Group Bourdon Tool

[Mojo]

Chris Gresham has kindly agreed that the forum may host a free-to-download copy of his "Group Bourdon Tool" software.

Note that he can't offer support via the email address in the program any longer, as that domain has expired and therefore no longer valid.

He would like users to be aware of the following:

One thing which needs to be made known is the program was written before the appearance of Windows Vista/7/8 and, as a result, the .HLP (help file) may not function without the user installing the official Microsoft Help32 fix/patch.

This patch can be found for all versions of Windows (post XP) on Microsoft's website here:

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/917607

The patch should be installed before the Group Bourdon Tool.

This patch is *only* required to get he "help" function working on Windows Vista/7 or 8. It is *not* required for the program proper. In fact, the program will run without access to the help file - but will issue a warning upon launch.

He has requested that this software is not redistributed anywhere else, or changed in any way.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/bourdon.zip

 

[shan5742]

lol I finally find one somewhere else and then it appears on rail forums . thanks tho!!!

 

[simple]

This is really useful thank you.

 

[Dazza]

I agree, most helpful, difficult, but helpful.

Cheers,

Daz

 

[LCC106]

That's excellent news!

 

[Blillpers]

I just tried it. A similar test is being used here in Sweden (together with the infamous "jumping dot"-test), so this is propably going to be really helpful! Are these results any good?

 

[LCC106]

It's a good base to work on... You just need to reduce the omitted's now! (Other than that IIRC my results were similar to yours with practice).

 

[Beveridges]

Thats OK for a first attempt, but needs more work before sitting the test for real

 

[cemkarakurt]

I just tried it. A similar test is being used here in Sweden (together with the infamous "jumping dot"-test), so this is propably going to be really helpful! Are these results any good?

my best was 1354 cells

 

[Blillpers]

Third attempt, great improvements! Good thing there are two years before I can even take the test, lots of time to practice!

 

[Will8hawes]

thanks so much for this Chris Gresham / mojo very greatfull

 

[JCLeeds]

Not sure if this is working properly for me; the GBT version doesnt give any instructions on what to find and mark, what are you meant to do with the dots? Find patterns that replicate the first set? Any guidance appreciated

 

[FlamTap]

Not sure if this is working properly for me; the GBT version doesnt give any instructions, what are you meant to do with the dots? Find patterns that replicate the first set? On both of them, the mouse doesnt work, the only way to move and mark is arrow keys L-R and arrow upward to mark? Is this correct? Any guidance appreciated

The program comes with built-in help covering everything you need to know, and includes a "quick start" section. The mouse isn't used.

 

[JCLeeds]

The program comes with built-in help covering everything you need to know, and includes a "quick start" section. The mouse isn't used.

Thanks, figured out the GBT as well as SCAAT now
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
The GBT is way harder than the SCAAT. I'm managing in the 1000+ cell region on GBT with 20+ omitted. What levels do we need to be attaining here? And what is more important, speed or accuracy?

 

[playmore64]

Really! I prefer the GBT all day every day

In all honesty both are a major factor but I would place accuracy before speedy.

 

[NI 271]

Really! I prefer the GBT all day every day

In all honesty both are a major factor but I would place accuracy before speedy.

Me too. GB is much easier to do using peripheral vision, so you can go much faster, in my opinion.

 

[liamsam27]

many thanks for this, very useful

 

[hopefultrainee]

hi thanks very much for this, I can't seem to get the help function, even after following the advice given. Is there any chance someone could give some instructions on how to practice the test? It would be most appreciated. Thanks

 

[NI 271]

hi thanks very much for this, I can't seem to get the help function, even after following the advice given. Is there any chance someone could give some instructions on how to practice the test? It would be most appreciated. Thanks

Both use same controls, right arrow to move along from left to right, left arrow to go back (will only go back a maximum of one space), up arrow to mark/unmark the group in the box.

Any problems, let me know, I'm off work tomorrow so will be on here at some point.

 

[JCLeeds]

hi thanks very much for this, I can't seem to get the help function, even after following the advice given. Is there any chance someone could give some instructions on how to practice the test? It would be most appreciated. Thanks

I couldnt get the help to work either. Choose test type, SCAAT or GBT. Leave settings as default. SCAAT tells you what to look for on each sheet; controls are arrow keys; right goes right, up marks a cell, left goes left but you get one left space only to correct a fault. Up also unmarks on a correction. Keep going one cell at a time left to right until it tells you its finished, then you get a score.

I still dont know what is a good score!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Recent scores; anyone who can advise how these stack up?

SCAAT Total cells 1253, omitted 4, incorrect none

GBT Total cells 1120, omitted 7, incorrect none

All settings left as default

 

[Beveridges]

Recent scores; anyone who can advise how these stack up?

SCAAT Total cells 1253, omitted 4, incorrect none

GBT Total cells 1120, omitted 7, incorrect none

All settings left as default

I've said it before & I'll say it again, 7 omitted "might" pass but you should aim for 2 or less to be safe

 

[daddy_badger]

In round 1 of scaat you have to find a particular shape on every row working left to right. In round 2 you have to find 2 particular shapes in every row working left to right. In round 3 of scaat you have to find a particular shape plus the first shape at the the start of each row for that row only. Hope that makes sense. On the paper gbt there are 18 rows, I managed to get to 14 making 1 mistake that I corrected on the 5th sheet. I passed, however you still need to do well in the TRP and MT4 (if the toc you apply to uses that test.)

 

[387star]

I've said it before & I'll say it again, 7 omitted "might" pass but you should aim for 2 or less to be safe

omissions and incorrect selections are both marked as negative I think? therefore they are as bad as each other especially when there are multiple mistakes per page

am I right?

 

[bandit]

Overall Statistics:
-------------------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ 3
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 1350
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.289
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.230

Completed Rows ------------- 52
Mean Row Time -------------- 7.234
Median Row Time ------------ 7.240


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 2.09
Does this look a good practise? Still working on the omitted.

 

[daddy_badger]

Overall Statistics:
-------------------

Perception & Attention:

Targets Omitted ------------ 3
Marked Incorrect ----------- None


Speed:

Total Cells ---------------- 1350
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.289
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.230

Completed Rows ------------- 52
Mean Row Time -------------- 7.234
Median Row Time ------------ 7.240


Vigilance:

Row Fluctuation ------------ 2.09
Does this look a good practise? Still working on the omitted.

Who is your assessment with? Try 3 sheets at 2:00 minutes .

 

[bandit]

Who is your assessment with? Try 3 sheets at 2:00 minutes .

ATW got it thurs

 

[daddy_badger]

Might be ok, although nobody knows the pass mark. 1 missed is good, believe the row fluctuation needs to be low also so would say that score looks ok, but do not quote me on that. Scoring I think is different between TOCs and may take x number of the top percentage. Keep practicing, but not on the day before.

 

[TDK]

Might be ok, although nobody knows the pass mark. 1 missed is good, believe the row fluctuation needs to be low also so would say that score looks ok, but do not quote me on that. Scoring I think is different between TOCs and may take x number of the top percentage. Keep practicing, but not on the day before.

Scoring is down to the quality of the candidates. If you gett all the candidates passing then it will be graded, although you have passed the assessment if someone has a higher score than you in the GB/Reaction etc it could mean you will be put on hold where the other candiate will not. So say for example you have 20 candidates and they all pass the assessments and the company only need 10 drivers, ten will be put on hold.

Don't worry about row fluctuation and all these figures, just be consistant and accurate and you will pass.

 

[Flyboy]

On GBT I usually average about 12 rows and 300 cells per sheet giving a total of 1500 for the complete test, normally with about 2 to 3 omissions. I'm therefore trying to slow down to around 1400 cells in order to aim for zero omissions, however, my row fluctuation (vigilance) score is usually up at around 3 or 4. TDK - you say don't worry about row fluctuation but should I realistically be looking to get this lower?

 

[Beveridges]

A row fluctuation of 3-4 means you are consistant, 2 is very consistant and anything under 2 is robot-like


--- old post above --- --- new post below ---



I had a look to see if my results are still saved on computer. These are some of my results from my last couple of practice attempts of this very boring test, back on the 13th December 2007.

GBT test results 1

Overall Statistics:
-------------------
Perception & Attention:
Targets Omitted ------------ None
Marked Incorrect ----------- 3
Speed:
Total Cells ---------------- 1519
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.253
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.230
Completed Rows ------------- 58
Mean Row Time -------------- 6.324
Median Row Time ------------ 6.250
Vigilance:
Row Fluctuation ------------ 3.47

GBT test results 2

Overall Statistics:
-------------------
Perception & Attention:
Targets Omitted ------------ 1
Marked Incorrect ----------- 1
Speed:
Total Cells ---------------- 1630
Mean Cell Time ------------- 0.235
Median Cell Time ----------- 0.220
Completed Rows ------------- 64
Mean Row Time -------------- 5.878
Median Row Time ------------ 5.860
Vigilance:
Row Fluctuation ------------ 2.97


Passed with Grade A when I did the real thing.

Don't know what I'd get if I practiced again now, the test is so boring I can't motivate myself to have another go at it just for the sake of seeing if I can still do it.