Class 707 - SWT: Introduction into service

[Roast Veg]

The difference is "internally" meaning interior design from a passenger perspective, versus "internal" meaning structural design, underfloor arrangements, and electrical/otms systems. Distinguishing a 377/6 or 377/7 from a 379 is a lot more important if you're an engineer.

 

[physics34]

Yes the 707s are arguably different enough to warrant their own class number. The irony is that the 377/6 and 377/7 subclasses should not really be 377s !. They come somewhere between a 379 and a 387 in terms of similarities. There is a different thread with some comment on that somewhere.

yep..... i was always told that units with in the same class number (even sub class) have to be compatible with each other (mechanically) ..... in which case the 377 subclasses are.... and that is why the early south central 375s had to be changed to 377s when they got dellners fitted.

Classes MAYBE compatible even which different class numbers.

 

[David Goddard]

A pair of 707s on test have just passed Bracknell en route to Reading.
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W38687/2017/02/13/advanced

Returning on
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W31091/2017/02/13/advanced

 

[spark001uk]

A pair of 707s on test have just passed Bracknell en route to Reading.
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W38687/2017/02/13/advanced

Returning on
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W31091/2017/02/13/advanced

They seem to be doing all day again back and forth to Staines, finishing off with a run up the main line with 5Q65 to Wimbledon Pk. They did similar on Saturday.
In fact I can see an extra one just put in for this week, 5Q40 Clapham Yd to Woking via Chertsey/Byfleet curve. That'll only be the second time on the Chertsey branch, and the first time between Addlestone Jn and Woking.
.

 

[WWTownEnth]

Does anyone know when the next delivery is due?

 

[Class377/5]

Does anyone know when the next delivery is due?

Roughly every fortnight once the programme gets going. Shouldn't be too long now.

 

[spark001uk]

Two Reading diagrams on the go now, 5Q61 currently on way from Clapham to Reading.

 

[pompeyfan]

Are they not a little bit brave sending them out on the mainline during daylight? If one fails it's going to be a pain to sort out.

 

[Monty]

Are they not a little bit brave sending them out on the mainline during daylight? If one fails it's going to be a pain to sort out.

They did the same with the 458/5 testing and it never was a serious issue.

 

[Class377/5]

Are they not a little bit brave sending them out on the mainline during daylight? If one fails it's going to be a pain to sort out.

they run for a few thousand miles already so where the issue? So far in all of Thameslink/Siemens commissioning where only been one or two incidents where a commissioning train has come to grief.

But the test pratice is no different to anyone else's testing with the 387s using the WCML, WLL and BML on test.

And aren't these trips combining fault free with Driver training too?

 

[spark001uk]

Night testing on mainline in progress, Wimbledon <-> Woking.

 

[Sean Emmett]

A pair of 707s on test have just passed Bracknell en route to Reading

If 10 car EMUs are running on test does this mean the power supply upgrade has been completed?

 

[5920]

It struck me as odd that they couldn't use the up or down fasts between WAT and CLJ, or the up fast at Wimbledon.

Need to sandpaper a bit off of the staff halt first before the up fast can be used

 

[swt_passenger]

If 10 car EMUs are running on test does this mean the power supply upgrade has been completed?

Not necessarily, because 10 car trains can already run to Reading in limited numbers. The problem is running every train at 10 car, especially with the planned service enhancements, with extended 4tph running. 10 car 458/5s ran to Reading for test, mileage accumulation and driver training before the present power supply works started.

It isn't as black and white as you'd expect; what they are really saying is that the power supply upgrade is needed for the entire service group to be made 10 car all day everyday..

 

[spark001uk]

If 10 car EMUs are running on test does this mean the power supply upgrade has been completed?

Well, Siemens' iirc states both a 25% weight reduction in the 707 over current fleets, and up to 50% less energy consumption. So as for the testing the 707 to Reading the power consumption must fall within present limits I would have thought?
(Just my assumption, without having time to look any figures up right now).

And as SP says above, it's not like every train is a 10car.

 

[GW43125]

What's the mileages required on these tests? Is it like the 458/5s where it was first pair 5k, subsequent pairs 1k?

 

[swt_passenger]

Well, Siemens' iirc states both a 25% weight reduction in the 707 over current fleets, and up to 50% less energy consumption. So as for the testing the 707 to Reading the power consumption must fall within present limits I would have thought?
(Just my assumption, without having time to look any figures up right now).

And as SP says above, it's not like every train is a 10car.

Useful additional point, and of course the power supply upgrade on the "Reading Line", is really about an area of route where 707s won't normally run. The current work west of Staines is about running 10 car 458/5s, and at greater frequency.

 

[spark001uk]

Question: According to videos as recent as 5 days ago I've seen pans on 001 and 002, but 6 and 2 came past me earlier on and im sure 2 had no pan?

 

[Domh245]

Question: According to videos as recent as 5 days ago I've seen pans on 001 and 002, but 6 and 2 came past me earlier on and im sure 2 had no pan?

I think the plan is for them to all keep the pantographs fitted but just not use them. 001 and 002 will use their pantographs for commissioning purposes but that'll be it. At least, that it was I seem to remember being told.

 

[spark001uk]

I think the plan is for them to all keep the pantographs fitted but just not use them. 001 and 002 will use their pantographs for commissioning purposes but that'll be it. At least, that it was I seem to remember being told.

Yes I remember now, 001 and 002 were fitted to prove the system works. It was 004 and 006 I saw, because they just came past again in reverse order (Staines to Clapham via Weybridge, then later Clapham to Woking back round via Staines).

 

[Bigfoot]

I think the plan is for them to all keep the pantographs fitted but just not use them. 001 and 002 will use their pantographs for commissioning purposes but that'll be it. At least, that it was I seem to remember being told.

Incorrect. The pans on 001 & 002 are only fitted to certify the units can run under wires in the UK. Once the dc testing on 001 & 002 has been completed they will venture off to some knitting for more testing before returning to dc land and having their pantos removed and returned for use on a thameslink 700.

Much like the 450s and 444s did in the early 2000s it is all to prove they are ac capable but will not be in regular service fitted with expensive equipment that won't see use for many many many years.

All subsequent deliveries will not have a pantograph as we have seen already.

 

[jopsuk]

Much like the 450s and 444s did in the early 2000s

Are there pictures of the 450s and 444s on AC?

 

[Nym]

would one be right in assuming the HV transformer raft will also be being removed?

 

[SpacePhoenix]

would one be right in assuming the HV transformer raft will also be being removed?

It'll probably be replaced with a block of concrete that weighs the same

 

[D365]

To be honest, what would be the benefit of removing it at all, aside from consistency?

 

[spark001uk]

005 and 003 passing Virginia Water this morning, 5Q31.

 

[Deepgreen]

Are there pictures of the 450s and 444s on AC?

I have never seen any, and was unaware of any reports of any AC testing of these classes (at least not in the UK). I must have missed them.

 

[swt_passenger]

I have never seen any, and was unaware of any reports of any AC testing of these classes (at least not in the UK). I must have missed them.

I don't believe they were ever AC tested in UK either. Cannot comment on what might have gone on in Germany though.

 

[swt_passenger]

It'll probably be replaced with a block of concrete that weighs the same

It isn't replaced with a concrete block in 444/450. The relevant carriage data plates clearly show they are much lighter than in a 350. So they may well not replace it with a concrete block in 707s either.

 

[D365]

It isn't replaced with a concrete block in 444/450. The relevant carriage data plates clearly show they are much lighter than in a 350. So they may well not replace it with a concrete block in 707s either.

Now that you mention it, the only reason that this is done on third-rail only Electrostar units is so that their suspension setup is roughly equivalent to a dual-voltage unit.