cambridge and the coaches Grand Central to East Coast oddity has been fixed and the announcement has the correct numbers. I presume the update will have been rolled out across the fleet.
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Old 11th January 2017, 19:38   #876
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They've fixed it... I'm aboard 387119 on 2C32 1822 King's Cross to Cambridge and the coaches Grand Central to East Coast oddity has been fixed and the announcement has the correct numbers. I presume the update will have been rolled out across the fleet.
The 1722 was in full waffle yesterday so but I guess the end is in sight.
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Old 11th January 2017, 20:02   #877
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Originally Posted by notverydeep View Post
There was an interesting display of the superior performance of the class 387s this morning. I noted 3 x 387 on 1P49 0733 Peterborough to London Kings Cross arrive at Finsbury Park a whole 4 minutes early into the up fast platform as my train left from platform 2.

According to Real Time Train this was from an on time start at Stevenage. The train was then held a whole 5 minutes to the correct departure time. I bet that annoyed the passengers, especially if they were standing! Wouldn't they be great trains if only they could match the seating configuration of a 365...?
Impressive, but looks like it was aided to the tune of at least 1 minute by calling in the Up Fast platform, not the Up Slow (to avoid conflict with a late running stopper from Welwyn), thus getting a faster run into the station by avoidimg the slow speed crossover and approach control (which will be factored imto the planned runnimg time).

Plus there's a bit of performance and engineering allowance on the run in too.
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Old 11th January 2017, 22:26   #878
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Yes stick a 365 style seating layout, get rid of the ironing boards, and move the first class to the 365 position, and they'd be good as gold.
A smiley face on the front would be good too

I've been on three 387s recently. Ironing board seats are absolutely awful and ride quality not good.

About the only positive they have over the 365s is they have carpet although the 365s had theirs removed in favour of vinyl as part of the downgrade to get us ready for the 700s.
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Old 12th January 2017, 10:49   #879
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The commuters of Hertfordshire are revolting. Well, they are on 2C93 (the 0727 Cambridge - King's Cross) 387108 + 387129 - on departure from Welwyn Garden City at 08:25, all the seats in the rear unit's first class section and thus the last coach of the train, were taken.

I would hazard a guess not by first class ticket holders. IMO, when you see people prepared to break the rules to this degree, you begin to suspect that they think the operator is taking the p**s...

A noticeable up tick in overheard complaints about the lack of seats, now that most are back to work.

Last edited by notverydeep; 12th January 2017 at 10:50.
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Old 12th January 2017, 10:59   #880
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Originally Posted by notverydeep View Post
The commuters of Hertfordshire are revolting. Well, they are on 2C93 (the 0727 Cambridge - King's Cross) 387108 + 387129 - on departure from Welwyn Garden City at 08:25, all the seats in the rear unit's first class section and thus the last coach of the train, were taken.

I would hazard a guess not by first class ticket holders. IMO, when you see people prepared to break the rules to this degree, you begin to suspect that they think the operator is taking the p**s...

A noticeable up tick in overheard complaints about the lack of seats, now that most are back to work.
It was the same yesterday, with the same things that we have discussed on this thread many times.

On the platform people were saying asking each other where 1st class was going to be, "nobody knows". When 1st class turned up at the rear some tried to move forward but saw the next coach was full and moved back. The general view was **** em - we will sit down. Heard many people state "this isn't really first class anyway" and "why can't it be in the same place"

I guess we should all move foward, increase the dwell time and wreck the PMM even further.

Saying that I have noticed the time keeping drastically improve since the 387s have appeared, but the leaves have gone as well...

Even if people don't sit down, I wouldn't want to be an RPI who tries to penalty fare people standing in first. They will get a lot of "where else am I supposed to stand" and "well if we knew where first class was going to be we would have stood somewhere else". I have a feeling they won't bother.
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Old 12th January 2017, 11:08   #881
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How could they issue penalty fares anyway when some muppet is putting the 1st class sticker on the wrong door?





And there are still no clear signs inside the vestibule. Signs that would be recognised by people throughout the world (in other words, not a poster with text that some people might not fully understand).

Apologies for calling someone a muppet, as that's a bit rude, but I couldn't really find a more polite way to say it!
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Old 12th January 2017, 11:18   #882
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You will probably find this sticker is from the thameslink days where they thought it was sensible to have the first call directly behind the drivers cabs (something we still want now they are with Great Northern)

However someone was paid to.
1. Remove the Thameslink branding.
2. Brand the train Great Northern.
3. Paint a yellow stripe.

So why they could add into this contract, remove existing 1st labels as part of the above show the shocking incompetance and lack of customer focus of GTR management.

I remember when they took over first capital connect, they removed all evidence of "first" including stickers for first class on the 365s.

But as it stands I can see how someone will think that entire coach is first class (until they board)

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Old 12th January 2017, 13:48   #883
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I did laugh when seeing the doors to first class with a blue band saying 'class' on the right hand door and the 'first' on the left having been removed.

Oh, and when FCC did the same having used black pen to cross out all references to Thameslink. So we ended up with route maps saying 'City' and 'King's Cross'...

Edit: I think to add to an earlier comment, I am on the 1235 KGX to PBO and despite a bit of wheelspin leaving stations, I can say that we've been early at every station so far (just left Potters Bar) and have ended up waiting. So if there's one good thing, it should be timekeeping.

The 365s would be slipping all over the place and I am sure that we'd have been a minute or two down by now.

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Old 12th January 2017, 15:06   #884
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I imagine that the WSP technology will have been improved further, as the system would have been very young when first installed on the Networkers.
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Old 12th January 2017, 15:21   #885
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I imagine that the WSP technology will have been improved further, as the system would have been very young when first installed on the Networkers.
It works well. Well as a passenger I think it does. Drivers may have different opinions!

Seems the train did lose a minute but made it back. http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/trai...01/12/advanced

The 387s are just fine for midday travel, having a nice big table to yourself and a power socket to charge your laptop. If only they were as good when busy!
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