[BVE] Solid bright blue tunnel entrances etc

Boxcars · 13th September 2007, 22:01

:dontknow:

When driving the Harcroft routes for BVE4 I notice that oncoming trains have a bright blue surround on their buffers and around the front of the cabs too, the station buildings etc show bright blue around the edges and the tunnel entrances are solid bright blue until you pass through them

. I think it must be what is called a transparency problem (I’ve had a few of these problems in the past with BVE 2.6.3 but, usually with Forum help, have always solved them. Also I get a solid blue view of nothing from the window of the GalaxyRailer999 cab in the SpaceRoute run for BVE4. Everything else in BVE4 runs fine but I don’t seem to be able to solve this problem in these two routes. Could anybody suggest a remedy please? I’d appreciate it.

pedned · 14th September 2007, 07:47

You may wish to refer to this thread on TSC:
http://www.trainsimcentral.co.uk/php....php?f=2&t=349

Also a few details may help such as:
what graphics card + driver you use,
which OS you use
any error messages (dont post them all if theres alot, just a few so we can work out whats wrong)
also your computer specs: ram etc might help also.

Boxcars · 14th September 2007, 14:41

Thanks for the reply pedned. Trainsimcentral seems to be down at the moment (3.45 pm). I'll post the required info tonight. Cheers.

EmergencyBrake · 14th September 2007, 15:00

This ususally happens due to a combination of bad graphics card and the fact that developers left textures in 24 bit colour instead of compressing them down to 8 bits. Harcroft and the Galaxy railcar are both 24 bits, so this is why you experience the so called transparancy problem.

The only way to fix this is to set the display resolution to 16 bits instead of 32 bits in display properties.

Boxcars · 14th September 2007, 18:42

Hmmm ... I'm pretty sure I run BVE4 using the 800 x 600 and 16 bit option in display properties. I do this because when I lower the resolution and select 16 bit I get better framerates. Thanks though and I'll certainly check my display properties when I get home.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Here are my specs and I've just checked that I AM running BVE4 in 800 x 600 16 bit. I get no errors when starting Harcroft 2S37 but, as already mentioned, the tunnel entrance in front of you at the start is blue and so are the left and right sides of the building above the tunnel. I get no errors at the start of Harcroft 1Z92 either, and start with a lovely sky but another blue tunnel entrance.

Packard Bell ixtreme 6052

Graphics = SiS 650
Chip Type = SiS 651 Rev 00
Approx. Total Memory = 32 MB

Operating System = Windows XP Home (5.1, Build 2600)
Memory = 736 MB RAM
Page file = 310 MB used, 1489 MB available

Direct X version 9.0c

Cheers.

Dennis · 14th September 2007, 19:03

The problem described sounds like 24 or 32 bit colour images are being used for the objects. I have found that they will display just fine on some machines but give problems on others - presumably graphics card related.

Looking the Harcroft (V2) textures, I have identified some which are 8 bit RGB (e.g. the class 185 front and sides) and one of the tunnel entrances (TunEntS); BC, are these included in the problem?

If yes, contact Rich as he may already have issued a patch or you could try something like Irfanview to automatically convert all bitmaps in the objects directories to 256 colour bitmaps (backup first!!).

When converting bitmaps to 256 colour, do not apply any dithering as this will result in coloured fringes appearing around the objects.

Another problem which can lead to fringing around objects occurs when textures are resized - resampling an image will result in mean colours between the object itself and the backgound transparency colour being generated; this effect is quite often seen on irregularly shaped objects like people or trees, which are difficult to 'trim' out of the background.

Rich · 14th September 2007, 19:45

Go on, blame the author!

I'm not sure if I released patch for it...may do soon though. I reason I never compress the images down to 8 bit is because they run fine in 24 bit on my PC, so there's no need. Obviously I need to take into account other people's PCs.

Will see about getting a patch sorted.

Dennis · 14th September 2007, 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich

Go on, blame the author!

I've done exactly the same thing! One of the giveaways for this type of problem is the file size - unless it's a particularly large and detailed texture, anything with a file size >~100k is likely to not be a 256 colour bitmap.

Of course, what I'd love to see is a route which takes advantage of the possibility of using 32bit colour images...

EmergencyBrake · 14th September 2007, 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich

Go on, blame the author!

I'm not sure if I released patch for it...may do soon though. I reason I never compress the images down to 8 bit is because they run fine in 24 bit on my PC, so there's no need. Obviously I need to take into account other people's PCs.

Will see about getting a patch sorted.

lol Rich, see... I did say back then...

If you need, I still got the MSN chat log with all the filenames of the textures which needs to be compressed.

Boxcars · 15th September 2007, 20:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich

Go on, blame the author!

I'm not sure if I released patch for it...may do soon though. I reason I never compress the images down to 8 bit is because they run fine in 24 bit on my PC, so there's no need. Obviously I need to take into account other people's PCs.

Will see about getting a patch sorted.

Been away. THANK YOU one and all for the info. :thumbup:

Dear Rich … (grovel grovel) :help:

A patch would be most gratefully received … :notworth:

(and would save a technical numpty like me

a lot of hassle and would save my blood a lot of pressure !

)

Cheers,

Neil

BTW Rich, I really do enjoy your Harcroft routes … thanks for making and sharing them with BVE fans. It really is appreciated out here in BVE land.

13th September 2007, 22:01	#1
Boxcars HST - extreme machine! Member Join Date: 24 May 2006 Location: Cambridge Posts: 220	Solid bright blue tunnel entrances etc :dontknow: When driving the Harcroft routes for BVE4 I notice that oncoming trains have a bright blue surround on their buffers and around the front of the cabs too, the station buildings etc show bright blue around the edges and the tunnel entrances are solid bright blue until you pass through them . I think it must be what is called a transparency problem (I’ve had a few of these problems in the past with BVE 2.6.3 but, usually with Forum help, have always solved them. Also I get a solid blue view of nothing from the window of the GalaxyRailer999 cab in the SpaceRoute run for BVE4. Everything else in BVE4 runs fine but I don’t seem to be able to solve this problem in these two routes. Could anybody suggest a remedy please? I’d appreciate it. __________________ "If you ever felt the locomotive shake the ground, I know you don't have to be told Why I'm goin' down to the railroad tracks And watch them lonesome boxcars roll" - from the song "Boxcars" - Joe Ely [MCA Records Inc. 1978] [Copyright 1977 Butch Hancock]

14th September 2007, 07:47	#2
pedned Member Join Date: 24 Aug 2006 Location: Coventry, W-Midlands Posts: 159	You may wish to refer to this thread on TSC: http://www.trainsimcentral.co.uk/php....php?f=2&t=349 Also a few details may help such as: what graphics card + driver you use, which OS you use any error messages (dont post them all if theres alot, just a few so we can work out whats wrong) also your computer specs: ram etc might help also. __________________ Jamie Course

14th September 2007, 14:41	#3
Boxcars HST - extreme machine! Member Join Date: 24 May 2006 Location: Cambridge Posts: 220	Thanks for the reply pedned. Trainsimcentral seems to be down at the moment (3.45 pm). I'll post the required info tonight. Cheers. __________________ "If you ever felt the locomotive shake the ground, I know you don't have to be told Why I'm goin' down to the railroad tracks And watch them lonesome boxcars roll" - from the song "Boxcars" - Joe Ely [MCA Records Inc. 1978] [Copyright 1977 Butch Hancock]

14th September 2007, 18:42	#5
Boxcars HST - extreme machine! Member Join Date: 24 May 2006 Location: Cambridge Posts: 220	Hmmm ... I'm pretty sure I run BVE4 using the 800 x 600 and 16 bit option in display properties. I do this because when I lower the resolution and select 16 bit I get better framerates. Thanks though and I'll certainly check my display properties when I get home. --- old post above --- --- new post below --- Here are my specs and I've just checked that I AM running BVE4 in 800 x 600 16 bit. I get no errors when starting Harcroft 2S37 but, as already mentioned, the tunnel entrance in front of you at the start is blue and so are the left and right sides of the building above the tunnel. I get no errors at the start of Harcroft 1Z92 either, and start with a lovely sky but another blue tunnel entrance. Packard Bell ixtreme 6052 Graphics = SiS 650 Chip Type = SiS 651 Rev 00 Approx. Total Memory = 32 MB Operating System = Windows XP Home (5.1, Build 2600) Memory = 736 MB RAM Page file = 310 MB used, 1489 MB available Direct X version 9.0c Cheers. __________________ "If you ever felt the locomotive shake the ground, I know you don't have to be told Why I'm goin' down to the railroad tracks And watch them lonesome boxcars roll" - from the song "Boxcars" - Joe Ely [MCA Records Inc. 1978] [Copyright 1977 Butch Hancock] Last edited by Boxcars; 14th September 2007 at 18:42. Reason: Double post prevention system

14th September 2007, 19:45	#7
Rich Established Member Join Date: 10 Jun 2005 Location: Manchester Posts: 2,846	Go on, blame the author! I'm not sure if I released patch for it...may do soon though. I reason I never compress the images down to 8 bit is because they run fine in 24 bit on my PC, so there's no need. Obviously I need to take into account other people's PCs. Will see about getting a patch sorted. __________________ The Red Right Hand Site Engineer - Manchester Metrolink Extension (Airport Line)

14th September 2007, 15:00	#4
EmergencyBrake Member Join Date: 9 Apr 2006 Location: London, UK Posts: 405	This ususally happens due to a combination of bad graphics card and the fact that developers left textures in 24 bit colour instead of compressing them down to 8 bits. Harcroft and the Galaxy railcar are both 24 bits, so this is why you experience the so called transparancy problem. The only way to fix this is to set the display resolution to 16 bits instead of 32 bits in display properties.

14th September 2007, 19:03	#6
Dennis Click to edit Established Member Join Date: 8 Aug 2005 Location: Trowbridge Posts: 2,602	The problem described sounds like 24 or 32 bit colour images are being used for the objects. I have found that they will display just fine on some machines but give problems on others - presumably graphics card related. Looking the Harcroft (V2) textures, I have identified some which are 8 bit RGB (e.g. the class 185 front and sides) and one of the tunnel entrances (TunEntS); BC, are these included in the problem? If yes, contact Rich as he may already have issued a patch or you could try something like Irfanview to automatically convert all bitmaps in the objects directories to 256 colour bitmaps (backup first!!). When converting bitmaps to 256 colour, do not apply any dithering as this will result in coloured fringes appearing around the objects. Another problem which can lead to fringing around objects occurs when textures are resized - resampling an image will result in mean colours between the object itself and the backgound transparency colour being generated; this effect is quite often seen on irregularly shaped objects like people or trees, which are difficult to 'trim' out of the background.