Southeastern removes £10 admin fee from ticket refunds

[Darandio]

Is this new news, I hadn't seen it anywhere as the piece is dated today, but references the changes commencing on April 1st.

And will others follow suit?

http://www.railtechnologymagazine.c...tern-removes-10-admin-fee-from-ticket-refunds

Southeastern has withdrawn the £10 administration fee from ticket refunds as part of changes to improve customer service.

From 1 April, for tickets purchased from Southeastern, passengers will no longer be charged for processing:

*refunds on unused Anytime and Off-Peak tickets applied for before the ticket is valid for travel, or on the day at the office where the ticket was bought within an hour of purchase

*season ticket refunds (including seven day season tickets) where the customer wants to surrender their season ticket before its expiry date and applies for a refund on the remaining validity of the ticket

*a first duplicate replacement season ticket (this does not apply to season tickets for periods of less than a month for which duplicates are not issued)

*‘SILKS’ (stranded individual, location known payments), where a third party provides payment for travel for a customer – typically a young or vulnerable person – stranded with no funds.

David Statham, managing director of Southeastern, said: “We’ve been listening to our passengers and working on what we can do to improve all aspects of their journey. These changes make our ticketing and refund policy simpler and transparent for our customers.”

The changes have been made following a review of passenger feedback and in consultation with Passenger Focus and London TravelWatch. They apply to tickets purchased from a Southeastern retail outlet. Some Advance ticket types remain non-refundable.

Southeastern is currently reviewing its Passenger Charter, which sets out the train operating company’s commitments to standards and performance, to incorporate other planned improvements to its services.

 

[Searle]

Southeastern get a lot of negative press on this forum but that's actually a really good change, props to them for this.

 

[RJ]

As a customer of the railway, this is a good thing. But there is something to be said for the admin fee - it discourages money launderers. Many people who buy walkup tickets in advance decide that they want a refund on the date of travel - which this scheme doesn't appear to cover.

 

[Merseysider]

Southeastern get a lot of negative press on this forum but that's actually a really good change, props to them for this.

I wholeheartedly agree. It also removes one negative side effect of splitting walk-up tickets, which is multiple admin charges for refunds/amendments if plans change.

it discourages money launderers

Do you mean person X buying a £100 ticket in cash, then person Y getting it refunded in cash, or something else?

 

[First class]

I wholeheartedly agree. It also removes one negative side effect of splitting walk-up tickets, which is multiple admin charges for refunds/amendments if plans change.

Do you mean person X buying a £100 ticket in cash, then person Y getting it refunded in cash, or something else?

I could buy a Berwick-on-Tweed to London Zones 1-6 Travelcard for £37,916 cash from drug money etc if I really wanted to, keep hold of it for a day or two, then go back and get a refund. Ok, so this example, you might get away with it once, but it will eventually flag and cause a problem. But in the great scheme of things £10 "administration" cost to clean the money isn't an issue at all.

BUT

For some lower level "money laundering" schemes, I could buy multiple low value seasons across many TOCs and stations etc, and although slower, I could launder the same £37,000 amount, but each transaction incurs a £10 fee, so if I had to buy 50 x different tickets, I'm paying £500 in admin fees, (which admittedly is still worth the risk).

 

[RJ]

Indeed, I was thinking more lower ticket erm...tickets, which wouldn't arouse so much suspicion. Also for a group of people who share certain activities with money launderers, albeit not illegal ones - manufactured spending/churning enthusiasts, whose pursuit is to circulate money for as low a cost as possible. Without wishing to give away details, some TOCs leave themselves vulnerable to this unnecessarily. At best, having to bear the loss of credit card transaction fees and at worst, inadvertently facilitating money laundering.

 

[D6975]

I could buy a Berwick-on-Tweed to London Zones 1-6 Travelcard for £37,916 cash from drug money etc if I really wanted to, keep hold of it for a day or two, then go back and get a refund. Ok, so this example, you might get away with it once, but it will eventually flag and cause a problem. But in the great scheme of things £10 "administration" cost to clean the money isn't an issue at all.

No, you couldn't do this.
Money laundering laws mean that you cannot legally buy things for cash for large sums. The limit IIRC was £2000, but I'm unsure. Someone on here will know. I first became aware of it when my ex bought a car and the salesman told us the limit for how much of the total cost could be paid in cash.

ps this was a few years ago, the amount is probably higher now.

 

[yorkie]

I wholeheartedly agree. It also removes one negative side effect of splitting walk-up tickets, which is multiple admin charges for refunds/amendments if plans change.

You mean the negative side effect of splitting walk-up tickets by any method other than using Trainsplit.com?

Trainsplit.com only charges one transaction per journey.

 

[TUC]

As a customer of the railway, this is a good thing. But there is something to be said for the admin fee - it discourages money launderers. Many people who buy walkup tickets in advance decide that they want a refund on the date of travel - which this scheme doesn't appear to cover.

Somehow I don't think that 99.999999% of customers wanting refunds are engaged in money laundering.

 

[Sacro]

Somehow I don't think that 99.999999% of customers wanting refunds are engaged in money laundering.

I imagine it's far far higher than one in 100 million.

 

[Metrailway]

No, you couldn't do this.
Money laundering laws mean that you cannot legally buy things for cash for large sums. The limit IIRC was £2000, but I'm unsure. Someone on here will know. I first became aware of it when my ex bought a car and the salesman told us the limit for how much of the total cost could be paid in cash.

ps this was a few years ago, the amount is probably higher now.

AFAIK there is no limit in paying in cash.

The rules differ for different business types but you have to register for Money Laundering Supervision if you take cash payments over €15,000 for one transaction (either in one go or through several payments). If you are required to register, there is a large number of safeguards you need to put in place.

I suspect your car dealer is covering their back in not taking any large cash payments to avoid needing to register.

 

[Deerfold]

No, you couldn't do this.
Money laundering laws mean that you cannot legally buy things for cash for large sums. The limit IIRC was £2000, but I'm unsure. Someone on here will know. I first became aware of it when my ex bought a car and the salesman told us the limit for how much of the total cost could be paid in cash.

ps this was a few years ago, the amount is probably higher now.

Due to some problems with my debit card and my credit cards (except one 200 miles away) not having a large enough credit limited I paid just under £3320 in cash for a ticket last year.

 

[kieron]

Many people who buy walkup tickets in advance decide that they want a refund on the date of travel - which this scheme doesn't appear to cover.

I suspect that's at least partly due to the risk of someone applying for a refund after travelling.

I suppose the "same ticket office, within an hour" thing is meant to address this risk, although it is a shame that it doesn't cover tickets bought or collected from ticket machines.

 

[island]

No, you couldn't do this.
Money laundering laws mean that you cannot legally buy things for cash for large sums. The limit IIRC was £2000, but I'm unsure. Someone on here will know. I first became aware of it when my ex bought a car and the salesman told us the limit for how much of the total cost could be paid in cash.

ps this was a few years ago, the amount is probably higher now.

That isn't correct. There is no limit on cash transactions in the UK as a matter of law, although as mentioned above certain businesses are required to obtain copies of identification documents or other identity verification of customers transacting over a certain amount.

The issue at the car dealership must have been the dealership's policy, for whatever reason such as security or not wanting to pay bank cash handling fees.

 

[DelayRepay]

As a customer of the railway, this is a good thing. But there is something to be said for the admin fee - it discourages money launderers.

Out of interest RJ as I know you work in the industry, do you receive any money laundering training or have a mechanism to report any concerns?