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Future use of A Stock

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MatthewRead

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The A stock is never going to run in service again:'(
The RAT season has come to a premature end this year due to a motor defect with 5110. It and spare 5234 are likely to be moved to Ealing Common depot early in the New Year for removal by road.
That was just a joke about the A stock running shuttles between Ealing Common/Acton Town and Ealing Broadway imagine the amount of rail enthusiasts who would be there to see it ;)
 
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paul332

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Bucks Railway Centre or Epping-Ongar seem suitable rest homes. At least there should be D Stock running for many years on the main line. Not to mention 38 stock on the IoW. TfL and the LT Museum did an unbelievably phenomenal job of running steam on the Circle for Met 150, and continue to do so on the Met steam days, but costs and logistics are spiralling, particularly with the SSL resignalling and automation.
 

TT-ONR-NRN

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When on the Jubilee line I’ve passed Neasden and Stratford Depots and they always seem rammed with trains, particularly the former. So, if they can have all of those trains out of service while still running the full Jubilee line to timetable surely they could spare four or five for the Island Line?

They would be a significant improvement from the current trains just under sixty years older!
 

bluegoblin7

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Bucks Railway Centre or Epping-Ongar seem suitable rest homes. At least there should be D Stock running for many years on the main line.

All remaining nine cars of A stock have a buyer lined up; it is not for preservation. The D78 trains require some further works but it is possible that one may escape before the end of the year.

TfL and the LT Museum did an unbelievably phenomenal job of running steam on the Circle for Met 150, and continue to do so on the Met steam days, but costs and logistics are spiralling, particularly with the SSL resignalling and automation.

Readers should be pleased to hear that there is one final soirée underground planned for next year. Final details are still being worked hrough but it will be to mark 150 years of the Metropolitan District Railway. This is in addition to the usual above-ground festivities. The latter are good for at least another 3-5 years as resignalling progresses, but this will be the last opportunity for the former as the top side of Circle should be ATO by the end of 2018.

When on the Jubilee line I’ve passed Neasden and Stratford Depots and they always seem rammed with trains, particularly the former. So, if they can have all of those trains out of service while still running the full Jubilee line to timetable surely they could spare four or five for the Island Line?

They would be a significant improvement from the current trains just under sixty years older!

You're completely misunderstanding the logistics of running a railway operation. Traditionally, the busiest times for the Tube have been during the morning and evening peaks, requiring more trains in service and introducing the concept of an "inter peak stabler", I.e. a train that returns to depot in between the peak periods. This down time is used to carry out maintenance tasks on these trains - indeed, in some cases maintenance has been deferred to eek out additional capacity during the peaks.

A number of trains will also be standing spare to allow for swift changeovers if anything goes defective, whilst the rest will be on heavier maintenance which couldn't be done without significant service reductions.

There are very few "spare" - as in could be released for other use - trains on the Combine, and certainly none at all on the Jubilee, irrespective of how many you see in depots off peak.
 

bluegoblin7

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Colloquialism for the Underground as a whole; historically applied to the UERL ("The Underground Group").

At least at the moment, the SSL probably has the most spare trains, but this will change as the enhancements brought about by ATO come online.
 

MatthewRead

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In the latest issue of Express it says that the A stock is not going to be preserved because of lack of space, budget constraints compressors and one of the Dm motor cars needs modernizing and lack of areas where the A stock can operate is another issue and despite a petition form another forum of enthusiasts it looks like the A stock will be scrapped:'(
 

bluegoblin7

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So, I mean, what many of us have been saying for a couple of years, then? Intriguing you didn't listen then...

It literally blew up on its last day. Its time has passed.

(Motor flashover.)
 

MatthewRead

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So, I mean, what many of us have been saying for a couple of years, then? Intriguing you didn't listen then...

It literally blew up on its last day. Its time has passed.

(Motor flashover.)
No I knew I just didn't want to believe it but since they can't run over the whole LUL surface network I don't think they would want to preserve a unit:'(
 

Mutant Lemming

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Alas poor A Stock - not a world beater but the fastest thing I ever drove on rails. Chalfont to Chorleywood with an ety. All anecdotal these days but I often wonder what the 'A60 world speed record' was - would say 90 but maybe someone out there knows better.
 

LiftFan

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I'm thinking the fastest it could go would be 85 as the back EMF would prevent the motors from turning any faster. Must have been bouncy even at the line speed of 70!

Also, what is a flashover?
 
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D365

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Basically a short circuit. There was an extensive discussion here a few years back. Flashovers don't happen on AC motored stock as they are brushless.
 

Dstock7080

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5110-6110-6036-6111-5111 now moved from Neasden to Ealing Common depot and was turned via Amersham-Watford-Harrow-Ruislip siding.
Leaving 5234/5235 at Neasden
 

MatthewRead

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5110-6110-6036-6111-5111 now moved from Neasden to Ealing Common depot and was turned via Amersham-Watford-Harrow-Ruislip siding.
Leaving 5234/5235 at Neasden
What does that mean for them you already made it quite clear that none are going into preservation :'(
 

Dstock7080

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cars 6111 5111 already dispatched by road from Ealing Common.

cars 6036 5110 dispatched by road (18/4) leaving 6110 at Ealing Common.
 
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bluegoblin7

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To bring this thread up to date: last night saw the final A60/62 stock train (W5235-5234E) operate on London Underground. The empty stock move ran from Neasden depot to Ealing Common depot via Ruislip siding.[br][br]The train is seen passing through Rayners Lane westbound, from the foot of the signal cabin there. The photograph was taken from a place of safety and withall necessary permissions and permits

5235 - Rayners Lane by Jack Gordon, on Flickr
 

LiftFan

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I still find it weird how it lasted longer than the C stock it was running alongside...
 

bluegoblin7

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It must be remembered that the surviving units were very much engineers'/departmental trains. By the time of the final trips 5234 in particular was missing many components. "True" A stock operations finished in September 2012.
 

MatthewRead

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To bring this thread up to date: last night saw the final A60/62 stock train (W5235-5234E) operate on London Underground. The empty stock move ran from Neasden depot to Ealing Common depot via Ruislip siding.[br][br]The train is seen passing through Rayners Lane westbound, from the foot of the signal cabin there. The photograph was taken from a place of safety and withall necessary permissions and permits

5235 - Rayners Lane by Jack Gordon, on Flickr
How long will it be before the train is taken away for scrap?
 

Lucan

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All anecdotal these days but I often wonder what the 'A60 world speed record' was - would say 90 but maybe someone out there knows better.

I'm thinking the fastest it could go would be 85 as the back EMF would prevent the motors from turning any faster.
I drove an A Stock unit on test at 86mph (according to the speedo) in the Northwood Hills area (ie downhill with the wind behind), so that sounds about right. I don't think it could have gone any faster. It felt like driving a car too fast down a narrow country lane. We had checked with the line controller that the previous service train was as clear as possible, and we had a assistant leaning out of the cab window on the curves to see the signals asap, but we had greens all the way. AFAIR the line limit was 70.
 

Mutant Lemming

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I drove an A Stock unit on test at 86mph (according to the speedo) in the Northwood Hills area (ie downhill with the wind behind), so that sounds about right. I don't think it could have gone any faster. It felt like driving a car too fast down a narrow country lane. We had checked with the line controller that the previous service train was as clear as possible, and we had a assistant leaning out of the cab window on the curves to see the signals asap, but we had greens all the way. AFAIR the line limit was 70.

What speedo was used as I recall 70 as being as far as they measured (hence anything after the clock had been lost was guessing)
 

Lucan

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What speedo was used as I recall 70 as being as far as they measured
This was a long time ago and I don't recall what the speedo was like, but we knew it was 86mph. The train was instrumented for testing with varous parameters being recorded, including speed, so it must have been that the instrumentation guys told us afterwards. I think the max line speed was 70 mph at the time and if the speedos were maxed out at 70 that does not sound right, as a driver would never know if he were over the line limit. Unless the 70 only applied to the Chiltern trains and the Met service trains had a lower limit - don't know, I was a test engineer, not a service driver..
 
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