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Two Together Railcard returns 3 March 2014

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Paul Duck

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Ask GC whether they are prepared to add an easement, along the lines of the Network Railcard ones at http://www.railcard.co.uk/network/time-restrictions/ ?
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I've also picked up a leaflet. It gives the URL http://www.twotogether-railcard.co.uk/leaflet which seems to be out-of-date! The leaflet claims to be valid until 6th September 2014 and there's no start date mentioned so I wonder if some stations are already issuing them.

We will be asking GC. Not confident in a easement coming in but if you don't ask you don't find out.
We did have leaflets on display but received E mails saying to take all advertising of the 2 together railcard down and nothing is allowed to be put on show until 3rd march. Cant understand why we have to keep it 'top secret' until its available to purchase. Passengers are booking train tickets for middle of may at the moment and would save a few bob by buying a 2 together railcard.
 
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Romilly

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Two named people on railcard must travel together.

If this is a correct rendering of the condition, it would suggest that the conditions haven't been adequately thought through.

The economic point of selling tickets is to raise income to set against costs. Discounts are offered to generate income, e.g. by attracting customers (and their money) who wouldn't otherwise avail themselves of the services offered.

In the case of a Family & Friends railcard, I can see the argument for saying that discounted tickets bought for an adult and a child shouldn't be valid for travel by the adult alone (e.g. where the child is not well on the day) as then the adult would be travelling for 86% of the price of undiscounted travel for a single adult without the railways gaining anything from having given the discount.

But ... if I buy two adult tickets with a "Two Together" discount, I pay 132% of the cost of travel by a single adult alone. If on the day of travel, the second adult is not well and I travel alone with both tickets why should that not be permitted: I am paying a premium for my solo journey.

Similarly with East Coast's small group offer (where the conditions are decidedly unclear as to whether the 25% discount is for buying three or more tickets or is for travel by three or more persons together). If buying advance tickets with that offer for 3 people, who knows whether one of them will be ill (or have ill children) in several weeks time. The three tickets cost 225% of a single adult ticket, so if only one or two members of the group can travel on the day they are paying a premium: what's the problem with that so long as they present all three tickets?

So for Two Together, or the small group offer, I think that the conditions should make it clear that the discount is for buying the multiple tickets and that, if one or more of the group cannot travel on the day, the rest of the group are entitled to travel using the discounted tickets so long as they have all of the tickets with them and present all of them for clipping.
 

CyrusWuff

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So for Two Together, or the small group offer, I think that the conditions should make it clear that the discount is for buying the multiple tickets and that, if one or more of the group cannot travel on the day, the rest of the group are entitled to travel using the discounted tickets so long as they have all of the tickets with them and present all of them for clipping.

Whether you think it's fair or not, the Two Together Terms and Conditions are perfectly clear (taken from the trial conditions, though I suspect they haven't changed for the final product):

ATOC said:
3. Both named cardholders must be travelling together to enable discounted tickets to be used

6. The named second cardholder for whom discounted tickets are purchased must travel with the Railcard holder throughout the journey.
 

MKB

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For those who've seen the publicity before its official launch, is there any mention of a discounted three-year option?
 

Sammy h

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But ... if I buy two adult tickets with a "Two Together" discount, I pay 132% of the cost of travel by a single adult alone. If on the day of travel, the second adult is not well and I travel alone with both tickets why should that not be permitted: I am paying a premium for my solo journey.


You aren't really paying a premium? Providing it isn't an advance ticket, you could pay the XS on the ticket up to 100%? So you haven't lost anything as this is what you would have paid if you strolled in on the day and bought a ticket. It is the other railcard user who loses out.
 

MKB

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You aren't really paying a premium? Providing it isn't an advance ticket, you could pay the XS on the ticket up to 100%? So you haven't lost anything as this is what you would have paid if you strolled in on the day and bought a ticket. It is the other railcard user who loses out.

Officially at least, according to previous advice on here, you can't excess a railcard discount to full fare. You have to buy a new ticket.
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No mention of three year discounted one on the retail brief I've got.

Thanks for the info. Looks like I'll be getting a one-year card then, at the start of March.

When I ordered my first 2T railcard at the start of the trial, it arrived within a week. I'm going to chance it and book some 28 March Advance fares using the 2T discount. Not too risky I think.
 

Be3G

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For those in the know, what's the validity with rovers like for the reinstated Two Together?
 

hairyhandedfool

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Officially at least, according to previous advice on here, you can't excess a railcard discount to full fare. You have to buy a new ticket.....

Indeed (I am led to believe East Coast are the exception to the rule), but you can get a refund on unused "walk-up" tickets (less an admin fee).
 

island

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I'll be digging out Mrs. island's and my Two Together Photocard (from the trial) a week on Monday!
 

Paul Kelly

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For those in the know, what's the validity with rovers like for the reinstated Two Together?
You could check any rovers of interest on BRfares.com, although mightn't be totally accurate since there could be some mid-NFM changes with the 2TR railcard being reintroduced between NFM change dates. But for example the Thames Branches Day Ranger seems to offer the discount.
 

Be3G

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Indeed I already tried that but came to the same conclusion as you. What I was really hoping for was that the All Line Rover might gain the discount, seeing as all other national railcards work with it!
 

island

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The Two Together Railcard website has been changed to show a countdown clock to 9am on Monday.
 

MKB

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When I ordered my first 2T railcard at the start of the trial, it arrived within a week. I'm going to chance it and book some 28 March Advance fares using the 2T discount. Not too risky I think.

My plan has gone awry.

Just as it's about to relaunch, the Two Together railcard has disappeared from all the booking engines, having been there until last week (I think).

During the trial, it took several months of complaining to get the various booking engines to offer this discount, so I hope we're not going to have the same farrago all over again.
 

island

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My plan has gone awry.

Just as it's about to relaunch, the Two Together railcard has disappeared from all the booking engines, having been there until last week (I think).

During the trial, it took several months of complaining to get the various booking engines to offer this discount, so I hope we're not going to have the same farrago all over again.

You may be able to book the desired tickets at a station now and definitely will on Monday.

Edit: alternatively search on NRE which does have Two Together and click through to East Coast, and it will pass the Two Together discount through even though you could not get it normally. This can also be used to purchase GroupSave on the EC website.
 
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island

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The trial version of the Two Together Railcard did not have a minimum fare (except on outboundary anytime day Travelcards), but was barred between 0430 and 0930 Monday to Friday. (It did not give a discount on inboundary Travelcards.)
 

Floydlover25

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Thanks. Let's hope they haven't imposed a minimum fare when the national version launches next Monday!
 

David Goddard

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Looking forward to this. Was going to renew our Network Card at the beginning of Feb but as the only planned trip was just me going into London (and someone else bearing the cost) then we didn't bother, and are now pleased that we didn't, as the Two Together will being us much more benefits.
09:30 restriction isn't too bad, but 09:00 would be better (my regular train to Birmingham leaves Reading at 09:09!)

Would be great to see this card valid on Rovers, especially (obviously) the ALR, but even on products like the East Midlands or Central Scotland ones would be good.
 

mad_rich

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I wasn't initially interested in this, given that most of my travel is alone, but the Independent got me thinking when it pointed out that the break-even fare is approx £50. (£100 for two before railcard, or £67+£30 with railcard).

I wonder about the logistics of finding a stranger to pair up with at King's Cross if I'm stuck having to buy a walk-up ticket. :lol:
 

transmanche

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I wonder about the logistics of finding a stranger to pair up with at King's Cross if I'm stuck having to buy a walk-up ticket. :lol:
Why not? Posting a message on Gumtree or even just posting a tweet might yield results! :D
 

mad_rich

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Why not? Posting a message on Gumtree or even just posting a tweet might yield results! :D

Thinking about it, I suppose it relies on an unlikely combination of

- someone wanting to make the same journey
- who also hasn't bought a ticket
- who wants to buy a walk-up single
- who understands the principle of how this will save money
- who is spending their own money, not their employer's (and thus actually cares)
- who understands that I'm not a crazy person who is going to clone their identity

It also means buying a single ticket (expensive), or buying a return and hoping I can find a similar person on the return journey.
 

maniacmartin

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.. it could still work out cheaper to buy the railcard on the spot in both you and the stranger's name assuming they have a passport photo :)
 

telstarbox

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Guardian article today describes it as a "couples railcard" but includes some other suggestions:

There is nothing to stop regular business users who travel with colleagues from using the card if their journey is after 9.30am. Equally, some passengers will want to buy more than one card so they can pair up with different people. Off-peak commuters need to find others who share the same trains, and join forces.

Those making long-distance journeys could save the £30 card's cost in one journey. A standard London-Birmingham off-peak round trip costs £50.50 per person on Virgin Trains, or £101 for two. The Two Together fare, plus the cost of a brand-new railcard, totals £96.70.
 
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GodAtum

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Rail expert Mark Smith, who runs the website Seat61.com said: ’The new railcard is very significant, because it strikes directly at the one known weakness of rail - namely if I want to go to, say, Manchester on my own, the rail fare might be competitive with driving. But the moment my wife and I both want to go, the car costs exactly the same for the two of us, but the rail price is doubled.’

Interesting example. I suppose this is true.
 
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