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Thamesdown Transport taken over by Go Ahead

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BPWUser1

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Being reported by BBC Points West, and on the BBC local live for WOE.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-38852750

One of the last council-owned bus companies in the UK has been sold after the authority said it had "incurred losses over the past five years".

Swindon Borough Council said the sale of Thamesdown Transport to operator Go South Coast "offered the best value".

Councillor David Renard said it was in the "best interests" of bus users and Thamesdown Transport employees.

Go South Coast, said it would be "business as usual as far as our customers are concerned".
Conservative council leader Mr Renard said they were "one of the few local authorities in the country to still own a local bus company".

But "despite continued financial support from the council", Thamesdown Transport had "incurred losses over the over the past five years due to difficult trading conditions".

He said: "We have had to change the way we provide services across the council while balancing the ever increasing demand on adults' and children's services."


Andrew Wickham, from Go South Coast, said it was an "excellent opportunity" to develop services in Swindon and north Wiltshire....
 
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overthewater

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I wonder who else bidded for the company.


http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/..._Thamesdown_sale_revealed/?commentSort=oldest


THE financial plight of Thamesdown Transport was so serious that the council was urged to sell the company by March or risk it collapsing, according to information which has now come to light.

On Wednesday evening, senior Swindon borough ouncillors met behind closed doors to approve an offer from the Go Ahead group worth £7.2m.

The sale of Thamesdown Transport’s Barnfield Road depot was also approved with a separate price tag of £4m.

The deal with Go South Coast, which operates a number of south coast bus and coach companies, was officially signed yesterday.

The decision to sell the council-owned bus firm was taken amid concerns about its future financial viability.

Poor performance figures have been publicised before but now the Adver can reveal just how serious the problems were at Thamesdown.

Negotiations over the future of the company have been shrouded in secrecy, staff have been threatened with dismissal and the council has conducted their business behind a confidentiality shield.

Thamesdown bosses and council officers were concerned that should the scale of the financial woes become public prior to a deal being completed, rival firms might move in in a hostile manner.

The company was on track to record a loss of £149,000 at the end of the current financial year — this would have taken its combined losses over the past five years to almost £2m.

An annual management fee that Thamesdown was supposed to pay the council was waived in 2013/14 and no payments have been made since.

With the future looking similarly bleak and with no clear path to profit, the council sought expert advice last year on what to do next.

They were urged to sell the company, to do so as soon as possible, and certainly before the end of March.

Accordingly, bids were sought from established bus operators around the UK and of those that came forward, Go Ahead’s was the most attractive.

The Adver understands that the initial offer was in the region of £8.5m.

But due diligence visits later uncovered staff shortages in the engineering and cleaning departments, issues with cleanliness, faults with equipment and mechanical problems with vehicles that all pushed the value down to the £7.2m agreed by the cabinet on Wednesday.

That figure was expected to fall slightly further still prior to the signing of the deal depending on the final position of the company.

But while the council may be getting in the region of £7m initially, by the time financial obligations and pension requirements left behind by Thamesdown are accounted for, only about half of that, between £3m and £4m, will remain.

The separate £4m from the Barnfield Road depot sale is expected to be reinvested as part of the council’s commercial investment strategy.

As part of the deal, the council has sought assurances that Go Ahead will not sell the depot within the first five years.

Existing routes are expected to continue as advertised, services funded by the council will carry on in accordance with the local bus strategy agreed last year.

Swindon Borough Council said today that councillors agreed to sell the council’s shares in Thamesdown and to sell the bus company to Go South Coast at Wednesday night’s Cabinet meeting to "ensure Thamesdown Transport has a sustainable future".

A spokesman said: "The bus company has incurred losses over the past five years due to difficult trading conditions, despite continued financial support from the council.

"And with the council also facing challenging financial pressures of its own, a review of the bus company concluded that the sale of Thamesdown Transport to an established operator would be in the best interest of council taxpayers, Thamesdown’s staff and its customers.

"Following a competitive process Go South Coast’s bid was assessed as offering the best value to the Council, which wholly owns the company.

"The offer from Go South Coast, the terms of which are commercially confidential, was for all the cuncil’s shares and the freehold of Thamesdown’s Barnfield depot."

Coun David Renard, leader of Swindon Borough Council, said: “We were one of the few local authorities in the country to still own a local bus company, but the council is operating in a really challenging financial climate at the moment and we do not have the resources to continue to support Thamesdown Transport as we have been doing in recent years.

“We have had to change the way we provide services across the council while balancing the ever increasing demand on adults’ and children’s services.

“We believe this deal is in the best interests of local bus users as it secures the financial sustainability of the bus company, offers the best long-term security for Thamesdown Transport’s employees, and will provide vital investment.

"Go South Coast’s expertise will also ensure customers continue to benefit from a high quality bus service.

“The council will arrange a joint meeting with Go South Coast and bus user groups in the coming weeks so customers have the opportunity to learn about future investment plans and raise any issues or concerns that they may have.”

Go South Coast managing director Andrew Wickham said today: “This is an excellent opportunity for us to develop the services on offer to local people here in Swindon and north Wiltshire.

“We’re keen to point out that it’s business as usual as far as our customers are concerned. Any tickets or passes they have will still be valid, and our 85 buses will continue to serve existing routes with no change to timings.

Bus company sale given go-ahead
“That said, our ultimate aim is to enhance the services on offer here. As part of this, we will be consulting with local people and listening to the needs of those who travel on our buses.

"Our team will be engaging with representatives of local bus users about our plans to invest in local services.

“We are excited to be providing vital sustainable transport in this region, and I have no doubt our talented team will make a complete success of our new venture.

“I look forward to meeting with our local customers and hearing their views over the coming weeks and months."

The firm has appointed Alex Chutter, currently operations manager at sister company Salisbury Reds, to take the reins at Thamesdown as general manager.
 

ChathillMan

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I think Its in safe hands with Go Ahead to be fair.

Stagecoach would have done ok but I imagine completion authorities would have been in there like a shot. Least it isn't ARRIVA or First
 
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pdeaves

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Stagecoach would have done ok but I imagine completion authorities would have been in there like a shot.

Exactly. For the benefit of those not in the know, Thamesdown and Stagecoach are the two biggest operators in Swindon by a very long way. The two operators do overlap a bit but mainly they serve different parts of the town.
 

baza585

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Always thought Stagecoach might have gotten that one.

Impossible because the CMA would almost certainly not allow it.

What will be interesting is Stagecoach's reaction to Go Ahead taking over. There was no point in them spending money attacking Thamesdown because they couldn't take it over; but they may decide now to try to selectively compete on Thamesdown's most profitable routes (if they have any................).
 

Mutant Lemming

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At the high point of 1966 there were 99 municipals in the UK now it's down to 10. I think places lost a little bit of their identity and character once their municipal bus services disappeared.
 

Busaholic

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Impossible because the CMA would almost certainly not allow it.

What will be interesting is Stagecoach's reaction to Go Ahead taking over. There was no point in them spending money attacking Thamesdown because they couldn't take it over; but they may decide now to try to selectively compete on Thamesdown's most profitable routes (if they have any................).

In Plymouth (the other municipal bought by Go-Ahead) the situation when Stagecoach took on First's interests in the city was that both sides immediately agreed a truce in competing services!
 

overthewater

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You could add a few more to that.

There is talk Rosso is also not in a healthy point, but why have there expanded then.

NOTE:There is no talk of sell off or anything like that, but council bus companies are having a tough time since their have no one to help bail them out.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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There is talk Rosso is also not in a healthy point, but why have there expanded then.

NOTE:There is no talk of sell off or anything like that, but council bus companies are having a tough time since their have no one to help bail them out.

Where have Rosso expanded?

Council companies tend to have limited operational patches and are also perhaps constrained by the relationship with their main shareholder. The current pressures on the industry have claimed many victims with firms going out of business - council firms aren't immune from those.
 

overthewater

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Where have Rosso expanded?

Council companies tend to have limited operational patches and are also perhaps constrained by the relationship with their main shareholder. The current pressures on the industry have claimed many victims with firms going out of business - council firms aren't immune from those.

Moving south into former First areas, where First has pulled out.

I'm surprised the none of the English council have joined together to create single company to deal with many of the back office functions to help stream line the operations or buy buses in bulk etc.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Moving south into former First areas, where First has pulled out.

I'm surprised the none of the English council have joined together to create single company to deal with many of the back office functions to help stream line the operations or buy buses in bulk etc.

Rosso haven't appreciably expanded South; they've been Bury and Rochdale for many years.
 

F262YTJ

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Blackpool Transport seems to have turned a corner with the massive investment in 30 E400s this year plus the orders over the last 2 years.

I'd say Halton and Warrington are 2 to watch at present.
 

TAS

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I also wonder about the long-term future of Ipswich Buses. The long-standing Managing Director retired in May after 25 years in the role, only for his replacement to resign in December.

Hopefully this isn't a sign of serious underlying problems, but superficially it doesn't look good.
 

overthewater

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Blackpool Transport seems to have turned a corner with the massive investment in 30 E400s this year plus the orders over the last 2 years.

I'd say Halton and Warrington are 2 to watch at present.

Who would want want either one of them? Arriva would not be allowed either. Again would a merger but off the cards just to help reduced back office functions?


I also wonder about the long-term future of Ipswich Buses. The long-standing Managing Director retired in May after 25 years in the role, only for his replacement to resign in December.

Hopefully this isn't a sign of serious underlying problems, but superficially it doesn't look good.

I doubt there is any underlying problems, maybe he didn't like it or he had different view from the council.
 

Robertj21a

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As far as I can see, most of the 10 remaining 'municipals' look rather vulnerable . Probably only Lothian, Nottingham and Reading appear fairly 'safe' for the longer term. I'd put Warrington, Rosso and Ipswich fairly high up the list.
 

winston270twm

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Who would want want either one of them? Arriva would not be allowed either. Again would a merger but off the cards just to help reduced back office functions?

I'd have thought that Warrington especially may interest Rotala if it came on the market, i.e to bolster their NW presence south of Manchester & potentially even Halton.

Another option for Halton may be D&G which could tkae them further north.
 

AaronR

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I also wonder about the long-term future of Ipswich Buses. The long-standing Managing Director retired in May after 25 years in the role, only for his replacement to resign in December.

Hopefully this isn't a sign of serious underlying problems, but superficially it doesn't look good.

No it doesnt and they have not advertised for a replacement yet apparently. The last MD done untold damage apparently, especially to staff morale, drivers have left to go to First in Ipswich, that would have never happened in the past! He scrapped things like the Xmas shopping excursions, the Real Ale tours for Suffolk Camra, made a lot of unpopular changed to the routes and schedules and was a contributing factor in why IB have lost the Park and Ride contract apparently. The fleet is looking much more down at heel recently as well, no further repaints etc
 

SCH117X

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Transdev have a large stake in Nottingham which, unless they sold that stake, means (off topic) Transdev would be an unlikely buyer of Trent Barton should the latter come up for sale.
 

Busaholic

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As far as I can see, most of the 10 remaining 'municipals' look rather vulnerable . Probably only Lothian, Nottingham and Reading appear fairly 'safe' for the longer term. I'd put Warrington, Rosso and Ipswich fairly high up the list.

I concur with that. Cardiff might also be included for political/devolution reasons. rather than pure bus reasons, should such exist.
 

Mutant Lemming

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I concur with that. Cardiff might also be included for political/devolution reasons. rather than pure bus reasons, should such exist.

Political reasons helped save Ipswich and Rossendale in the past as the issue of keeping their buses 'local' was an issue in local council elections in both Rossendale and Ipswich.
 

Ginga

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I did say to Jon Collins (Nottingham City Council leader) sell off Nct. As it would raise around £34m, at a time when council budgets are being cut. He said no as it would lead to higher fares and Network cuts. Going back a few years ,Nct had a large Pension hole that need plugging. The Enviro 200's are/were (not sure if they are payed off yet) rentals from a Spanish bank. They are also moving onto a "budget" brand tyre . Alex Hornby and David (whats his name) the commerical Manager at Nct. Signed away the Bsog payments in Nottingham ,in exchange for £4m and "goverment better bus funding" that they said would lead to a 5% increase in Passengers.
 

overthewater

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You have to wonder if some of the changes are just to keep the CMM happy. oh look a big player has come to town let shake it up...
 

Baxenden Bank

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I did say to Jon Collins (Nottingham City Council leader) sell off Nct. As it would raise around £34m, at a time when council budgets are being cut. He said no as it would lead to higher fares and Network cuts. Going back a few years ,Nct had a large Pension hole that need plugging. The Enviro 200's are/were (not sure if they are payed off yet) rentals from a Spanish bank. They are also moving onto a "budget" brand tyre . Alex Hornby and David (whats his name) the commerical Manager at Nct. Signed away the Bsog payments in Nottingham ,in exchange for £4m and "goverment better bus funding" that they said would lead to a 5% increase in Passengers.

David Astill - formerly of First in the Potteries.

and mentioned on the same forum thread as Jeremy Cooper - also formerly of First in the Potteries (or perhaps PMT Ltd) - recently departed Ipswich.

It's a small world.
 
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