• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Julian Assange: Sweden drops rape investigation -

Status
Not open for further replies.

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,692
Location
Scotland
BBC News report:
Julian Assange: Sweden drops rape investigation
Sweden's director of public prosecutions has decided to drop the rape investigation into Wikileaks founder Julian Assange.

Marianne Ny said Mr Assange's arrest warrant was being revoked, apparently ending a seven-year stand-off.

Mr Assange, 45, has lived in the Ecuadorean embassy in London since 2012, fearing extradition to Sweden would lead to extradition to the US.

Police in London said they would still be obliged to arrest him if he left.
The Metropolitan Police Service (MPS) said Mr Assange still faced the lesser charge of failing to surrender to a court, an offence punishable by up to a year in prison or a fine.

But the UK has not commented on whether it has received an extradition request from the US, where Mr Assange could face trial over the leaking hundreds of thousands of secret US military and diplomatic documents.
Is this the end of Julian's relevance?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Dave1987

On Moderation
Joined
20 Oct 2012
Messages
4,563
How many millions have we spent on this? Just let him go and be done with it.
 

DarloRich

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Oct 2010
Messages
29,182
Location
Fenny Stratford
How many millions have we spent on this? Just let him go and be done with it.

he has committed a crime. The authorities would not let you or I go so why should he get away with failing to attend court and for showing a great deal of disrespect to our courts?
 

Arglwydd Golau

Established Member
Joined
14 Apr 2011
Messages
1,421
he has committed a crime. The authorities would not let you or I go so why should he get away with failing to attend court and for showing a great deal of disrespect to our courts?

What is the crime? I thought that he was concerned that he would be summarily extradited to the US if he returned to Sweden to attend court ie the allegations in Sweden were trumped (!!) up.
 

BestWestern

Established Member
Joined
6 Feb 2011
Messages
6,736
should still be arrested for failing to surrender.

He's in Ecuador. He isn't wanted there, if he was they'd have arrested him. Whether a system which denies a the authorities access to a wanted person within their own borders is appropriate, is a different discussion of course!
 

DarloRich

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Oct 2010
Messages
29,182
Location
Fenny Stratford
What is the crime? I thought that he was concerned that he would be summarily extradited to the US if he returned to Sweden to attend court ie the allegations in Sweden were trumped (!!) up.

he has failed to answer a summons to a UK court. I don't care what he thinks might happen to him after that or what excuse he has for hiding away. He is legally obliged to present himself to court when instructed to do so.

I repeat - if you or I failed to attend court a warrant would be issued for our arrest and we would be arrested by the police as soon as we were recognised. It happens all the time.

Why should Assange not face the justice?

He's in Ecuador. He isn't wanted there, if he was they'd have arrested him. Whether a system which denies a the authorities access to a wanted person within their own borders is appropriate, is a different discussion of course!

Clearly i mean when he leaves the embassy. He can not be arrested until he does.
 

Dave1987

On Moderation
Joined
20 Oct 2012
Messages
4,563
he has committed a crime. The authorities would not let you or I go so why should he get away with failing to attend court and for showing a great deal of disrespect to our courts?

Please detail what crime he has committed in this country? If the US or Sweden believe he has committed crimes in their countries then the can foot the bill for policing the embassy around the clock. If they want him so badly they will pay else let him go and live in political exile in Ecuador.
 

Dave1987

On Moderation
Joined
20 Oct 2012
Messages
4,563
he has failed to answer a summons to a UK court. I don't care what he thinks might happen to him after that or what excuse he has for hiding away. He is legally obliged to present himself to court when instructed to do so.

I repeat - if you or I failed to attend court a warrant would be issued for our arrest and we would be arrested by the police as soon as we were recognised. It happens all the time.

Why should Assange not face the justice?



Clearly i mean when he leaves the embassy. He can not be arrested until he does.

No we have played puppets for the US and Sweden, and the British taxpayer has foot the bill. Let him go to Ecuador, else present the US with the policing bill!
 

DarloRich

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Oct 2010
Messages
29,182
Location
Fenny Stratford
Please detail what crime he has committed in this country? If the US or Sweden believe he has committed crimes in their countries then the can foot the bill for policing the embassy around the clock. If they want him so badly they will pay else let him go and live in political exile in Ecuador.

see above: failing to surrender to a court

No we have played puppets for the US and Sweden, and the British taxpayer has foot the bill. Let him go to Ecuador, else present the US with the policing bill!

we have enforced the law of our country. You or I would be arrested for this offence. Why do you think Assnage should not be?

We spent millions & years trying to get Ronnie Biggs back to finish his sentence. Was that wrong? He was on the run for ages after a violent crime & after going over the wall - perhaps we should have just let him off.
 
Last edited:

Dave1987

On Moderation
Joined
20 Oct 2012
Messages
4,563
see above: failing to surrender to a court

So what we just keep paying to police the embassy around the clock? Let him go, get rid of him. Do you believe the MPS would spend the millions they have spent on this if your house was burgled? Of course they wouldn't. Huge waste of taxpayers money. Get rid of him!
 

Dave1987

On Moderation
Joined
20 Oct 2012
Messages
4,563
Wonder how many nurses could have had a decent pay rise off of the money spent on this eh? Utterly ridiculous. Present Sweden and/or the US with the bill or get rid of him. Enough money has been wasted.
 

DarloRich

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Oct 2010
Messages
29,182
Location
Fenny Stratford
Wonder how many nurses could have had a decent pay rise off of the money spent on this eh? Utterly ridiculous. Present Sweden and/or the US with the bill or get rid of him. Enough money has been wasted.

A specious argument.

I will repeat. You or I would be arrested. Your view is that Mr Assnage should not be because he has caused the police to spend lots of money. I don't agree that should be a consideration. The integrity of the justice system is more important.

Your view is that after a certain ( but unclear) level of spending justice should not be enforced. perhaps this pair should have been let go as the costs were too high:

BBC:
Two found guilty of fraud after UK's longest criminal trial...... It is thought to have cost about £7.5m, with more than £2.4m in legal aid paid for defence lawyers.

So what we just keep paying to police the embassy around the clock? Let him go, get rid of him. Do you believe the MPS would spend the millions they have spent on this if your house was burgled? Of course they wouldn't. Huge waste of taxpayers money. Get rid of him!

what will happen is this: A deal will be done. He will surrender after the diplomats suggest he does one asap. he will be arrested. He will be given a judicial dressing down. He will be fined and get a suspended sentence. He will complain in the media.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-39869370
 
Last edited:

BestWestern

Established Member
Joined
6 Feb 2011
Messages
6,736
Surely this is evidence of a need for some sort of diplomatic machinery by which perpetual immunuty forever can be avoided. The 'home soil' arrangements for embassies around the world are surely not intended to provide a means of escaping justice within a country's own borders.
 

DarloRich

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Oct 2010
Messages
29,182
Location
Fenny Stratford
Surely this is evidence of a need for some sort of diplomatic machinery by which perpetual immunuty forever can be avoided. The 'home soil' arrangements for embassies around the world are surely not intended to provide a means of escaping justice within a country's own borders.

do we have an extradition treaty with Equador? Is this any different from all those "lags" who went to Spain in the early 80's? is it any different from the lags hiding in Northern Cyprus today?
 
Last edited:

maniacmartin

Established Member
Fares Advisor
Joined
15 May 2012
Messages
5,394
Location
Croydon
In the embassy, I believe he's not technically in the UK and thus our laws don't apply.
 

AlterEgo

Veteran Member
Joined
30 Dec 2008
Messages
20,035
Location
No longer here
In the embassy, I believe he's not technically in the UK and thus our laws don't apply.

A popular myth! Embassies are not extraterritorial. Our laws certainly do apply.

The reason police will not enter an embassy is because of the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations:

Article 22. The premises of a diplomatic mission, such as an embassy, are inviolable and must not be entered by the host country except by permission of the head of the mission. Furthermore, the host country must protect the mission from intrusion or damage. The host country must never search the premises, nor seize its documents or property.
 

BestWestern

Established Member
Joined
6 Feb 2011
Messages
6,736
A popular myth! Embassies are not extraterritorial. Our laws certainly do apply.

The reason police will not enter an embassy is because of the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations:

Article 22. The premises of a diplomatic mission, such as an embassy, are inviolable and must not be entered by the host country except by permission of the head of the mission. Furthermore, the host country must protect the mission from intrusion or damage. The host country must never search the premises, nor seize its documents or property.

So, the laws do apply but they're irrelevant really!
 

AlterEgo

Veteran Member
Joined
30 Dec 2008
Messages
20,035
Location
No longer here
So, the laws do apply but they're irrelevant really!

Well, sort of; they are perfectly relevant, because once the suspect leaves the embassy they can be arrested.

Assange can't stay in there forever, but if he does, it'll be fun. He is a plonker.
 

kylemore

Member
Joined
28 Aug 2010
Messages
1,046
see above: failing to surrender to a court



we have enforced the law of our country. You or I would be arrested for this offence. Why do you think Assnage should not be?

We spent millions & years trying to get Ronnie Biggs back to finish his sentence. Was that wrong? He was on the run for ages after a violent crime & after going over the wall - perhaps we should have just let him off.

If I thought I was going to spend the rest of my life as a political prisoner in the psychological hell of a US high security prison camp merely for the crime of "failing to surrender to a court" I would do anything fair or foul, legal or illegal to escape that fate and I would be right to do so.

The charges he faced in Sweden were laughably trumped up nonsense as anybody can easily find out from multiple sources.
 

TheNewNo2

Member
Joined
31 Mar 2015
Messages
1,008
Location
Canary Wharf
I'm not a lawyer and I don't know the stories of the two women involved. But if Assange has been accused of committing rape, he should be tried for it. The fact he has been hiding out in the Ecuadorian embassy is ridiculous for all sides.
 

GaryMcEwan

Established Member
Joined
20 Aug 2013
Messages
1,604
Location
Bridgeton, Glasgow
If Assange had nothing to fear or hide, then he should have went to Sweden a the first opportunity to clear his name, and if in the process he then got extradited to the US then so be it.

By hiding in the Ecuadorian Embassy for 5 years to me, he has got something to hide.
 

SS4

Established Member
Joined
30 Jan 2011
Messages
8,589
Location
Birmingham
If Assange had nothing to fear or hide, then he should have went to Sweden a the first opportunity to clear his name, and if in the process he then got extradited to the US then so be it.

By hiding in the Ecuadorian Embassy for 5 years to me, he has got something to hide.

You actually think he'd have got a fair trial in the US? He'd have got a show trial like Manning.

By hiding in the Ecuadorian embassy he has evaded a show trial and possible torture in the US - it's more than justified and kudos to Ecuador for doing so.

Your post reads like Teresa May wrote it as justification for her ongoing fight against personal privacy. Assange should be treated similarly to Snowden (still in exile in Russia I believe)

If you've nothing to hide feel free to PM me your forum password :)
 

JamesT

Established Member
Joined
25 Feb 2015
Messages
2,640
Except all the stuff about the US is a conspiracy theory smokescreen.

The UK is known for being one of the most accommodating countries when it comes to extraditing to the US, why would they need him to go to Sweden to extradite him when they could do so from here?

The Swedish extradition request was made under the European Arrest Warrant. That says if a third country wants a person, both of the countries involved in the original extradition have to agree. So we'd still have to agree to him being extradited to the US, where's the benefit?

Finally, if the US doesn't care about the rule of law and it will just be a show trial, why didn't they have the CIA black bag him rather than this extraordinarily convoluted scheme?
 

Hornet

Member
Joined
16 Jul 2013
Messages
724
No we have played puppets for the US and Sweden, and the British taxpayer has foot the bill. Let him go to Ecuador, else present the US with the policing bill!

Send the bill to Assange. He is the one who got himself into this pickle. No-one else to blame.
 

kylemore

Member
Joined
28 Aug 2010
Messages
1,046
So why didn't he go to trial to argue that, then?

I suppose it depends on your world view EM2.

If you think that the US Security State plays by the rules and is only interested in justice then yes Assange should have played by the rules.

If however you believe that the aforesaid US Security State lies, cheats and kills with impunity and is essentially evil incarnate, then perhaps you might think differently and do everything possible to keep yourself from their wicked clutches.
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,692
Location
Scotland
If however you believe that the aforesaid US Security State lies, cheats and kills with impunity and is essentially evil incarnate, then perhaps you might think differently and do everything possible to keep yourself from their wicked clutches.
If Assange cared about anything more than his own skin he wouldn't have run. He would have advanced the cause of truth, justice and the American way much more effectively by letting them embarrass the Government by letting them have their show trial if that's what they wanted.

By hiding all he has done is make himself look guilty.
 

Busaholic

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Jun 2014
Messages
14,029
Assange really is a tedious little plonker, and no-one on the left should continue to advance his cause, whatever that might be.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top