Southern DOO: ASLEF members vote 79.1% for revised deal

[grumblingalong]

you actually sound like a gtr manager tbh...

dive dive dive we've been infiltrated

 

[Chrisgr31]

Some drivers actually enjoy seeing who is getting in & out of their DOO trains at stations. It is a break from looking ahead at the road. It is not all grind.

I will be amazed if drivers or guards come to that enjoy seeing who is getting on and off their train.

 

[Secrettraindri]

Will the substantial number of Southern drivers in links & at depots that drive DOO all the time,& also Thameslink drivers who are all DOO,be prepared to go on strike,lose money,forgo family travel benefits, & free car parking, so that other drivers who do little or no DOO work can continue to do less work than them?
They may. I don't know.

Some drivers actually enjoy seeing who is getting in & out of their DOO trains at stations. It is a break from looking ahead at the road. It is not all grind.

I think looking at the passengers versus knowing the presence of a guard reduces their personal liability massively might sharpen the mind.

 

[A-driver]

Will the substantial number of Southern drivers in links & at depots that drive DOO all the time,& also Thameslink drivers who are all DOO,be prepared to go on strike,lose money,forgo family travel benefits, & free car parking, so that other drivers who do little or no DOO work can continue to do less work than them?

They may. I don't know.



Some drivers actually enjoy seeing who is getting in & out of their DOO trains at stations. It is a break from looking ahead at the road. It is not all grind.

It's only southern and Gatwick being balloted as Thameslink and GN are not harmonised so, as far as this ballot goes, a seperate company. So Thameslink drivers won't be involved in strike action.

As I say, drivers see this ballot as about the tearing up and ignoring of agreements and refusal to negotiate or acknowledge them here, not specifically to do with DOO but with the extension of it being forced upon them.

 

[hello]

It's highly unlikely a rest day ban and strike would happen simultaneously. Normally rest days continue to help fund strike action.
.

i would have thought both go in hand in hand, what would be the point of shafting the company one day, but helping them out the next?

 

[Chrisgr31]

I have had a response to me email to Southern asking for details of the number of guards they currently have as I wanted to be able to compare it to the number of OBS in a year.

Needless to say they haven't actually answered the question, nor said they can't provide the information. What they have said though is that not all their services will have the "privilege" of an OBS it will just be the the services and routes that customers feel improving the most in terms of customer services.

Fairly sure thats not what Southern are saying as I thought they were saying all services that currently have a guard will have an OBS.

 

[A-driver]

i would have thought both go in hand in hand, what would be the point of shafting the company one day, but helping them out the next?

Not always. Strikes may be better supported if staff arnt loosing as much money-ie work RDs to make up for lost wages. All depends how the ballot returns and if Aslef decide to take strike action, action short of or both.

 

[ComUtoR]

I will be amazed if drivers or guards come to that enjoy seeing who is getting on and off their train.

There is a lady who gets on a train every day from B to O. She has a gorgeous pair of legs. I love taking that train

There is a gentleman who gets of at B (a different one) who always says thanks. It is an absolute pleasure to drive him home when I see him. There is also an older lady who also says thank you at B (different again) Many Driver have commented about her.

Would any of those change if I had a Guard ? No, and just because I enjoy my job doesn't mean I wouldn't want a Guard on every single service.

 

[playmore64]

Almost there:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/113871

 

[Monty]

This image was doing the rounds on Facebook book, more lies from Southern blaming it's conductors for the cancellation of trains.

The great debate on DOO aside, the way this company has actively saught to vilianize it's employees is nothing short of dispicable.

 

[D1009]

dive dive dive we've been infiltrated

Is anyone allowed to put the other side of the argument on this thread? Just as well people are attempting to, because otherwise it would be very boring.

 

[grumblingalong]

Is anyone allowed to put the other side of the argument on this thread? Just as well people are attempting to, because otherwise it would be very boring.

I was joking, are jokes not allowed? Otherwise it would be very boring.

 

[Flamingo]

Is anyone allowed to put the other side of the argument on this thread? Just as well people are attempting to, because otherwise it would be very boring.

Of course people are allowed to put arguments forward. But it is also interesting to know WHO is putting an argument forward, as it allowes everybody to know what agenda may be behind the argument, or indeed, if the poster is posting in good faith.

Some posts are so close to the GTR official position, and from posters without any history of membership / contribution to the site, that it is worth questioning the motives and background of those site members.

 

[Agent_c]

Of course people are allowed to put arguments forward. But it is also interesting to know WHO is putting an argument forward, as it allowes everybody to know what agenda may be behind the argument, or indeed, if the poster is posting in good faith.

Some posts are so close to the GTR official position, and from posters without any history of membership / contribution to the site, that it is worth questioning the motives and background of those site members.

Perhaps it is worth investigating which IP addresses those posts are being made by, and if there is a link to Govia HQ....

 

[ModernRailways]

Perhaps it is worth investigating which IP addresses those posts are being made by, and if there is a link to Govia HQ....

That's going a bit far... If Govia want to get involved and argue their case then let them. It's not going to work out well for them when they immediately get hit with counter arguments telling them they're thinking is quite simply stupid.

Is there any forum rule that companies can't get involved? If anything it helps us see the other side of the coin and makes the topic less boring since it gives something for people to discuss.

Just for the record, I'm against what Govia are doing. But people should still be able to put forward their reasons/arguments, free speech and all that!

 

[ainsworth74]

Is there any forum rule that companies can't get involved?

Nope. If a TOC ever wanted to get involved then they're more than welcome to do so.

 

[sarahj]

Found on twitter.
A bit of info:

And of that 4.

1 Due to his child having major heart surgery.
2. Has Diabetes,
Not sure about other 2.

 

[BRblue]

Found on twitter.
A bit of info:

And of that 4.

1 Due to his child having major heart surgery.
2. Has Diabetes,
Not sure about other 2.

I think that says it all... the way GTR have behaved by blaming staff sickness for nearly every cancellation is despicable!

 

[infobleep]

This image was doing the rounds on Facebook book, more lies from Southern blaming it's conductors for the cancellation of trains.

The great debate on DOO aside, the way this company has actively saught to vilianize it's employees is nothing short of dispicable.

It's a shame they didn't explain why they didn't in their post as that would have been very interesting.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[bb21]

This image was doing the rounds on Facebook book, more lies from Southern blaming it's conductors for the cancellation of trains.

The great debate on DOO aside, the way this company has actively saught to vilianize it's employees is nothing short of dispicable.

Funny that it went down in delay attribution as a rostering error (TI code), although it would appear that GTR are disputing it for some reason. (May not be the cause code they are disputing but interesting to see what they accept at the end.)

 

[infobleep]

I think that says it all... the way GTR have behaved by blaming staff sickness for nearly every cancellation is despicable!

To be fair the note about each cancellation says shortage of conductors.

It's clesrly just the general note that is misleading.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Funny that it went down in delay attribution as a rostering error (TI code), although it would appear that GTR are disputing it for some reason. (May not be the cause code they are disputing but interesting to see what they accept at the end.)

Interesting. Can staff dispute such things? So I disagree with the people working in delay attribution.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[tony6499]

Just shows you how incompetent Southern are at rostering if 4 Conductors off sick causes such chaos, looks like they are cancelling trains for no good reason but to use it to blame Conductors and use it to further their argument

 

[tsr]

Just shows you how incompetent Southern are at rostering if 4 Conductors off sick causes such chaos, looks like they are cancelling trains for no good reason but to use it to blame Conductors and use it to further their argument

A much, much higher proportion of conductors has gone sick elsewhere, though. The explanation is certainly correct for some routes. The problem is that it (or its indirect effects) has been used as a blanket explanation for services where it is totally irrelevant, too.

I would say, re. Brighton, that is an unusually low number of conductors sick compared with some other large depots, so well done to them. Though it should be said that the levels will fluctuate throughout any given day, as the printed weekly roster only shows those sick at the time it was created, and can't predict the day-to-day circumstances of people calling in (duh).

 

[Tetchytyke]

I think that says it all... the way GTR have behaved by blaming staff sickness for nearly every cancellation is despicable!

Funny you should mention that, here's an amusing little twitter conversation last week:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=517486725103503&set=o.483517415132158&type=3&theater

The issues at GTR have nothing to do with "sickness" and everything to do with the fact that a) GTR were reliant on rest day working to run the service and b) GTR have prohibited all strikers from working their rest days (even if they wanted to...which they don't).

Now why on earth would GTR deliberately try and sink their service...

 

[bb21]

Interesting. Can staff dispute such things? So I disagree with the people working in delay attribution.

No unfortunately. These matters are the job of TDAs.

 

[craigybagel]

No unfortunately. These matters are the job of TDAs.

But the staff can argue with the TDA's. My manager and I had an interesting month long battle with maintenance via the TDA's last year before it was finally resolved in our favour

Back to the issue at hand - ASLEF ballot due today isn't it?

 

[Agent_c]

That's going a bit far... If Govia want to get involved and argue their case then let them. It's not going to work out well for them when they immediately get hit with counter arguments telling them they're thinking is quite simply stupid.

Is there any forum rule that companies can't get involved? If anything it helps us see the other side of the coin and makes the topic less boring since it gives something for people to discuss.

Just for the record, I'm against what Govia are doing. But people should still be able to put forward their reasons/arguments, free speech and all that!

By all means let them speak, but just make it clear who they speak for, that's all I'm saying.

 

[bb21]

But the staff can argue with the TDA's. My manager and I had an interesting month long battle with maintenance via the TDA's last year before it was finally resolved in our favour

Back to the issue at hand - ASLEF ballot due today isn't it?

Well when you delve into the politics of it all, it all gets a little, erm, "complicated" shall I just say.

 

[Tetchytyke]

By all means let them speak, but just make it clear who they speak for, that's all I'm saying.

They may not be able to- most of us have to be evasive about who employs us (even if you're in a different business like me)- but some of the posts on here do look like astroturfing.

 

[ComUtoR]

Well when you delve into the politics of it all, it all gets a little, erm, "complicated" shall I just say.

I had my train attributed incorrectly a few days ago. Granted I knocked it back to our admin guys, but once I've done my report it vanishes (from my perspective). It's rare that any delays get kicked back and forth to frontline workers and it appears (from my perspective) that its all done in the most part, back of house.