[Joseph_Locke]

Originally Posted by Paul Sidorczuk

Should nothing untowards occur in the final contract negotiations, what is the time factor to be for completion of the required works ?

Ah, $1,000,000 dollar question! The designated designer has been awaiting the go-ahead for about five months now, so I suspect that when a decision is made results will be expected in 0.00001 seconds (this is all perfectly normal).

I have had no sight of the latest fiction (sorry, programme) but from memory there is about six months of work to do, including a few staged bits to allow the station to continue in operation.

[MarkyT]

Clearly the station is bigger than required now or in any likely future scenario, but the old buildings' gradual demolition do not seem to have followed any discernible long term plan for the site.

As a whole, combined with the former yard between the wall and Builder Street the station could form a significant development plot with plenty of room for the desired additional car parking, bus stops etc. but the remaining passenger facilities are concentrated on the Builder Street side of the station. If, as may be implied, a final rationalised terminus layout retains only platforms 1 and 2 and possibly 3, this will bisect the larger site leaving a narrow plot over the former higher numbered platforms which may be difficult to reuse for other purposes. If the higher numbered platforms (3, disused 4 & 5) were to be retained instead, then 1 & 2 could be in-filled, the wall removed, and a much larger more flexible space could become available for station related and commercial development.

[tbtc]

The fact that Llandudno was a busy resort and a busy station in our grandparents' day has no relevance - the fact that it's a typically renovated station to deal with a couple of trains an hour (compared to equivalent Network Rail stations in 2012) is.

Originally Posted by John55

If Llandudno had the number of passengers as Southport or Blackpool North then this thread would probably not exist! Sadly the better comparison is with terminals like Lowestoft, Skegness, Morecambe or Whitby. In comparison with those stations Llandudno while still depressing somehow seems less awful.

Best comment on this thread.

Originally Posted by Tiny Tim

Whatever the plans for renovation there's no excuse for allowing Llandudno Station to fall into such a shambles. It's still a working station, Network Rail should be ashamed of themselves.

Most working stations don't have several spare platforms that have been rendered superfluous by the decline of the town that they serve though - are you saying that they should all be brought up to a perfect standard? Or only a couple of platforms are really required to be in working order?

Originally Posted by ainsworth74

Just so we're clear but the suggestion is that Network Rail should be expending its precious resources on ensuring that every single platform in the country is clean and tidy even if there is little or no likelihood of that platform being used in the near future? That is where people would like Network Rail to expend its efforts?

Yes, that is apparently the number one priority (to some).

I'd have said that improving the length of the trains to Llandudno (two/three coach DMUs) or improving the destinations (I cannot get there from Yorkshire because the direct links were cut years ago, which makes Llandudno a less attractive holiday destination when I can get a direct train to Cleethorpes/ Bridlington/ Scarborough etc), but that's just me...

[DynamicSpirit]

Originally Posted by JoeH

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/statio...tml?rtnloc=LLD

Thanks but I'm afraid that link leave me none the wiser, since as far as I can see there's still no way to get from that page to the image that emoaconr posted.

[MarkyT]

Originally Posted by DynamicSpirit

Thanks but I'm afraid that link leave me none the wiser, since as far as I can see there's still no way to get from that page to the image that emoaconr posted.

You hover over certain labels in the diagram and little pop-ups appear containing the pictures. Click on them and you're taken to a page for each photo, larger.

[Paul Sidorczuk]

Originally Posted by tbtc

I'd have said that improving the length of the trains to Llandudno (two/three coach DMUs) or improving the destinations (I cannot get there from Yorkshire because the direct links were cut years ago, which makes Llandudno a less attractive holiday destination when I can get a direct train to Cleethorpes/ Bridlington/ Scarborough etc), but that's just me...

I see that you are addressing the matter from a West/South Yorkshire perspective and as such, you are the very person to ask why the railway companies in those days saw Morecambe as a resort for the working population of the West Yorkshire towns and cities and went to the expense of building railway links from West Yorkshire, when "Yorkshire" had its own resorts of Scarborough and Bridlington.

[Masboroughlad]

Originally Posted by ainsworth74

Just so we're clear but the suggestion is that Network Rail should be expending its precious resources on ensuring that every single platform in the country is clean and tidy even if there is little or no likelihood of that platform being used in the near future? That is where people would like Network Rail to expend its efforts?

Yes! And they should get enough backing from the government to ensure a tidy, smart and safe railway for the country - as a national asset.

[ainsworth74]

Originally Posted by Masboroughlad

Yes! And they should get enough backing from the government to ensure a tidy, smart and safe railway for the country - as a national asset.

Tidy and Smart?

Have you seen photos of the railway under BR? I'd say that the modern railway is pretty tidy and smart in comparison.

Safe?

Having a railway where there has only been one passenger fatality in the last five years isn't safe enough for you? Or how about the lowest figures for Cat A SPADs on record? You know the safety aspects that actually matter not some overgrown disused platforms.

You worry about some overgrown platforms in Llandudno, the rest of us and it seems the industry will worry about how to provide the service and railway that people actually want and need whilst trying to make savings and bring the exploding costs back into line.

Sorry if this comes accross as harsh but as others and myself have outlined some overgrown unused platforms really are the least of our problems.

[tbtc]

Originally Posted by Paul Sidorczuk

I see that you are addressing the matter from a West/South Yorkshire perspective and as such, you are the very person to ask why the railway companies in those days saw Morecambe as a resort for the working population of the West Yorkshire towns and cities and went to the expense of building railway links from West Yorkshire, when "Yorkshire" had its own resorts of Scarborough and Bridlington.

You're absolutely right Paul - wasn't Morecambe known as "Bradford on Sea"?

I don't know why those in Bradford went to the west coast for their holidays (whilst the rest of Yorkshire tended to go to the east coast) - it may be tied up in the criss crossing map of independent railway companies back then but that's just a guess.

The history of these things is interesting to me - parts of Fife (where I grew up) seemed to do better with the Glasgow holidayers rather than Edinburgh ones, despite being on the "other" coast.

I think it says something about the changing nature of holidays that we debate more about towns having links to airport stations than to the seaside towns any more.

Originally Posted by Masboroughlad

Yes! And they should get enough backing from the government to ensure a tidy, smart and safe railway for the country - as a national asset.

...on every platform at a station which only sees a couple of trains an hour?

How many are there still in Llandudno (in various states of repair)?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Originally Posted by ainsworth74

Having a railway where there has only been one passenger fatality in the last five years isn't safe enough for you? Or how about the lowest figures for Cat A SPADs on record? You know the safety aspects that actually matter not some overgrown disused platforms

The sad thin is that if there's another railway fatality in the future the headlines will be about "ANOTHER rail death".

Maybe one day we'll look back at these as the Good Old Days in some respects when we achieved record passenger numbers (on the current infrastructure), opened new lines/stations etc yet had the safest railway ever. Maybe they'll look back at some photos of "out of use" platforms looking tatty...

[Cliveblackpool]

The South Fylde line has many grass covered and part covered platforms, with the side in use only maintained for around 4 coaches.
These 'untidy' areas are a haven for butterflies and other wildlife!

It is a shame the glass canopies have been allowed to deteriorate.
Infilling some tracks and using for parking is a good idea.
I think a passion for tiding up areas is not always to the good.
Losing services will make the station/ resort less attractive.

Hopefully Blackpool may get a few London services etc back after electrification.
Closing Central station was shortsighted. I believe traffic figures would be higher if Central was retained and North BPN closed. Short term profiteering, and those responsible are now pushing up daises!!

[ainsworth74]

Originally Posted by tbtc

The sad thin is that if there's another railway fatality in the future the headlines will be about "ANOTHER rail death".

I'm sure it will be.

Just like over the last few days the story wasn't railway restores both mainlines after massive storms and serious landslips in less than 24 hours (I've been thinking about it and didn't they have the WCML reopened in about twelve hours?) but was instead big bad railway strands passengers for fifteen hours on train, oh and think of the children!

[tbtc]

Originally Posted by ainsworth74

I'm sure it will be.

Just like over the last few days the story wasn't railway restores both mainlines after massive storms and serious landslips in less than 24 hours (I've been thinking about it and didn't they have the WCML reopened in about twelve hours?) but was instead big bad railway strands passengers for fifteen hours on train, oh and think of the children!

Yup - I've been away for the week and have only seen some of the pictures of flooding/ landslides/ damage, but it's pretty impressive that the railway coped with that without more disruption.

Bad news sells

[Welshman]

Originally Posted by tbtc

I don't know why those in Bradford went to the west coast for their holidays (whilst the rest of Yorkshire tended to go to the east coast) - it may be tied up in the criss crossing map of independent railway companies back then but that's just a guess.

I think you've already partly answered this question in your own post No.33.
You say Llandudno is not attractive to you as a holiday destination because you would have to change trains to get there.

Equally, people from Bradford and Pennine towns to the west [eg. Halifax] enjoyed through trains to the likes of Blackpool, Southport, etc, but for the east coast resorts they had to change at Leeds. And until 1967, folks from the Calder Valley mill towns not only had to change trains at Leeds, but stations too.

That certainly determined where my parents went on holidays when I was young. Cross from Leeds Central to Leeds City with heavy suitcases and a screaming child in tow, and repeat the performance on the way back, knowing that if you missed the train you had an hour to wait for the next one, or settle-down westwards on a through service. The answer, as we would say today, was a no-brainer!

[John55]

Originally Posted by tbtc

I don't know why those in Bradford went to the west coast for their holidays (whilst the rest of Yorkshire tended to go to the east coast) - it may be tied up in the criss crossing map of independent railway companies back then but that's just a guess.

From personal experience of the east and west coast resorts - temperature!

[DynamicSpirit]

Originally Posted by MarkyT

You hover over certain labels in the diagram and little pop-ups appear containing the pictures. Click on them and you're taken to a page for each photo, larger.

Ah yes I see now, thanks!