Inverness 158s

[CallySleeper]

Do the ScotRail 158s based out of Inverness still run round with first class sections? Or have they all been removed.

 

[ScotrailINV]

Do the ScotRail 158s based out of Inverness still run round with first class sections? Or have they all been removed.

They have First Class but no partition/door between it and Standard Class.

Only 'upgrade' is a lamp, curtain? and 230v socket.

 

[Liam]

and 230v socket.

Which may or may not work.

 

[CallySleeper]

Thanks guys, wasn't sure. As long as it's declassified!

 

[ScotrailINV]

Thanks guys, wasn't sure. As long as it's declassified!

Yeah it's declassified, IIRC you can't get a 1st fare for the Kyle and Far North lines.

 

[Starmill]

Yeah it's declassified, IIRC you can't get a 1st fare for the Kyle and Far North lines.

Just to be clear, that's not what makes them declassified. They are listed in the timetable as carrying Standard Class accommodation only. Some journeys do not have First Class fares available, but you would use trains which do convey First Class accomodation to make them. There are actually rather a lot of First Class fares onto the Far North and Kyle lines! e.g. this. You are however correct that there are no First Class fares from Inverness to those places - as they would be pointless.

 

[childwallblues]

First class was still being used on the ABD-INV route in October 2013.

 

[ScotrailINV]

Just to be clear, that's not what makes them declassified. They are listed in the timetable as carrying Standard Class accommodation only. Some journeys do not have First Class fares available, but you would use trains which do convey First Class accomodation to make them. There are actually rather a lot of First Class fares onto the Far North and Kyle lines! e.g. this. You are however correct that there are no First Class fares from Inverness to those places - as they would be pointless.

Sorry, that's essentially what I meant - sleep deprivation getting the better of me!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

First class was still being used on the ABD-INV route in October 2013.

INV - ABD is advertised as having FC and these services are predominantly operated by 170's these days.

IIRC the Inverness based 158's (701 - 725) that were refreshed by Transport Scotland and Hitrans are mainly used on the Kyle/Far North lines. May be wrong, but I can't remember using a 158 on the Aberdeen line in the last year or two.

 

[Bodiddly]

Just to be clear, the First Class section of the 158's are only declassified on trains to the Far North or Kyle. All other routes out of Inverness use the First Class section of the 158 as such.

 

[158722]

Just to be clear, the First Class section of the 158's are only declassified on trains to the Far North or Kyle. All other routes out of Inverness use the First Class section of the 158 as such.

They also have daily diagrams on the Fife Circle and Dunblane, which are also standard only. Regular punters all know this trick, same goes for the 170s with FC which also appear daily on these workings.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Just to be clear, the First Class section of the 158's are only declassified on trains to the Far North or Kyle. All other routes out of Inverness use the First Class section of the 158 as such.

Is there a reason they don't just create First Class fares on these routes? It would be additional income from tourists without really annoying anyone.

 

[DarloRich]

Thanks guys, wasn't sure. As long as it's declassified!

I went all the way from Inverness to Kyle and back in first class - it was declassified and there was a trolly

 

[Juniper Driver]

They have First Class but no partition/door between it and Standard Class.

Only 'upgrade' is a lamp, curtain? and 230v socket.

Certainly not an upgrade,we have 250v here.

 

[ainsworth74]

Certainly not an upgrade,we have 250v here.

I thought you had 750v DC?

 

[Juniper Driver]

I thought you had 750v DC?

Got me there for being pedantic.

 

[jopsuk]

Is there a reason they don't just create First Class fares on these routes? It would be additional income from tourists without really annoying anyone.

There's certainly first class fares from Edinburgh to Falkirk Grahamston and Stirling- the one VTEC service a day (the Highland Chieftain) conveys 1st.

 

[me123]

There's certainly first class fares from Edinburgh to Falkirk Grahamston and Stirling- the one VTEC service a day (the Highland Chieftain) conveys 1st.

Falkirk tickets appear to be valid for "Falkirk Grahamston or High", which means it's also used by passengers travelling on Scotrail's 4tph to Falkirk High (which all theoretically convey FC accommodation). You appear to be able to take the Chieftain into Edinburgh ad return on Scotrail's shuttle if you wish to do so.

1st class on 158s is pretty poor up here, and certainly when a 158 does appear on the Aberdeen-Inverness line it's pretty common for people to be moved from 1st class who genuinely can't see the difference between those seats and the other ones (and I can't blame them - I wouldn't pay for FC on a 158). Presuming the Far North services are quiet enough that you could enforce FC without disadvantaging SC passengers (by which I mean not depriving an SC passenger of a seat), I don't see why they couldn't have a FC service. However, the benefits are going to be limited by:

• Limited business traffic
• Poor standard of FC provision on Scotrail services in general
• Slow journey time making the route less attractive to those who would buy FC tickets

As you say, you could very well make a bit of additional revenue from tourists with more cash than sense, and perhaps provide a service for those travelling onwards to the Central Belt in FC. The benefit is likely to be extremely small, but I can't imagine that the costs of doing so will be prohibitive.

 

[scotsman]

Is there a reason they don't just create First Class fares on these routes? It would be additional income from tourists without really annoying anyone.

Three answers:

a) The service may be receiving a subsidy based on the standard class seating

b) Those lines have never had a First Class service, ever

c) Inverness units work(ed) the Aberdeen the service, which always had First

 

[Failed Unit]

There are still 158 daigrams on the Edinburgh to Inverness route as well, normally 2x 158. So they still get a chance for geninue 1st class work. I am not sure if the 1st class is enforced when they are going portion working on Edinburgh / Glasgow - Aberdeen (normally detaching at Perth / Dundee).

The do enforce the 1st when they show up on Edinburgh - Glasgow, which again upsets people who can't tell the difference.

Ironically the best 1st class seats on Scotrail 158s on 158786 and 789 are premenantly declassified. They have even reseated the rest of the set so why the 2+1 is still existing no-one knows.