Why is the Age of steam engines so beloved by transport enthusiasts?

[Samuel88]

Yes, even I admire them, but the railways of the past had many more problems than even now. Literally hundreds of private companies, perplexing timetables ( I have a Bradshaw's timetable from 1923 and i can barely make sense of it!) And while the north of England are stuck with Pacers, 100 years ago on many small branch lines you were stuck with railcars. And don't forget the infrequent trains on even quite busy routes!

I know it's unpopular, but I think now is as good as the railways have ever been.

 

[johnnychips]

I don’t disagree, but I think it’s the locomotion rather than the timetables. You can see, hear, smell how a steam engine works compared with their present day more efficient counterparts.

 

[Bevan Price]

I don’t disagree, but I think it’s the locomotion rather than the timetables. You can see, hear, smell how a steam engine works compared with their present day more efficient counterparts.

Yes - steam had much more visual and audible impact than modern traction. You could see some of the "working parts", you saw steam & smoke, and if there were any steep gradients, you could hear trains from quite long distances.

And in later years, people knew that steam was effectively doomed, so they went to see it and take photographs as often as they could. An additional point is that there was much more variety - you didn't always see the same few units each time you visited a station. You could go to some stations for a few hours and maybe see at least 5 to 10 different classes of loco.

 

[Mugby]

The age of steam gave the railways character. You can't really say the same about a Pacer or a Voyager.

 

[PaxmanValenta]

The steam age railways were more down to earth than what we have now. Village and small town stations for instance were very much part of the community, with locally employed staff.

Rail travel was exciting in the steam age and a lot more emphasis placed on comfort even in 3rd class you at least were certain to get a seat next to a window unlike now, some trains had compartments.

The railways were a huge employer, massive sidings and railway works provided a lot of jobs.

 

[Master29]

To tell the truth I was never really a fan of steam as it wasn`t my era but interesting points about seeing the inner workings of steam. It does give good reason why there is romance around steam. Still, give me diesel any day.

 

[fowler9]

Yes, even I admire them, but the railways of the past had many more problems than even now. Literally hundreds of private companies, perplexing timetables ( I have a Bradshaw's timetable from 1923 and i can barely make sense of it!) And while the north of England are stuck with Pacers, 100 years ago on many small branch lines you were stuck with railcars. And don't forget the infrequent trains on even quite busy routes!

I know it's unpopular, but I think now is as good as the railways have ever been.

Yeah, I can go to town on a train based on the Leyland National bus (Sat on a freight wagon with an engine stuck underneath) which no bus operators use any more and haven't done for over a decade. We've never had it so good.

 

[Samuel88]

Yeah, I can go to town on a train based on the Leyland National bus which no bus operators use any more and haven't done for over a decade. We've never had it so good.

And a hundred years ago if you were on a branch line you'd have got old tatty carriages and an under powered steam engine, that or a railmotor!

 

[fowler9]

And a hundred years ago if you were on a branch line you'd have got old tatty carriages and an under powered steam engine, that or a railmotor!

It is you who think the railways are better than they have ever been. Prove it. By the way, Liverpool to Manchester isn't a little branch line.

 

[Harbornite]

Some enthusiasts tend to wear rose tinted specs and can get all misty eyed over the olde-world charm of milk churns, mechanical signal boxes and green tank engines. They don't care about or don't understand how things weren't so good back then, namely how journey times were longer, services were more infrequent, wagons had smaller capacities, working conditions for loco crews and mpd workers were worse, pay was worse and both staff fatalities and crashes were more common.

N.b. I'm not saying that things are perfect now on the railways, or that the railways in the steam age were completely awful (some things were better back then), just that nostalgia can get in the way of being objective.

 

[MG11]

I agree, reading your post and looking at your profile picture of a unit which can reach speeds far faster than a steam engine, with improved safety, crashworthiness, high backed seating and disability access requirements fully met, shows the improvement that has been made.

 

[whhistle]

There's something a little romantic about a steam engine compared with modern units.
Steam isn't my favourite, but it is a little more interesting to watch on the model railway than a diesel loco as you can see the mechanics.

On a slightly related topic - it sort of depends what you were brought up with. I found once that those who were brought up around 3rd rail like 3rd rail trains more than OHL or Diesel. If your local station was diesel run trains, there's a natural draw towards diesel trains.
Steam however is a red herring as it's almost universally liked.

It's like old cars though. They will always have more character than modern vehicles. It was the boring 1980's designers that ruined the look of most things... cars, trains, buildings, houses...

 

[shredder1]

Yes, even I admire them, but the railways of the past had many more problems than even now. Literally hundreds of private companies, perplexing timetables ( I have a Bradshaw's timetable from 1923 and i can barely make sense of it!) And while the north of England are stuck with Pacers, 100 years ago on many small branch lines you were stuck with railcars. And don't forget the infrequent trains on even quite busy routes!

I know it's unpopular, but I think now is as good as the railways have ever been.

The rail network is two thirds smaller now of course, the Golden Age was around the 1930`s between the wars, after the second world war they were essentially ran down, each steam loco in a class had its own character and individuality, and they claim we are now in the second Golden Age with the rise of the preservation movement and new build steam locos, so we really don`t want to let them go.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Working in a 19thC signalbox could be quite pleasant , cleaning an engine ashpan at 0300 in the morning , possibly in a filthy grit strewn yard wasn't. Let alone unloading coal wagons by hand for refuelling.

Having spent a couple of days in Poland firing and driving on the main network , with an 0400 start in the Winter , made me realise how physically demanding it was - great driving in daylight etc - but the underlying work was basically filthy drudgery. And I paid for this.

As someone said - in the 1926 strikes - there were plenty of middle class Tories happy to "drive" engines in daylight and in May - but not many prepared to swop places with the coal miners in digging coal out of a 4ft seam. For that - add working in a coal preparation plant , picking out shale in a filthy environment which shortened your life expectancy.

 

[DelW]

Much of it is simple nostalgia - in forty years time, if the human race has survived, a preservation group will be carefully restoring a rusty old class 800 set, and searching round for some of its original engines to rebuild...

It's difficult to compare eras, as expectations have changed. Trains on main lines today are mostly faster, more frequent and cleaner than in the 1930s or 1950s, while on steam-hauled branch lines, although they were photogenic, actual point to point speeds were very slow by modern standards and couldn't compete with buses let alone cars. Although the appeal of steam locos is undeniable, with their visible power and drama, I don't think many people would want them back hauling everyday trains.

 

[SquireBev]

For anyone under 60 (ish?), surely our only real experience of steam in this country is from leisurely jaunts along preserved lines, so we tend to have a possibly unrealistic idyllic view.

 

[Bevan Price]

Yes - working with steam was dirty and unpleasant.
Yes - trains are more frequent on some routes (although sometimes with fewer seats per hour).
Yes - many modern trains give faster journeys than steam. But not always - although that is often due to insertion of additional stops, or route modifications (e.g. following the closures of Manchester Central, Liverpool Central High Level, etc.)
But the OP was asking why people liked steam, not whether they wanted to work on it
.

 

[chorleyjeff]

Yeah, I can go to town on a train based on the Leyland National bus (Sat on a freight wagon with an engine stuck underneath) which no bus operators use any more and haven't done for over a decade. We've never had it so good.

Dirty coaches in compartments of 6 people each side. Infrequent, slow, irregular trains based on pre WW1 patterns of travel. I remember how it really was. Then it was first generation DMUs running to the same timetables - really no better.
Example. I turned up at Liverpool Exchange early afternoon to travel to Preston. No train to late afternoon. Was told to go to Lime St to get train to Wigan. Change to Blackburn train and change again at Chorley to get Preston train. Major city and county town less than 30 miles away and that performance ! These days anelectric train every hour.
Today's railways are hugely better

 

[Bevan Price]

Dirty coaches in compartments of 6 people each side. Infrequent, slow, irregular trains based on pre WW1 patterns of travel. I remember how it really was. Then it was first generation DMUs running to the same timetables - really no better.
Example. I turned up at Liverpool Exchange early afternoon to travel to Preston. No train to late afternoon. Was told to go to Lime St to get train to Wigan. Change to Blackburn train and change again at Chorley to get Preston train. Major city and county town less than 30 miles away and that performance ! These days anelectric train every hour.
Today's railways are hugely better

You mean current services like those to Reddish South, Whitby, Gainsborough Central, etc., then ?

 

[MichaelAMW]

You mean current services like those to Reddish South, Whitby, Gainsborough Central, etc., then ?

Many stations have closed on lines that were always economic basket cases in terms of the passenger trains but acts of parliament required these to be provided if the original companies wanted to open lines that were lucrative for freight, and there are a few stations that are still open that have a poorer service. However, the vast majority of the network has much more frequent trains. Reddish South, for example, is on a line that had a use in connecting people from London or Birmingham routes into Manchester Piccadilly across to trans-Pennine services that ran through Victoria; once the Windsor Link opened and services were diverted via Piccadilly the Reddish South service was no longer needed. Things change... Whitby, on the other hand, is harder to understand although the service was cut from around 7 trains daily to 4 so it was never frequent, and the short workings to Nunthorpe are much better. If you want to make lists, for every one Gainsborough Central there is a multitude of places that are better served - and, in any case, Gainsborough as a location has more trains overall, even if the Brigg line has a bizarre SO thing going on. There are a few routes with a surprising reduction over the years: for me, the DC lines to Watford Junction are a particularly stark example.

 

[fowler9]

Dirty coaches in compartments of 6 people each side. Infrequent, slow, irregular trains based on pre WW1 patterns of travel. I remember how it really was. Then it was first generation DMUs running to the same timetables - really no better.
Example. I turned up at Liverpool Exchange early afternoon to travel to Preston. No train to late afternoon. Was told to go to Lime St to get train to Wigan. Change to Blackburn train and change again at Chorley to get Preston train. Major city and county town less than 30 miles away and that performance ! These days anelectric train every hour.
Today's railways are hugely better

I've got the Preston service from South Parkway the last three days. No working toilet on two of them.

 

[341o2]

"Now the combination of Pistell, Haywood and 35014 is made. Diesel and electric power do not need such partnerships. Winds and gradients are ironed out and a steady speed can be maintained whatever hand is at the controls. One engine is just like another and one driver is just like another, train movement is predictable and abstract, a matter of mathematics.Yet even in the most advanced steam practice, each engine is different and each crew has its individual approach, steam calls for rapport as that between horse and rider and performances sometimes appear to defy rational explanation." Sean Day Lewis - Bulleid, last Giant of steam, Ch 1 under steam to Devon.

 

[Apprendista]

I have not read of one true steam enthusiast above. True, the life was awful, but so were many other contemporary occupations. If you think about it, my enthusiasm and doubless that of many others, was in the appreciation of the manfestation of the finished product in action, just like a theatrical production, or a pop concert. Enthusiasts of those latter do not agonise about the scene shifting, learning of lines and production of costumes, or the wiring of speakers, coordination of lighting etc, etc. They just enjoy the spectacle: the noise, the smell, the huge mechanical components in synchronised motion and the suggestion of huge, heavy brute force. I remember these things with relish and the best part of my summer holidays as a young lad were the journey to & fro the West Country from Paddington and the hours spent on the footbridge at Paignton station watching every movement for hours on end.
There must be something magical; sales of model steam engines are still running high after half a century of prototype obsolescence!

 

[yorksrob]

I prefer the sectorised era of BR to steam.

That said, as someone who doesn't drive and relies on the train to get around, there were rather more destinations to choose from in steam days. Would have liked to have visited Ilfracombe, Bude, Tavistock, Hailsham, Blandford, Ripon, Alston, Keswick etc.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I think now is as good as the railways have ever been.

I agree, I think it is better than it has ever been according to what I’ve seen and will improve further when GWR HSTs, TPEX stock and HT 180s are fully displaced by 80x and Northern pacers are gone.

 

[Bill Allen]

My first post on here, and couldn’t help but get in on such a great discussion.
I started in 1957 at a place called Boldon Crossing on the Newcastle - Sunderland -Middlesbrough Line, and my first ever locomotive seen was 60860 Durham School. (A named V2...How’s that for what was the beginning of a lifetime hobby)....10mins later the Bristol-Newcastle came through...I know it was an A2,but can’t remember which one..(almost certainly a 50A loco) ....but in those 10 minutes of arriving at this location, I was hooked forever.....and within a very short time I was at either Newcastle Central or Carlisle as frequently as I could.....and I am still at it.
As one or two have said, a steam loco was a living, breathing thing....and I still have a few tears in my eyes looking at the working steam loco’s.
In regards to what was most efficent, I didn’t care one bit, even when the diesels came in...in fact I still have great memories of the initial mainline diesel loco’s....but I never got into the politics of the railways, and still don’t.....with the possible Beeching massacre....and it’s great to see that a few are coming back...long may that carry on.
One thing I do know and challenge anyone to argue, the best passenger coaches EVER in my time since 1957 were, and still are, the BR Mk 1’s....in every category....best seats, best space....and of course, the time when designers could actually put windows where all seats could see out of one.

 

[Bevan Price]

Attraction to steam is not entirely nostalgia - it also seems to draw attention from some of those who never knew when steam power predominated. A year or two ago, I was stood by a model railway layout featuring almost entirely steam loco models. Nearby was a boy, aged probably no more than 9 or 10, who was accurately identifying every class of steam loco runnng on that layout.

 

[Bill Allen]

Attraction to steam is not entirely nostalgia - it also seems to draw attention from some of those who never knew when steam power predominated. A year or two ago, I was stood by a model railway layout featuring almost entirely steam loco models. Nearby was a boy, aged probably no more than 9 or 10, who was accurately identifying every class of steam loco runnng on that layout.

Agree totally ........you didn’t necessarily need to be there in steam days, the attraction and wonder of the large steam loco’s (and smaller ones) these days still gets well into the youngsters as well as us older people, and if “railway enthusiasts” are to survive, it is obviously these young ones are the future.
It sounds as if the 9/10year old boy you mention above is already well into the real thing as well.
As a member of the “Manchester Model Railway Society” there were literally hundreds of young ones at this years show in December, and covered all ages, from “Thomas” to some of the best layouts in the country, and many were pushing the parents for a model engine etc etc. from the many stalls, and who may well become a lifetime modeller in the future.

 

[Cowley]

I don’t personally remember steam (being born in 1973), but I consider myself lucky having grown up listening to the firsthand stories of my father and also good friends and other family members that remember those days.
I love hearing about it all, and it wasn’t just the trains but also all the other things that went with those days: The cars, buses, trams, ships, terraced streets, quiet roads, fairgrounds, enamel signs advertising long gone things, the warm glow of gas lights etc...
I remember seeing the tail end of some of these things before they became history or preserved in aspic as the survivors now are.

A steam moment that I’ll never forget: Christmas 1992 when volunteering at the Mid Hants found me helping out with keeping the locomotives in light steam overnight so that they would be ready for the early morning Santa trains (76017, 34105 Swanage and U class (30)506 I think).
Three of us (myself and two good friends) spent the night going from loco to loco oiling bearings, cleaning bits and throwing the odd shovelful of coal in the firebox, but making sure that they didn’t produce too much steam so that they blew off thus angering the neighbours...
I remember sitting in the drivers seat on Swanage at about 2am that freezing cold night drinking a cup of tea in the warm with us just listening to the gentle hiss of steam and the odd gurgle of water.
If you’d have been able to bottle a bit of that atmosphere you could have made a fortune.

I fully understand why people get misty eyed over those days and it’s nothing to do with modern LED lit, vinyl wrapped, sliding door efficiency.
It’s about a way of life that’s gone, looked less frantic and to me personally, quite pleasant.
If I could go back in time, then a Christmas Eve trundle through North Devon in a warm corridor coach behind an N class or a Standard Tank, with the steam heating going and people saying a cheery Happy Christmas to each other at unrushed, quiet wayside stations would be something I wished I’d experienced.
I know that life moves on but it’s fun to picture it.
Merry Christmas all .

(Maybe too much Baileys)

 

[Bill Allen]

You are right, it wasn’t just the railways, but the entire atmosphere of those days. In the 50’s in the North East of England, your summing up was spot on. As a child I remember the circus arrived at the station, and then ALL the animals and people associated walked from the station to the circus ground....something that could never happen again.
I had a couple of years train spotting with only steam loco’s, then the diesels and rail cars slowly appeared.....but if we call the end of steam as initially being 1967, then I had a full 10years before they were gone...but not forever in a good few places.
Your bit about bottle the atmosphere is wonderful, I know it exactly as if it was yesterday.
If you can write posts as good as that after a glass or two of Baileys, keep drinking them.
Best wishes to all.