Thames Valley changes 07/09

[cactustwirly]

From the new timetables I gather that the Thames Valley local services & Newbury services will be declassified and worked by 165s, North Downs services terminating at Redhill will also be declassified 165s. The rest, including Oxford fasts and Bedwyns will be 166s with first and standard classes.

This is probably preparation for the cascade to the west.

 

[Rich McLean]

From the new timetables I gather that the Thames Valley local services & Newbury services will be declassified and worked by 165s, North Downs services terminating at Redhill will also be declassified 165s. The rest, including Oxford fasts and Bedwyns will be 166s with first and standard classes.

This is probably preparation for the cascade to the west.

Correct, however there will be times when a 165 will be on a Oxford Fast, and a 166 on a stopper due to unit displacement during disruption or for diagram balancing purposes

 

[Deepgreen]

From the new timetables I gather that the Thames Valley local services & Newbury services will be declassified and worked by 165s, North Downs services terminating at Redhill will also be declassified 165s. The rest, including Oxford fasts and Bedwyns will be 166s with first and standard classes.

This is probably preparation for the cascade to the west.

So when are FGW going to tell us, the passengers, about this imminent worsening of our service?! What happens to those with first class seasons when the trains no longer include first class accommodation?

 

[swt_passenger]

So when are FGW going to tell us, the passengers, about this imminent worsening of our service?! What happens to those with first class seasons when the trains no longer include first class accommodation?

The new timetable will cease to show [1] at the head of the column for affected trains, I expect station timetable posters will also be altered.

There is apparently going to be a refund scheme if fares are withdrawn. If you can still optionally travel first on a fast service I assume the fares will remain in place.

 

[Deepgreen]

The new timetable will cease to show [1] at the head of the column for affected trains, I expect station timetable posters will also be altered.

There is apparently going to be a refund scheme if fares are withdrawn. If you can still optionally travel first on a fast service I assume the fares will remain in place.

Not really what I would call helpful information - simply amending the detail on the timetables rather than advising us via, say, posters/in-train notices. No option for a fast train from Betchworth.

 

[berneyarms]

The new timetable pdfs are already available on the First Great Western website:
https://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/train-times-and-tickets/train-times/from-17-may-2015

 

[swt_passenger]

A poster in another forum has said that first class season ticket holders are being contacted directly about their future options.

 

[infobleep]

Could they keep first class as on Sundays trains stopping at Betchworth going to Gatwick Airport?

 

[Deepgreen]

The new timetable pdfs are already available on the First Great Western website:
https://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/train-times-and-tickets/train-times/from-17-may-2015

Thanks for that - the NDL timetable seems to have some errors, in that the 1743 and 1843 from Redhill (i.e. stoppers) are shown with a '1'. Assuming this is wrong, for M-F the only first class option from Betchworth is the 2349 - great!

 

[infobleep]

Thanks for that - the NDL timetable seems to have some errors, in that the 1743 and 1843 from Redhill (i.e. stoppers) are shown with a '1'. Assuming this is wrong, for M-F the only first class option from Betchworth is the 2349 - great!

On the Woking to Waterloo stopping services, the odd one which starts before Woking, some have first class on them in the peak. May be that will happen on NDL so that first class revenue can remain.

 

[Deepgreen]

On the Woking to Waterloo stopping services, the odd one which starts before Woking, some have first class on them in the peak. May be that will happen on NDL so that first class revenue can remain.

Well, if they have formally removed first from the stoppers (as denoted in the timetables - assuming they correct the two errors) then they will not be able to enforce first on those trains that are advertised as standard only even if they happen to provide a 166 instead a 165.

 

[infobleep]

Well, if they have formally removed first from the stoppers (as denoted in the timetables - assuming they correct the two errors) then they will not be able to enforce first on those trains that are advertised as standard only even if they happen to provide a 166 instead a 165.

May be they have only formally removed first from most of the stoppers but not all.

 

[Deepgreen]

May be they have only formally removed first from most of the stoppers but not all.

The 7 September FGW timetable shows all weekday stoppers as having no 1st, except the last trains of the day each way, which run to/from Gatwick. The timetable also shows the 1743 and 1843 stopping departures from Redhill as having 1st, but this must be an error as the incoming trains to form these two do not have 1st. So, not only have FGW failed to publicise the change effectively, they've published wrong information!

 

[infobleep]

The 7 September FGW timetable shows all weekday stoppers as having no 1st, except the last trains of the day each way, which run to/from Gatwick. The timetable also shows the 1743 and 1843 stopping departures from Redhill as having 1st, but this must be an error as the incoming trains to form these two do not have 1st. So, not only have FGW failed to publicise the change effectively, they've published wrong information!

I take your point. Given that first class is available once a day Monday to Friday, could they keep the first class fares but also offer a refund for those who no longer want a first class season ticket.

 

[181]

Does anyone know whether there are any significant changes to the actual times of the trains? Or is it just first class provision that's changing?

If there are changes to times, they haven't been well publicised. The fact that the printed NRT makes no mention of a September timetable change is (sadly) not surprising, but I would have expected some publicity at stations (I didn't notice anything at the 6 stations on affected routes that I've used in the past fortnight) and on the FGW website (there doesn't seem to be anything until you click through to the page of pdf links, and the link to that is 'Timetable from 17 May 2015', with nothing about September).

 

[berneyarms]

No changes to times on local services - just first class being removed.

 

[181]

No changes to times on local services - just first class being removed.

Thankyou, that's useful to know. I wonder why FGW felt the need to put two sets of pdfs on their website -- it would have been easier for them, and more useful to the public, if they'd just used footnotes to indicate the removal of first class in September.

 

[Deepgreen]

First day of the withdrawal of first class from the Reading to Redhill trains today (the stoppers), and my train had... first class! 165114 operated the 1113 departure from Betchworth and I assume it will have operated all day on the line.

 

[cactustwirly]

First day of the withdrawal of first class from the Reading to Redhill trains today (the stoppers), and my train had... first class! 165114 operated the 1113 departure from Betchworth and I assume it will have operated all day on the line.

Its likely it will be like the botched 166 declassfication

 

[JonathanH]

Its likely it will be like the botched 166 declassfication

Well, at least with 165s, they can't declassify first class one end, allow it to become vandalised, send the units off to Wolverton and then have first class swapped to the end which was initially declassified.

 

[Bishopstone]

Have the catering trolleys appeared on the Reading-Gatwicks today, or is that for later implementation?

 

[infobleep]

Have the catering trolleys appeared on the Reading-Gatwicks today, or is that for later implementation?

The 09.13 Guildford to Gatwick Airport certainly had one this morning so yes. The 19.13 Gatwick Airport to Guildford didn't so that must be one that isn't due to have such a thing.

I'm surprised they have returned given they got rid of them in the first place.

Govia Thameslink run services also don't have them any more so I was expecting a trend of get rid of and don't bring back.

 

[Bishopstone]

Govia Thameslink run services also don't have them any more so I was expecting a trend of get rid of and don't bring back.

I wonder whether the trolleys are the same as those used until July on Southern/GatEx, and indeed whether some of the Rail Gourmet staff have moved over to the North Downs.

 

[infobleep]

I wonder whether the trolleys are the same as those used until July on Southern/GatEx, and indeed whether some of the Rail Gourmet staff have moved over to the North Downs.

They looked similar. Reminded me of South West Trains trolleys but I didn't look at it too closely.

 

[Deepgreen]

Another stopper - the 0919 from Betchworth - was a 166 today - so first class again! I heard announcements about catering trollies on the Gatwick route - can't imagine how they'll get those up and down the train crowded with luggag, kids, bikes etc!

 

[jimm]

Another stopper - the 0919 from Betchworth - was a 166 today - so first class again! I heard announcements about catering trollies on the Gatwick route - can't imagine how they'll get those up and down the train crowded with luggag, kids, bikes etc!

Well they've managed for more than 20 years to Oxford and on the Cotswold Line.

 

[infobleep]

Another stopper - the 0919 from Betchworth - was a 166 today - so first class again! I heard announcements about catering trollies on the Gatwick route - can't imagine how they'll get those up and down the train crowded with luggag, kids, bikes etc!

They use to have them.

Also the 18.30 Waterloo to Portsmouth Harbour service has a trolley. It simply stays in the middle of the train in one of the vestibules and people go to it if they wish to do so.

I don't know how popular it is vers those which move down the train but South West Trains haven't got rid of if so it must do OK or that or it's in their franchise agreement and it doesn't matter whether it's profitable it must exist.

 

[swt_passenger]

...or that or it's in their franchise agreement and it doesn't matter whether it's profitable it must exist.

There is no catering requirement at all in the SWT franchise agreement, it is entirely a commercial option.

 

[infobleep]

There is no catering requirement at all in the SWT franchise agreement, it is entirely a commercial option.

That's interesting. Then they must be making money from it, which means not being able to move down a train isn't always a barrier to having catering on a train.

 

[hassaanhc]

That's interesting. Then they must be making money from it, which means not being able to move down a train isn't always a barrier to having catering on a train.

When I used the 1759 from Bournemouth as far as Woking on Tuesday 18 August (during the £20 offer), the trolley stopped every 2-3 rows of seats for someone to buy something. Must have made quite a bit of money!