London Bridge reconstruction works

[Smitham]

Just been travelling on a Southern train heading for London Bridge. The OBS kept referrng to the destination as London Bridge Central. Does this mean the Kent/Thameslink side will be called something else?

 

[swt_passenger]

Just been travelling on a Southern train heading for London Bridge. The OBS kept referrng to the destination as London Bridge Central. Does this mean the Kent/Thameslink side will be called something else?

Working from a script or reading his train crew diagram too literally, perhaps.

 

[James H]

The tea shop is now something else cafe based; I noticed yesterday. Not a chain either.

LonDONER Kebabs (groan)

 

[Mikey C]

Still lots of work going in. The escalators leading to the front of Platform 1 out of order, so you have to use the ones to the rear of the platform, hence crowds of people running down the platform to get on the 4 car trains stopping at the front...

It's a shame that with the rebuild, it takes so much longer to go between the through platforms and the Underground station, or indeed to access London Bridge (the bridge) itself

 

[swt_passenger]

Still lots of work going in. The escalators leading to the front of Platform 1 out of order, so you have to use the ones to the rear of the platform, hence crowds of people running down the platform to get on the 4 car trains stopping at the front...

It's a shame that with the rebuild, it takes so much longer to go between the through platforms and the Underground station, or indeed to access London Bridge (the bridge) itself

A designed in safety feature. Narrow end fed platforms as before wouldn’t meet current design standards.

 

[Bromley boy]

Working from a script or reading his train crew diagram too literally, perhaps.

I did recently hear an announcement at London Bridge stating that a Bedford service would be calling at “Kings Cross International”.


Pretty embarrassing, really!

 

[FOH]

“Official opening for London Bridge

HRH Prince William, The Duke of Cambridge, will officially open London Bridge station next week, on Wednesday 9 May.

The Duke will arrive at London Bridge station by train and will be met by the Rt Hon Chris Grayling MP and Mark Carne, Chief Executive of Network Rail.

His Royal Highness will meet groups of apprentices, project leaders and long term staff involved in the redevelopment project. They will be joined by invited guests from the rail industry, the local community and children from the local primary school for the celebration.

He will proceed across the concourse to meet architects and view the model of the new station before taking his seat for the official opening ceremony.

At the conclusion The Duke will unveil a plaque to mark the official opening of London Bridge station.”

I must admit I’m surprised he’s happy to have his name against such a half-cocked building as this

 

[The_Engineer]

I must admit I’m surprised he’s happy to have his name against such a half-cocked building as this

Well, that's your opinion........

 

[Mikey C]

“Official opening for London Bridge

HRH Prince William, The Duke of Cambridge, will officially open London Bridge station next week, on Wednesday 9 May.

The Duke will arrive at London Bridge station by train and will be met by the Rt Hon Chris Grayling MP and Mark Carne, Chief Executive of Network Rail.

His Royal Highness will meet groups of apprentices, project leaders and long term staff involved in the redevelopment project. They will be joined by invited guests from the rail industry, the local community and children from the local primary school for the celebration.

He will proceed across the concourse to meet architects and view the model of the new station before taking his seat for the official opening ceremony.

At the conclusion The Duke will unveil a plaque to mark the official opening of London Bridge station.”

I must admit I’m surprised he’s happy to have his name against such a half-cocked building as this

Anything to get away from a screaming baby

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Still lots of work going in. The escalators leading to the front of Platform 1 out of order, so you have to use the ones to the rear of the platform, hence crowds of people running down the platform to get on the 4 car trains stopping at the front...

It's a shame that with the rebuild, it takes so much longer to go between the through platforms and the Underground station, or indeed to access London Bridge (the bridge) itself

Agreed. After having used the new station for a few months, I do have mixed feelings. It's obviously a vast improvement on the old station, in terms of aesthetics, passenger flow, and most importantly, enabling frequent Thameslink trains. And I appreciate that the design will inevitably have been a compromise, limited by cost and also by all sorts of restrictions on what could safely be done - which most of us would be unaware of. But even so, I'm starting to get impression that the design perhaps emphasized aesthetics too much over passenger convenience.

One thing that strikes me is the vast height difference between the concourse and the platforms. Makes the concourse look amazing, but also means passengers changing trains have to go up and down unnecessarily large distances. This adds to the time to change trains, and means lots of people who would normally use stairs head for the escalators or the lifts instead, somewhat restricting flows off the platform. I'm also going to join the 'one lift per SouthEastern platform isn't adequate' brigade: A few days ago, I used the lift because I had my bicycle with me. Off=peak, mid-morning: Took the lift two round trips to accommodate everyone off my Cannon Street train - by which time another train was already disgorging more people into the queue for the lift.

I do wonder whether it would have been better to provide a balcony (Waterloo-style) or an overbridge so that people changing trains wouldn't need to descend all the way to the concourse and back - this would have had the side-effect of reducing demand for both the escalators and the lifts.

Then there's the location of the concourse even further from the Underground (where many people would be heading) than the previous concourse - although granted, the existence of the Shard would restrict what could be done there. Given the distance, did noone think about providing travelators, similar to the one between the Jubilee and Bakerloo/Northern platforms at Waterloo?

Lack of toilets inside the barriers is also an issue, although it's nice that there are ones outside the barriers.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not sorry that the station was rebuilt, but I do wonder how much of a priority passenger convenience - in particular, minimising the time for passengers to get between platforms/underground/exit/etc., got in the design.

 

[387star]

“Official opening for London Bridge

HRH Prince William, The Duke of Cambridge, will officially open London Bridge station next week, on Wednesday 9 May.

The Duke will arrive at London Bridge station by train and will be met by the Rt Hon Chris Grayling MP and Mark Carne, Chief Executive of Network Rail.

His Royal Highness will meet groups of apprentices, project leaders and long term staff involved in the redevelopment project. They will be joined by invited guests from the rail industry, the local community and children from the local primary school for the celebration.

He will proceed across the concourse to meet architects and view the model of the new station before taking his seat for the official opening ceremony.

At the conclusion The Duke will unveil a plaque to mark the official opening of London Bridge station.”

I must admit I’m surprised he’s happy to have his name against such a half-cocked building as this

Is the station finished yet?

There was a lot of building work ongoing and on platform 10 there were bare breeze blocks along the wall

 

[FOH]

Is the station finished yet?

There was a lot of building work ongoing and on platform 10 there were bare breeze blocks along the wall

My guess is there'll be kept downstairs. Upstairs is still mostly a building site.

 

[USBT]

The Duke will arrive at London Bridge station by train ...

Is the station finished yet?

There was a lot of building work ongoing and on platform 10 there were bare breeze blocks along the wall

So which train will he arrive on?

Given the state of the low level platforms and the unreliability of the escalators and lifts to/from the throughs, it’s probably best if he took the Jubilee Line.

 

[FOH]

You’d presume the Thameslink platforms as they have long gaps currently

 

[Hadders]

I wonder what train the Duke will travel on? Will he have to sit on an ironing board?

 

[ijmad]

I do wonder whether it would have been better to provide a balcony (Waterloo-style) or an overbridge so that people changing trains wouldn't need to descend all the way to the concourse and back - this would have had the side-effect of reducing demand for both the escalators and the lifts.

There was a significantly more ambitious design in the offing that included significant over-site development and a mezzanine level in the concourse (which is easily two floors high, even at the low level, as evidenced by the ticket office building). This would have had the effect of making the escalators much shorter, meaing quicker interchange, and smaller stairwell cut-outs on the platforms, which people have complained eat up too much width.

Alas, it was rejected for being too expensive.

Plus, a lot less natural light in the concourse I guess, although I'd take practicality over sunlight for the amount of time you typically spend in a station serving mainly suburban services.

 

[KingJ]

Lack of toilets inside the barriers is also an issue, although it's nice that there are ones outside the barriers.

Each of the Southeastern platforms has a disabled toilet at the country end, operated by a RADAR key. I have seen platform staff unlock them for passengers upon request occasionally.

I agree though, a general toilet provision within the gateline would have been quite welcome.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Unsurprisingly there is a huge amount of work going on today, under the 'cover' of Cannon Street closed and Southeastern main line services diverted to Victoria around major engineering works in Lewisham area. Much of the concourse is barriered off with only the Thameslink platforms in use for the remaining local services from Charing Cross via Greenwich.

 

[ijmad]

Unsurprisingly there is a huge amount of work going on today, under the 'cover' of Cannon Street closed and Southeastern main line services diverted to Victoria around major engineering works in Lewisham area. Much of the concourse is barriered off with only the Thameslink platforms in use for the remaining local services from Charing Cross via Greenwich.

Wait, they were using P4 and P5 for trains from Charing Cross? I thought that was supposedly impossible now?

 

[swt_passenger]

Wait, they were using P4 and P5 for trains from Charing Cross? I thought that was supposedly impossible now?

Definitely always been possible. The relevant crossovers are in all the track diagrams linked at various times earlier in this thread. The northern pair of lines from Waterloo East (up/down Charing Cross slows) run through P4/5 if the straight ahead route is set at Ewer St Junction

What has usually been explained is that the various crossovers will normally only be used during planned engineering works, and not during day to day perturbations.

 

[The_Engineer]

Wait, they were using P4 and P5 for trains from Charing Cross? I thought that was supposedly impossible now?

No, links between Ewer Street Junction and Metropolitan Junction allow direct running between London Bridge platforms 4 and 5 and Waterloo East platforms A and B. Effectively, trains headed into Charing Cross from London Bridge go straight on at Metropolitan Junction.

 

[swt_passenger]

The opentraintimes track diagram also clearly shows what we have just explained: https://www.opentraintimes.com/maps/signalling/tl-lbg-1#T_LNDNBDC

 

[swt_passenger]

The northernmost track into SE Land through the flyunder (not the pair that runs right by the recycling facility but the single one alongside) now has rusty tracks. What is that path for and why hasnt it been used at all?

Southwark Reversible. Getting a bit of use today (5th May) for Up Southeastern services into Charing Cross that are joining the up Thamesink line and then using P5 at London Bridge...

 

[ijmad]

Fair enough, yes I figured the tracks were likely still connected but I was more unsure about whether the moves were okay with the new signalling and control area arrangements. Presumably since Thameslink is not actually ATO yet it's okay until then.

NR did previously say (I think?) that running CX trains to Greenwich would be impossible after the Thameslink project was complete, however I'm guessing this is more for operational reasons rather than lack of infrastructure.

 

[MikeWh]

Have just travelled on the SE Metro explorer tonight. Everything as predicted re p4/5, using dive under towards London etc. Waterloo East to Orpington via Slade Green is quite a journey.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I have to say the direct service from the Woolwich line to Charing Cross today is amazing. Frequent trains every few minutes - easiest journey into London I've had for ages. And the novelty of the slightly unusual route through London Bridge is just the icing on the cake).

I 'spose there's no chance of making this weekend's special engineering timetable permanent?

 

[bionic]

With nothing going up or down from New Cross or Cannon Street the route both ways between Deptford and London Bridge 4 and 5 has been pretty straightforward... Although North Kent East junction appears to be approach controlled on 2 reversible for down moves towards the Greenwich line, meaning trains are approaching it below line speed. It will be very interesting to see how this area copes with the Thameslink services cutting straight across the Cannon Street lines four times an hour in a fortnights time.

 

[carriageline]

With nothing going up or down from New Cross or Cannon Street the route both ways between Deptford and London Bridge 4 and 5 has been pretty straightforward... Although North Kent East junction appears to be approach controlled on 2 reversible for down moves towards the Greenwich line, meaning trains are approaching it below line speed. It will be very interesting to see how this area copes with the Thameslink services cutting straight across the Cannon Street lines four times an hour in a fortnights time.

Correct. Only 1 Down onto the Down Greenwich is not approach controlled.

A lot of the Pointwork at NKE sand New cross is quite slow speed, so there is a lot of approach control from red down there.

Regarding the Greenwich TL stuff, interesting is not the right word...

 

[ComUtoR]

Regarding the Greenwich TL stuff, interesting is not the right word...

I think the right word is 'amusing' Thankfully I'm off Sunday Monday might be 'interesting' though.

 

[FOH]

If any staffers are reading this, you need to get rid of the Thameslink services from the departure boards of the low level platforms. There are only about 10 and they're filled with Thameslink, leaving Southern with room for only a few departures.