Haulage on selected routes in 1978/79

[Springs Branch]

Here's a question about haulage in use on various BR routes around 1978.

What stock & haulage was most likely to be used on the following lines in winter 1978/79?

• Birmingham - Exeter (NE/SW Cross Country).
• Glasgow/Edinburgh - Aberdeen.
• London - Brighton.

The back-story is this.....
At that time I was applying for universities using the UCCA process, where you picked 5 universities in order of preference.
Back then the Local Authority would pay your travel expenses to attend interviews or open days at all your chosen institutions.
An enthusiast friend suggested that, so long as you were confident of offers from your first few choices, you should use nos. 4 and 5 on your list to score expenses-paid train trips to the furthest possible points from home.
Unfortunately this enticing idea came after I'd submitted my choices, so the most exotic trip I ended up with was a Day Return from Wigan to Birmingham!

At the time I figured, with universities as they existed back then, my longest trips would have been:-
- Wigan to Exeter (Exeter University)
- Wigan to Aberdeen (Aberdeen University)
- Wigan to Brighton (Sussex University)
But until now, >35 years later, I never actually considered what haulage I had missed out on (not counting the obvious Class 86 or 87 on the WCML).
Can anyone help?

 

[ac6000cw]

First one would have been 45/46/47 from Gateshead/Holbeck/Bristol Bath Road sheds.

 

[30907]

And the Brighton main line CIGs and BIGs or VEPs.

Was Aberdeen still 40s then on internal workings ?

 

[Bevan Price]

And the Brighton main line CIGs and BIGs or VEPs.

Was Aberdeen still 40s then on internal workings ?

Mostly 47s, but still some 40s on Edinburgh or Glasgow - Aberdeen services (until at least 1980).

Coaching stock would mostly be early Mark 2, or some Mark 1, with aircon stock only on some through services to/from London.

 

[Taunton]

There were also regular forays by Deltics on Edinburgh to Aberdeen, these increased once the HSTs started to be introduced on the East Coast, but they were periodic visitors beforehand as well.

The internal Scottish services used a lot of "borrowed" locomotives, including many of the Class 47 from Crewe or Toton which had come north on freight services.

 

[Springs Branch]

Many thanks for the responses.

For the NE/NW-SW via Birmingham route, I assume one would most likely be travelling in a Mk.1 coach with the possibility of an early non-AC Mk.2 ?

What about, for the Wigan/Exeter trip, if I splashed out on a more expensive ticket via London (as someone else was paying)?
Were HSTs working the Paddington/West of England trains by late 1978/early 1979, or could I have still had a Class 50 plus Mk.2s at that time?

 

[Ash Bridge]

Many thanks for the responses.

For the NE/NW-SW via Birmingham route, I assume one would most likely be travelling in a Mk.1 coach with the possibility of an early non-AC Mk.2 ?

What about, for the Wigan/Exeter trip, if I splashed out on a more expensive ticket via London (as someone else was paying)?
Were HSTs working the Paddington/West of England trains by late 1978/early 1979, or could I have still had a Class 50 plus Mk.2s at that time?

I remember traveling from Stockport to Bodmin Road in June 1979, changing at Birmingham New St. into a class 45 hauled service formed of mainly non aircon mk2 b/c stock, my seat was in a declassified mk2c open first. At Plymouth the 45 was replaced by a class 50, just for the record Stockport to Brum was a class 85 on B4/commonwealth bogied mk1 opens (Manchester-Cardiff Central service)

 

[Taunton]

Were HSTs working the Paddington/West of England trains by late 1978/early 1979, or could I have still had a Class 50 plus Mk.2s at that time?

It was pretty much a 50/50 mix between Class 47/4 and Class 50 right up to HST introduction. I don't believe these were on the WofE services by 1978, still getting introduced on the East Coast. The WofE came next though. I think our first HST at Taunton was a terminating service which was an extension of a Paddington to Weston-Super-Mare train. The HSTs made a considerable difference to Plymouth/Penzance services, not so much for the 125 mph speed as their ability to charge the steep banks and accelerate from all those restricted curves.

 

[Bevan Price]

Many thanks for the responses.

For the NE/NW-SW via Birmingham route, I assume one would most likely be travelling in a Mk.1 coach with the possibility of an early non-AC Mk.2 ?

What about, for the Wigan/Exeter trip, if I splashed out on a more expensive ticket via London (as someone else was paying)?
Were HSTs working the Paddington/West of England trains by late 1978/early 1979, or could I have still had a Class 50 plus Mk.2s at that time?

The Wigan - London Euston service would probably be a Class 86 or 87 with Mk.2 AirCon stock, although Mark 1 & Early Mark 2, plus classes 81 to 85 still appeared on reliefs and summer-dated services, etc.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

The Wigan - London Euston service would probably be a Class 86 or 87 with Mk.2 AirCon stock, although Mark 1 & Early Mark 2, plus classes 81 to 85 still appeared on reliefs and summer-dated services, etc.

Pretty sure the air con stock had MK1 buffet cars (from memory) - refurbed - with new hideous orange plastic seats. Very 1970's.

 

[ac6000cw]

Pretty sure the air con stock had MK1 buffet cars (from memory) - refurbed - with new hideous orange plastic seats. Very 1970's.

Correct - BR never built any Mk2 buffet/kitchen/restaurant cars.

 

[Taunton]

BR never built any Mk2 buffet/kitchen/restaurant cars.

http://www.eastbank.org.uk/images/Coaches/CS0148.jpg

 

[ac6000cw]

http://www.eastbank.org.uk/images/Coaches/CS0148.jpg

AFAIK, those were later conversions (from FOs?), not built as catering vehicles.

I think the WCML stock went from Mk1 to Mk3 catering vehicles when 110 mph running started, although the London-Birmingham-Wolverhampton trains remained 86-hauled 100 mph Mk2 E/F+Mk1 catering for some years after that.

 

[Ash Bridge]

AFAIK, those were later conversions (from FOs?), not built as catering vehicles.

I think the WCML stock went from Mk1 to Mk3 catering vehicles when 110 mph running started, although the London-Birmingham-Wolverhampton trains remained 86-hauled 100 mph Mk2 E/F+Mk1 catering for some years after that.

As you correctly say, they were later conversions although the example shown was converted from mk2f SO M5970, renumbered M1800 in the mid 1970s and designated RSS (Restaurant Self-Service)

 

[ac6000cw]

As you correctly say, they were later conversions although the example shown was converted from mk2f SO M5970, renumbered M1800 in the mid 1970s and designated RSS (Restaurant Self-Service)

Sounds like an experiment ?

 

[Ash Bridge]

Sounds like an experiment ?

Yes, apparently the conversion work on it started in late 1974 with the vehicle entering service in the spring of 1975 on Euston-Glasgow services. Half the seating area plus the toilet at one end were replaced with a self standing counter & display unit which contained wrapped food products & cans of soft drinks, passengers took a tray selected their choices & made their way to the cash point. The remaining space included a food prep area, hot water boiler plus microwave cooking facility, source of this info is from British Rail mk2 Coaches by Michael Harris.