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GWR Class 800

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leomartin125

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Indeed, and that's today's video! I caught 800001 & 800002 as well as 800101 en route from North Pole IET Depot to Didcot at Slough in the sunshine, then 800010 at Acton Mainline in more cloudy conditions later today!

Was hoping the latter (800010) was going to be an 802 seeing as I missed the move on Sunday owing to being busy but it seems the IET gods have blessed me again with another 800.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDiUQmM8rkg

Whilst at Acton I met the GBRf Route Conductor who tells the driver what to expect where, and he was telling me there are two on every trip usually on delivery. The driver takes the unit from Doncaster to Peterborough, where his route knowledge ends. A Route Conductor works from Peterborough to Acton, and then this changes to another at Acton Mainline. I forgot to ask him so does anyone else know why the schedule splits at Acton Mainline?
 
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jimm

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I also believe that the original GW franchise brief already spoke of some IEP operated services on the north Cotswolds, even before the original 802s were confirmed. That suggests that the latest intentions are an addition to whatever the earlier plans were.

Let's be clear about this - as I posted yesterday, it was the plan right from the start of the IEP programme as it is currently constituted that Class 800 units would operate almost the entire Cotswold Line service, all day, every day - replacing the current mix of Turbos, 180s and HSTs.

At some point, someone worked out that there would be issues over covering a number of the peak services where HSTs are currently carrying way more people west of Oxford than would fit in a 5-car 800 and the short platforms at intermediate stations were an issue when it came to using 2x5 formations.

Had HSTs survived on West Country services, that pool of sets would also have been expected to help on these busy Cotswold Line services. When the DfT signed off on the initial Class 802 order, it included provision for those Cotswold Line duties as well.

The key function of the second batch of 802s is to cover for the Oxford fast services that were previously intended to be worked by 387s - which would have alternated with IEP services to/from the Cotswold Line most of the day - and to free some five-car 800s from Oxford/Cotswold diagrams to work Bedwyn duties instead, as noted by Clarence Yard.

But the extra nine-car 802s also make covering Cotswold Line peak trains easier as well, even though DfT is now going to fund platform extensions at the main intermediate stations between Oxford and Worcester to allow for 2x5 operations as well, which should allow maximum flexibility when it comes to diagramming the various varieties of IETs that will be available to GWR.
 

j.crocker355

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I deliberately din't include those routes as they are not mainline routes. Will most likely be done in late September to early October.
Joking aside, with their acceleration could they replace 159's on Waterloo to Exeter should First MTR consider it?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
 

leomartin125

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So Exeter via Honiton and Waterloo are not main line routes, but the Newquay branch is?

Yes! Isn't there one daily to Newquay? I would make that a mainline route. GWR don't serve Waterloo everyday unless I need to get my eyes tested.

I spoke to a GBRf driver who told me that they wouldn't be doing any testing on the SWML until all the GWML areas had been reached. INCLUDING Newquay.
 

jimm

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Yes! Isn't there one daily to Newquay? I would make that a mainline route. GWR don't serve Waterloo everyday unless I need to get my eyes tested.

I spoke to a GBRf driver who told me that they wouldn't be doing any testing on the SWML until all the GWML areas had been reached. INCLUDING Newquay.

The Newquay line is a branch line, with a daily HST for a few weeks in the summer and a couple on summer Saturdays.

Unless something radical happens to operating patterns on Cotswold Line services, the Newport-Hereford line will see IET empty stock workings seven days of the week, all year bar Christmas, so what does that count as in your odd way of categorising routes? It has yet to see an IET working, nor has one covered Hereford-Worcester either.
 

superalbs

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Hmm, I don't know, it's about time SWT got some proper mainline trains. London to Exeter and Weymouth take 3-4 hours!

Please tell me what is better about a train with very hard metro seats that can't divide en route, than a train with extremely comfortable regional seats, allowing for splits at Salisbury, or wherever else needed?

More bizarre ideas for replacing the 159s which do a darn good job! :/
 

cactustwirly

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Hmm, I don't know, it's about time SWT got some proper mainline trains. London to Exeter and Weymouth take 3-4 hours!

London to Exeter only takes 2 hours... If you go the proper way, on proper intercity stock!
The same applies to Weymouth if you go the other way round!;)
 

jopsuk

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Hmm, I don't know, it's about time SWT got some proper mainline trains. London to Exeter and Weymouth take 3-4 hours!

To go any faster to Weymouth would require, before faster trains, an upgrade of the line. No point having 125/140mph trains if the entire infrastructure limits them to 100mph
 

swt_passenger

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To go any faster to Weymouth would require, before faster trains, an upgrade of the line. No point having 125/140mph trains if the entire infrastructure limits them to 100mph

And all those pesky freightliners on the mainly 2 track Basingstoke to Southampton railway. About 20-30 miles of additional four tracking would be very helpful.

This reminds me of all those past threads along the lines of 'my idea for XC to run their Voyagers at 125 mph all the way to Bournemouth'... :D
 

Agent_Squash

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Indeed. The fastest a train has ever gone under 3rd rail is 108mph, a record set by the 442 a long time ago. With air conditioning and other high power draw equipment prevalent on modern units, it's highly unlikely there is the power in the rail.
 

jopsuk

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it's perfectly possible to make the ramps 125mph suitable. But as they need to be in the area of points and signals, you massively increase the risk of trains being gapped if they need to stop.
 

Domh245

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I remember a discussion a number of pages ago about what would happen if you had 2 trains, one operating on Diesel and one on OLE, and they coupled up. It seems that the answer is - it'll run as both unless otherwise reconfigured!

This video appears to shows 800002 running on Diesel, and 800001 running on the OLE passing Cholsey. Any idea why it would be running with this configuration?

QXIBMRh.jpg
 

jimm

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I remember a discussion a number of pages ago about what would happen if you had 2 trains, one operating on Diesel and one on OLE, and they coupled up. It seems that the answer is - it'll run as both unless otherwise reconfigured!

This video appears to shows 800002 running on Diesel, and 800001 running on the OLE passing Cholsey. Any idea why it would be running with this configuration?

Probably has the pantograph raised but isolated for some OLE test/observation purpose - and on the first pass it sounds to me like the rear set's diesel engines are running - just that little added buzz from the MTUs as the three middle coaches of each set go past.

Fact of the matter is that page 8 of the technical specification is quite clear, it's one kind of traction power or the other.

Bi–Mode IEP Unit:
Means an IEP Unit where the main power source(s) can be provided by means of a 25kV Overhead Electric Supply and by means of a Self Power Source but only one of these at a time.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/82840/tts-redacted.pdf
 

Filton Bank

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Fact of the matter is that page 8 of the technical specification is quite clear, it's one kind of traction power or the other.

For an individual unit, yes, but units in multiple can run in 'dual mode', configured from the TMS. The front unit can be in electric mode and the rear in diesel, and vice versa.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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I think it's 110mph on AC only. I'd imagine they are limited to 100mph on DC, since high speed running and third-rail don't mix well.

I think the only sections of 3rd rail passed for over 90mph are the SE main line from Orpington via Tonbridge to the tunnel before Dollands Moor (was the main Eurostar route before HS1 opened); and parts of the SW main line west of Woking towards Eastleigh.
Both of these are 100mph.
Not sure about the Brighton main line these days.
 
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broadgage

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Hmm, I don't know, it's about time SWT got some proper mainline trains. London to Exeter and Weymouth take 3-4 hours!

Agreed.
As others have posted, any significant acceleration of services between Waterloo and Exeter seems unlikely due to the constraints imposed by the route and infrastructure.
However "proper mainline trains" does not just mean faster.
A proper main line train is gangwayed along the whole train, has a buffet, and possibly a restaurant, has largely facing seats across decent size tables, ample stowage for cycles, surfboards and bulky luggage, and first class at one end.

A cobbled together collection of DMUs simply does not feel like a proper mainline or inter city train.
Not certain that an 800 or derivative thereof is much better than the present DMUs.
 

TT-ONR-NRN

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Despite controversial opinions on the 800, would you be happy if there were plans to replace the current XC stock with IEPs on the CrossCountry route?
 
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