University of York bus services

[tbone]

As many will recall, York Pullman launched a Unibus 44 service between the University and the City Centre, with funding from the uni, a number of years ago. Now operated by Transdev, the services has developed and now runs with 11 buses, with a UB1 shuttle bus also being provided by an all electric Solo SR.

However, from next academic year, First will become the University's preferred transport provider. They are to run double deck buses every 6 minutes, with a UOY66 brand. They will also have permission to run services along the 'bottom road' of Heslington East campus, which Transdev will no longer be able to use. The UB1 service will also transfer.

Transdev have launched a 'unibus-here to stay' campaign in a bid to retain the service.

 

[Deerfold]

Transdev have launched a 'unibus-here to stay' campaign in a bid to retain the service.

It doesn't seem to be a bid to retain the service but to make it clear they're not going to be stopping running.

http://www.yorkbus.co.uk/news.jsp?newsID=1419

 

[Tetchytyke]

Presumably the University of York can stop Transdev entering their property, so it should be interesting...

 

[tbone]

Presumably the University of York can stop Transdev entering their property, so it should be interesting...

The entire route is on public roads with the exception of the Heslington East road that the 44 currently uses. Transdev will no longer be able to use this road and first will start using it instead

 

[IanD]

If an operator is willing to run the service without subsidy, one would have to question why the University of York needs to squander what is partly public money subsidising the other operator.

Also only allowing one operator on the campus sounds a bit like that illegal deal Luton airport did last year or so.

 

[Skutter]

If an operator is willing to run the service without subsidy, one would have to question why the University of York needs to squander what is partly public money subsidising the other operator.

Also only allowing one operator on the campus sounds a bit like that illegal deal Luton airport did last year or so.

They might be willing to try, but can they give the same service guarantees as before, for however many years First have? The subsidy allows free travel within campus and was a planning requirement when the University expanded.

At the moment First also go on-campus but past Badger Hill, I would expect Transdev to switch to that route to pick up the trade which First will be missing.

For a bit of history - this is the route on which First used to have a monopoly, with rapidly- rising passenger numbers and fares. First chose it to launch their ftr service - new quick access vehicles, traffic priority, lots of publicity. This was in partnership with York Council, which assured lots of negative local press before it even started. The hardware and operating methods hadn't been tested and completely fell apart on launch day. After a while the service settled down, but Pullman were able to come along with some old buses and undercut the fares, passengers switched in droves. First moved the expensive vehicles away and matched the fares, and it's all been quiet for a few years!

 

[yorkie]

Bus wars are not very common in York, though First did have a battle in the late 1990s vs 'Bus Force', which was also competing with the Number 4 route, though I think this was only on the western side of the route, I don't think Bus Force ventured to the University.

The usual trick is to make your bus turn up just before your rivals

 

[Tetchytyke]

Also only allowing one operator on the campus sounds a bit like that illegal deal Luton airport did last year or so.

There wasn't anything wrong with having an exclusivity deal, the issue at Luton was how the Airport tendered for it. Basically Luton Airport started with the intention of banning Arriva The Shires from the airport because of a previous contract dispute.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Bus wars are not very common in York, though First did have a battle in the late 1990s vs 'Bus Force', which was also competing with the Number 4 route, though I think this was only on the western side of the route, I don't think Bus Force ventured to the University.

The usual trick is to make your bus turn up just before your rivals

There have been several skirmishes in York over the years with Glenn Coaches and most extensively with Reynard Buses/Target Travel though can't recall if the University was a battleground in either of those

 

[tbone]

There wasn't anything wrong with having an exclusivity deal, the issue at Luton was how the Airport tendered for it. Basically Luton Airport started with the intention of banning Arriva The Shires from the airport because of a previous contract dispute.

There were two issues, one with the tenderng(which was dismissed) and one to do with a TFEU Article 102 complaint regarding Luton Airport's abuse of a dominant position to restrict competition. This was upheld by the High Court, hence why Arriva are able to run to the airport now.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The abuse was the way they manipulated the tender process to exclude Arriva, and the way they continued to allow Easybus to operate the minibuses outside of it.

Having preferred suppliers and exclusive access isn't an issue. If it was, railway franchising would be unlawful.

 

[mikeg]

I wonder if this is the beginning of the university bus being excluded from PlusBus again, as it was in the FTR4 days?

If Transdev are so angry, what would stop them continuing to run it on a commercial basis? (oh yes, apart from money).

I seriously question though whether the University really needs a 'preferred transport partner' in such a large location. When I lived in Keele, a much smaller place, services were run either commercially or local authority tendered only and we got a fairly comprehensive service out of First and D&G. Only gripe was when First withdrew the Silverdale service 24 just after students had sorted out accommodation in Silverdale!
Well, there were the odd arrangements with First here and there, and a tendered service to the medical campus, which started in my last year but the University never needed to get as involved as York does.

 

[Deerfold]

I wonder if this is the beginning of the university bus being excluded from PlusBus again, as it was in the FTR4 days?

If Transdev are so angry, what would stop them continuing to run it on a commercial basis? (oh yes, apart from money).

Who says Transdev are angry? And they are continuing running on a commercial basis (apart from one road the University will no longer let them use) - I made that clear in the second post.

 

[tbone]

The 44 will continue on a commercial basis but will run to Heslington East interchange rather than via Lakeside Way.

The contract with Transdev (and soon to be first) is a package along with the UB1, HB1 and CB2 services, along with the free campus to campus part of the 44/66. First also refused to run to Heslington East when the campus was first opened which led to Unibus' creation hence why the University has, up until now, encouraged students, staff and visitors to use the 44.

 

[SCH117X]

Seems to be a lot of dissatisfaction with First's service
http://www.yorkvision.co.uk/news/si...-as-yusu-admits-significant-issues/26/11/2015

Angry passengers have spoken out against the ‘your bus 66’ service.
Many students claim the First-operated bus service rarely turns up on time, and when they do there are often two or three buses together.
Masters student Stephen Harper said: “Every time I’ve used it in the past two weeks it’s been at least 5 minutes late, at worst around 15 minutes.
“Worst was when I was a few seconds away from the bus stop, so I sprinted to catch it, caught it before he’d moved more than 2 inches, he didn’t stop, I kept pace with the bus doors for 20 odd feet until I gave up and he refused to stop.”
YUSU President ben Leatham said: “It is obvious from talking to students and from using the service myself that there are significant issues with the 66 bus service.”
Third year Felix Aylett said: “The 66 bus service is simply awful.....

 

[Bungle965]

I have traveled on both services know, and i have to say that i prefer the Transdev, i found the drivers much more friendly, USB charging is also a bonus as well. One thing though, i wonder if they are thinking about replacing those buses that they are using on that service as they are getting on a bit now.
Sam

 

[yorkie]

I've used both services, but only a few times so not really able to provide a proper comparison. Both were busy. I got the impression many people get the first bus that comes at bus stops that are common to both routes.

 

[carlberry]

Masters student Stephen Harper said: “Every time I’ve used it in the past two weeks it’s been at least 5 minutes late, at worst around 15 minutes.
“Worst was when I was a few seconds away from the bus stop, so I sprinted to catch it, caught it before he’d moved more than 2 inches, he didn’t stop, I kept pace with the bus doors for 20 odd feet until I gave up and he refused to stop.”

I assume his masters degree dosent include the connection between buses running late and having to stop ever time somebody turns up just as you've left the stop to try to recover lost time!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I assume his masters degree dosent include the connection between buses running late and having to stop ever time somebody turns up just as you've left the stop to try to recover lost time!

Surely if the bus was late "every time" then he would have had no right in catching it then?

 

[the101]

Surely if the bus was late "every time" then he would have had no right in catching it then?

Exactly right, if the bus was on time he would have missed without doubt on the occasion of the 'I was running and the driver drove off anyway' tale. Notwithstanding that accounts of missed buses are often suitably embellished to suit the teller's point of view anyway, it's always much easier to blame someone else.

 

[SCH117X]

First are cancelling the 56 from 31 Jan

 

[yorkie]

First are cancelling the 56 from 31 Jan

I assume you mean the 66? Already? Do you have a source? What will be replacing it?

 

[tbone]

The 56 is another route that runs from Heslington East to Heslington West, and then goes down Lawrence Street and Walmgate, past King's Manor and on to Foss Islands. It uses 1 branded single decker.

 

[yorkie]

Ah I didn't know the 56 existed. I found a link to this but the page won't load for me.

 

[Deerfold]

Ah I didn't know the 56 existed. I found a link to this but the page won't load for me.

Any more luck with this?
https://www.firstgroup.com/york/more/your-bus-66-and-university-services/your-bus-56#content

 

[Volvodart]

http://www.theyorker.co.uk/news/triumph-for-student-union-as-first-returns-56-bus/

Swift triumph for student union as First returns No. 56 Bus
JACK HARVEY CAMPUS, CITY, NEWS, YUSU DECEMBER 17TH, 2015

In the space of hours, First has cancelled its plans to oust its No. 56 Bus service after receiving heavy criticism from the university, its student union and bus users.

At 15:07 today, President of the University of York Student Union Ben Leatham announced via social media that the No. 56 Bus had been cancelled without the knowledge and consent of the student union and Graduate Students’ Association.

However, at 18:01, Mr. Leatham stated on Facebook that First has bowed to the pressure of the university, its union and students and will no longer be asking the local council to deregister the No. 56.

Mr. Leatham wrote:

I was just in a meeting with David Duncan, the Registrar and Secretary, when he got a phone call from one of the managers at First. He expressed his shock at the level of backlash regarding the cancellation of the 56 (if they had consulted with us they would have known) and as a result they are withdrawing their submission to the Council to deregister the 56. Absolutely fantastic news! It will continue to run until at the very least the end of the academic year.
First had previously cited the low usage of the No. 56 bus, a service subsidised by the private student accommodation company Student Castle, as the reason for its cancellation. However, the original message of cancellation of the service has been removed from the First website.

The speed at which First retracted its decision has been cited as a demonstration of the power of the student union representing its students. Many students passed on their complaints to the YUSU President, who sent them to First.

Mr. Leatham will be investigating the length of the No. 56 bus’s contract, but promises that it will not be terminated before the end of the academic year. For further enquiries, please contact [email protected].

 

[SCH117X]

Trandev are withdrawing their service after Dec 4
http://www.yorkbus.co.uk/news.jsp?newsID=1782

 

[Bungle965]

Trandev are withdrawing their service after Dec 4
http://www.yorkbus.co.uk/news.jsp?newsID=1782

Yes just noticed that myself and was about to post, but I see that you have beaten me to it!
Sam

 

[backontrack]

What a shame. First do not deserve this contract.

Even worse - this means no direct bus between Acomb and the Uni, unless First are willing to combine the 66 and the 4.

 

[ooo]

What a shame. First do not deserve this contract.

Even worse - this means no direct bus between Acomb and the Uni, unless First are willing to combine the 66 and the 4.

Can I ask why you feel that First are not worthy of the contract?