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Old 5th March 2017, 22:48   #1
snail
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Default Ticket rejected at Salford Central barriers

I often travel to Salford Central via Wigan (North Western > Wallgate) on a Manchester Stns ticket. I can get through the new barriers at Wigan Wallgate no problem but when I get to Salford Central my ticket is rejected as "seek assistance".

Is this normal behaviour after transferring via an intermediate station? When I have a bit more time I'm thinking of trying Victoria or Oxford Rd to see if it happens there too.
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Old 5th March 2017, 23:23   #2
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Considering Salford is a separate city, is it included in the "Manchester Stations" group?
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Old 5th March 2017, 23:31   #3
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It happens at Salford Crescent as well with tickets to Bolton, Walkden or Salford Central. The Oxford Road ones are dodgy too, rejecting only last week a Liverpool to Manchester advance as 'not valid at this location', and will incorrectly reject B1 Off Peak tickets at will in the afternoon peak period. The person who programmed them did an absolute crap job.
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Old 5th March 2017, 23:54   #4
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Yes, quite normal to get a message accusing you of illegal behaviour when trying to use a ticket barrier.
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Old 6th March 2017, 00:03   #5
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Originally Posted by sheff1 View Post
Yes, quite normal to get a message accusing you of illegal behaviour when trying to use a ticket barrier.
Presumably though they quite deliberately show as a code rather than text, so the staff won't claim you are doing something illegal when you actually aren't?
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Old 6th March 2017, 00:20   #6
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Presumably though they quite deliberately show as a code rather than text, so the staff won't claim you are doing something illegal when you actually aren't?
No, as JakeF stated, the text of the message displayed is "not valid at this location". This is clearly stating that you are trying to use an invalid ticket and, as is frequently pointed out on here, using or attempting to use an invalid ticket for rail travel is a criminal offence.

To be clear this message is displayed, not for some bizarre loophole tickets, but for straightforward tickets such as the one described by JakeF. On numerous occasions my ticket with an origin of Leeds has been rejected at Leeds with the "not valid at this location" message.

Last edited by sheff1; 6th March 2017 at 00:23.
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Old 6th March 2017, 00:21   #7
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No, as JakeF stated, the text of the message displayed is "not valid at this location". This is clearly stating that you are trying to use an invalid ticket and, as is frequently pointed out on here, using or attempting to use an invalid ticket for rail travel is a criminal offence.

To be clear this message is displayed, not for some bizarre loophole tickets, but for straightforward tickets such as the one described by JakeF. On numerous occasions my ticket with an origin of Leeds has been rejected at Leeds with the "not valid at this location" message.
That's interesting - I've not come across any barriers that display a textual error message rather than just "seek assistance" and a code. I guess these are newer ones?
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Old 6th March 2017, 00:31   #8
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I got a message that said "ticket expired" when I tried to exit with an SVR return portion on its second day of validity recently.

I often walk through open barriers that say 'no ticket required' on them - I assume that is intended as authorisation to board the train without a ticket, even though that ticket office was open?
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Old 6th March 2017, 01:13   #9
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Originally Posted by Starmill View Post
I got a message that said "ticket expired" when I tried to exit with an SVR return portion on its second day of validity recently.

I often walk through open barriers that say 'no ticket required' on them - I assume that is intended as authorisation to board the train without a ticket, even though that ticket office was open?
I suspect you'd be quite successful in arguing that it exempts you from prosecution in terms of the byelaw regarding passing through ticket gates, and less successful in arguing that it subsequently permits you to board the train
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Old 6th March 2017, 08:50   #10
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Quote:
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That's interesting - I've not come across any barriers that display a textual error message rather than just "seek assistance" and a code. I guess these are newer ones?
All S&B ticket gates display an error message as text. There are five options as per this FoI request from 2011. https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/reque...OD%20Codes.pdf

Further, gates on the Underground will display a message such as "36 Please top up" where appropriate. Not sure if this is all Cubic gates in London or just on the Underground.
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Old 6th March 2017, 21:52   #11
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Originally Posted by Llanigraham View Post
Considering Salford is a separate city, is it included in the "Manchester Stations" group?
Salford Central is, Salford Crescent isn't.
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Old 7th March 2017, 13:19   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Llanigraham View Post
Considering Salford is a separate city, is it included in the "Manchester Stations" group?
Quote:
Originally Posted by snail View Post
Salford Central is, Salford Crescent isn't.
Neither Salford Crescent nor Salford Central are part of 'Manchester Stns' or 'Manchester CTLZ'.

Salford Central is, however, part of 'Manchester Group Routeing Point' in the Routeing Guide.
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Old 7th March 2017, 13:30   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hairyhandedfool View Post
Neither Salford Crescent nor Salford Central are part of 'Manchester Stns' or 'Manchester CTLZ'.

Salford Central is, however, part of 'Manchester Group Routeing Point' in the Routeing Guide.
I agree with you.

Wikipedia, however, doesn't, and is possibly the source of some of the confusion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
The Manchester station group is a station group of five railway stations in Manchester city centre, England consisting of Manchester Piccadilly, Manchester Oxford Road, Manchester Victoria, Deansgate and Salford Central railway stations. The station group is printed on national railway tickets as MANCHESTER STNS.
The citation used links to the Routeing Guide, thus misinterpreting what 'Manchester Stations' actually consists of. Manchester Stations definitely does not include SFD/SLD.
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Last edited by Merseysider; 7th March 2017 at 13:35.
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Old 11th March 2017, 23:02   #14
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Yes, quite normal to get a message accusing you of illegal behaviour when trying to use a ticket barrier.
Well it took less than a week for it to happen to me again. According to today's message from EMT I was travelling illegally when using a Derby to Oakham ticket to exit at Leicester.
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Old 12th March 2017, 12:00   #15
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Quote:
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Wikipedia, however, doesn't, and is possibly the source of some of the confusion..
I have hopefully made the wikipedia article more correct - I would appreciate your opinions on it...
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