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2 Unused Platforms at Bournemouth

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MidnightFlyer

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1's been OOU since the Southern services ended in 2004 IIRC.

Do you mind me asking what the point of this thread is? Are you wondering why, when etc?
 
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Morgsie

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4's been OOU since the Southern services ended in 2004 IIRC.

Do you mind me asking what the point of this thread is? Are you wondering why, when etc?

Platform 1 was used for the London Victoria services and Platform 4 was used for stopping services because platform 3 was used for the Cross-Country Service, there was a Voayger at Platform 3.

I am interested in what could they be used for in the future.
 

lj9090

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I'd imagine a 4 car voyager could use platform 1, but it's a bit out of the way and out in the weather so not really suitable for a long distance service. During turnaround a CX service usually hangs around in the central loops off to the west until it needs to make its way to platform 2 for depature.

If it's running decently late and the turnaround is going to be short it does quite often arrive at platform 2 ready to go straight out again. Up trains do occasionally use platform 3 when this happens.

The reason they're out of use is there's no services timetabled that'll make use of them. Platform 1 only makes sense for minor teminating services from the London direction, and Platform 4 for minor terminating services from the Weymouth direction. If they decided to run these sorts of patterns again I'd imagine they'd get used.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I'd imagine a 4 car voyager could use platform 1, but it's a bit out of the way and out in the weather so not really suitable for a long distance service. During turnaround a CX service usually hangs around in the central loops off to the west until it needs to make its way to platform 2 for depature.

If it's running decently late and the turnaround is going to be short it does quite often arrive at platform 2 ready to go straight out again. Up trains do occasionally use platform 3 when this happens.

The reason they're out of use is there's no services timetabled that'll make use of them. Platform 1 only makes sense for minor teminating services from the London direction, and Platform 4 for minor terminating services from the Weymouth direction. If they decided to run these sorts of patterns again I'd imagine they'd get used.
 

swt_passenger

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Platform 1 may not be long enough for a 220, I seem to remember 4 cars of Mk1 stock was a pretty tight fit.

Using it would give no advantages though - the whole point of the two west end middle sidings is to deal with terminating trains without down trains having to cross in front of any up trains waiting to leave from platform 2. It slows everything down because the approach is via a crossover east of the road bridge.

Platform 4 is already used by a couple of down trains every evening. It seems to me it gets used as much as needed, it definitely isn't out of use as proposed by the original post.
 

lj9090

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Platform 4 is already used by a couple of down trains every evening. It seems to me it gets used as much as needed, it definitely isn't out of use as proposed by the original post.

Do you know which ones? Wouldn't mind seeing that and if it's not too far off when I'm usually passing through could hang around for a bit.
 

MidnightFlyer

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Do you know which ones? Wouldn't mind seeing that and if it's not too far off when I'm usually passing through could hang around for a bit.

The 1842 ex-Southampton Central and 1910 to Poole are the only ones I can see booked for this evening.

Edit - AFAICS those two are the only ones booked at any time Monday-Friday.
 

wintonian

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The 1842 ex-Southampton Central and 1910 to Poole are the only ones I can see booked for this evening.

Edit - AFAICS those two are the only ones booked at any time Monday-Friday.

That’s interesting as I haven’t seen anything use plt 4 for some years, obviously I just haven’t been around at the right time
 

Crossover

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I've also heard that the bays (one of them at least) is too short for the majority of stock now on the line. Certainly no good for Voyagers anyway AFAIK
 

Morgsie

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Can a 4 car Class 450 Desiro go into Platform 1?

Back in the day when Slam door trains were in operation, Connex ran a slam door service from Platform 1 to London
 

HSTEd

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Can a 4 car Class 450 Desiro go into Platform 1?

Back in the day when Slam door trains were in operation, Connex ran a slam door service from Platform 1 to London

Slammers have/had Mark 1 bodies which means they are rather shorter than modern trains which tend to the 23m range.
 

Schnellzug

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A VEP or CIG was near enough 20 m, and one would fit just nicely into the bay, while a 450 is 21 m, and a 220 is +/- 23.6 m. So I doubt whether you could fit either in.
 

HSTEd

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A VEP or CIG was near enough 20 m, and one would fit just nicely into the bay, while a 450 is 21 m, and a 220 is +/- 23.6 m. So I doubt whether you could fit either in.

Mark 1 body length is apparently ~19.5m for the longer chassis one.

So yeah, I imagine a four carriage-desiro would be afoul the points at the end of the bay.

Unfortunately I can't see the bay in its entirity on aerial photography (google earth) because there is apparently a canopy over it, so can anyone tell me what is "behind" the bay?
ie. Would extending it at a few metres be out of the question?
 

swt_passenger

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Can a 4 car Class 450 Desiro go into Platform 1?

I have a copy of an SWT internal document from a few years ago which shows how trains can be platformed at all their stations for each individual platform. It's primarily about how SDO should be carried out but it does list Bournemouth P1 as OK for a 450.
 

wintonian

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Mark 1 body length is apparently ~19.5m for the longer chassis one.

So yeah, I imagine a four carriage-desiro would be afoul the points at the end of the bay.

Unfortunately I can't see the bay in its entirity on aerial photography (google earth) because there is apparently a canopy over it, so can anyone tell me what is "behind" the bay?
ie. Would extending it at a few metres be out of the question?

The station building is behind the bay apart from the infill shown here and an entry/ exit gate

cd_bmc07.jpg


Heres a better pic:

bournemouth1undercanopy.jpg
 
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Schnellzug

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Mark 1 body length is apparently ~19.5m for the longer chassis one.

So yeah, I imagine a four carriage-desiro would be afoul the points at the end of the bay.

Unfortunately I can't see the bay in its entirity on aerial photography (google earth) because there is apparently a canopy over it, so can anyone tell me what is "behind" the bay?
ie. Would extending it at a few metres be out of the question?

There's a concourse area leading to an exit gate that isn't used now, so there might be room for perhaps another half-coach length,
 

swt_passenger

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But what operational benefits flow from using P1?

The station track layout is already optimised for the timetable, thanks to the two middle sidings at the west end, provided especially to avoid conflicting crossing moves.
 

Eagle

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I've also heard that the bays (one of them at least) is too short for the majority of stock now on the line. Certainly no good for Voyagers anyway AFAIK

There is only one bay.

And yes, it's only long enough for 4×20 m stock, which eliminates everything that currently uses the station (220, 221, 444, 450).
 

antharro

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Just a couple of pics...

PICT0159-small.jpg

PICT0156-small.jpg

PICT0162-small.jpg


The exit is very rarely, if ever, used now. I would imagine the platform could be extended if necessary and still leave room for a half-sized exit.
 

Eagle

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Can't seem to find a definitive answer for the length of P1, but consensus on the internet seems to be it's somewhere between 80 and 90 metres, which definitely rules out 220s, 221s and 444s. A 450 might just about be able to do it, being 82 metres, but it's very rare for 450s to terminate at Bournemouth (they're only really used on Poole services). In fact SWT services only really terminate here during the peaks and near the ends of service, since Poole got its 3tph.
 
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bb21

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Can a 4 car Class 450 Desiro go into Platform 1?

Yes, they can. The evening-peak terminator from Southampton Central (split from a service ex-Waterloo possibly) a few years back used to use Platform 1. It was formed of a 450 and I have used it.

That was around 2006 iirc.
 
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swt_passenger

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Yes, they can. The evening-peak terminator from Southampton Central (split from a service ex-Waterloo possibly) a few years back used to use Platform 1. It was formed of a 450 and I have used it.

... and I posted earlier that SWT train crew documentation says that 450s can definitely use it.
 

VTPreston_Tez

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I've never seen the bay at Bournemouth, and I have been using the station since I was born, when I used to use the station every few weeks, so this is a complete shock to me.
I'm guessing that 3-car 170s/185s may work, it could be somewhat possible to operate Scotland-Bournemouth using older stock. It would take longer and probably wouldn't have enough customers but I could see at least a trial service.
Would it be enough?
 

MidnightFlyer

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Arrrrrrrrrrrrrgh, more fantasy! The fact that So'ton gets two-hourly services to Newcastle surely removes a lot of need for this service, alongside the current MAN hourly trains. I wouldn't like a 170 or 185 for this service either!

Bear in mind you would need to re-do XC staff diagrams, get traction knowledge for drivers, etc, I would say you would need a strong business case to justify even a trial, and as I have said with existing service patterns I just don't see it.

Further, older stock? What 4-car maximum older stock designed for IC services do you suggest using?
 

VTPreston_Tez

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I deemed 170/185 as "older stock" Well they're newish I guess...
Where does Bournemouth not have connections to yet where it would benefit from?
 

ushawk

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Its not a long distance from Southampton which has good connections AND it has an hourly XC - cant see anymore services using Bournemouth, maybe the few XC that start at SOU starting back at Bournemouth, but thats all really.
 

sprinterguy

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I deemed 170/185 as "older stock" Well they're newish I guess...
185s are a few years younger than Voyagers, and Turbostars are round about the same age (The oldest 170s are a couple of years older than 220s, but construction was staggered over a number of years). I would certainly say that the 185s are pretty new trains, but anyway, I digress; back to bay platform considerations.
 
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