Running Electric Traction in preservation

[KingDaveRa]

I've often wondered this; steam and diesel is easily preserved and run on private lines. Electric not so much, as there's so much infrastructure needed, and exta safety precautions with the live rail/catenary.

Are there any preserved railways operating electric traction anywhere (UK or worldwide)? Are there any plans to get preserved lines electrified? I often see the occasional southern EMU behind some sort of other power, but other than if they allowed out onto NR for a railtour or something, they just sit in sidings doing nothing, which is a bit of a shame really. Especially for locomotives, at least an EMU can be used for coaching stock, just unpowered.

 

[DarloRich]

it isnt going to be practical for preserved railways to be electrified. The costs would be ruinous and the relaxations impossible for mainly volunteer run bodies to comply with. The best a preserved electric locomotive can hope for is infrequent rail tour use.

 

[A0wen]

I've often wondered this; steam and diesel is easily preserved and run on private lines. Electric not so much, as there's so much infrastructure needed, and exta safety precautions with the live rail/catenary.

Are there any preserved railways operating electric traction anywhere (UK or worldwide)? Are there any plans to get preserved lines electrified? I often see the occasional southern EMU behind some sort of other power, but other than if they allowed out onto NR for a railtour or something, they just sit in sidings doing nothing, which is a bit of a shame really. Especially for locomotives, at least an EMU can be used for coaching stock, just unpowered.

To answer your questions - one of the UK's oldest heritage lines is electrified using 3rd rail - the Volks electric railway in Brighton. The other, though technically not a railway, is the National Tramway Museum at Crich using the overhead at, I think, 600v DC.

The East Kent railway was running ex SR EMUs using a battery car - which again was ex SR and designed for use on unelectrified branches etc.

There was some talk of the Bluebell taking on the Ardingly branch, which was electrified under BR days - but I have a funny feeling 3rd rail and preserved lines won't mix. OHL is perhaps easier in someways, however to get a 25kv supply is a bit of a stretch.

 

[dgl]

There is also the Seaton tramway which uses the track of the original Seaton branch as far as Colyton. Although that uses 3/4 size trams and like the Volks railway is only 120V DC so not as dangerous as mainline electrification.

 

[mallard]

It's a real shame that a significant chunk of British railway history is in the process of being lost. Not only are very few electric trains (of any sort) in preservation, they have nowhere to run and are thus left to decay in sidings.

I've long thought that a heritage operation could make use of the Old Dalby line; it could even bring some income to the owners when the train testing business is quiet. It could also be used by train manufacturers to show off and get public opinions (they could at least pretend to care) on new trains yet to enter service (running at low speeds with appropriate safeguards).

 

[Ianigsy]

There seem to be a fair number of preserved electrics running in places like Switzerland and Austria. Some will be on privately run tourist lines which have always been electrically operated and others on narrow gauge branches which were electrified early.

 

[Gostav]

I found this old news when l put third rail + GCR in Google search. Now l understand why there is a short track in Leicester North.
http://www.gcrailway.co.uk/2016/04/3rd-rail-electrification/

“Published April 1, 2016 | By Dennis Wilcock
In keeping with the fine pioneering traditions of the Great Central Railway the company has embarked on a project to install third rail electrification from Leicester North to Rothley.

This hush-hush project will be part of the developments associated with the new museum at Leicester North. Preliminary work has already started there and was secretly filmed by Phil Thorpe in an undercover operation.

Once completed Southern Railway 3rd rail stock will be brought to the GCR with trial running expected to be started at the end of 2016. Extra precautions will have to be taken as there will be trials to test to 600V DC supply to the rail at various times during the installation.

Another significant first for the GCR.”

Now is 2 years later, l believe this plan is suspended (cost? safety?).

 

[Stewart2887]

April 1st? Really?

 

[DanNCL]

I found this old news when l put third rail + GCR in Google search. Now l understand why there is a short track in Leicester North.

“Published April 1, 2016 | By Dennis Wilcock
In keeping with the fine pioneering traditions of the Great Central Railway the company has embarked on a project to install third rail electrification from Leicester North to Rothley.

This hush-hush project will be part of the developments associated with the new museum at Leicester North. Preliminary work has already started there and was secretly filmed by Phil Thorpe in an undercover operation.

Once completed Southern Railway 3rd rail stock will be brought to the GCR with trial running expected to be started at the end of 2016. Extra precautions will have to be taken as there will be trials to test to 600V DC supply to the rail at various times during the installation.

Another significant first for the GCR.”

Now is 2 years later, l believe this plan is suspended (cost? safety?).

Note the date that "news" was announced...

 

[Foggycorner]

The clue is in the date it was published Ha Ha

 

[KingDaveRa]

To answer your questions - one of the UK's oldest heritage lines is electrified using 3rd rail - the Volks electric railway in Brighton. The other, though technically not a railway, is the National Tramway Museum at Crich using the overhead at, I think, 600v DC.

The East Kent railway was running ex SR EMUs using a battery car - which again was ex SR and designed for use on unelectrified branches etc.

There was some talk of the Bluebell taking on the Ardingly branch, which was electrified under BR days - but I have a funny feeling 3rd rail and preserved lines won't mix. OHL is perhaps easier in someways, however to get a 25kv supply is a bit of a stretch.

There seem to be a fair number of preserved electrics running in places like Switzerland and Austria. Some will be on privately run tourist lines which have always been electrically operated and others on narrow gauge branches which were electrified early.

So I suppose it's not entirely impossible, but it does sound like quite an undertaking. Given the things volunteer-run railways seem capable of, I don't think electrification is that much of a stretch these days, but then who knows.

 

[gazthomas]

I would encourage you to contact Les Ross, the radio DJ and owner of class 86/2 no. 86259, formally Peter Pan, but renamed after Les himself. I am sure he can share his ups and downs on restoration and operations. The loco is a regular from the south to the north of England before handing over to steam haulage on the "Cumbrian Mountain Express" charter train. Link here: http://www.86259lesross.com/contact.htm

 

[gazthomas]

Also, some people would argue the Blackpool tramway is a preserved line, others, looking at the modern trams might say otherwise

 

[reddragon]

Apart from cost, there is no reason why modern batteries couldn't be used to power an electric loco or EMU.

They could hang underneath or be put inside and connected up. Once research has been funded & solutions delivered by Vivarail etc, then I am sure affordable solution will become available to move an old southern unit at 25 mph. Perhaps a class 419 could be modernised?

 

[yorksrob]

I have high hopes that the 4VEP may run on the mainline in preservation in the near future.

Of course, BR had built up good experience of looking after and occasionally running such trains with the preserved 4SUB, 2BIL and EPB5001, however this all went down the pan with privatisation.

 

[nat67]

Are there any preserved railways operating electric traction anywhere (UK or worldwide)? Are there any plans to get preserved lines electrified? I often see the occasional southern EMU behind some sort of other power, but other than if they allowed out onto NR for a railtour or something, they just sit in sidings doing nothing, which is a bit of a shame really. Especially for locomotives, at least an EMU can be used for coaching stock, just unpowered.

I do think there would be a good thing if there was one as there are a lot of preserved EMU's plus if they did it third rail as well then stuff like the EPB's can run. Obviously a pres line which is not yet built maybe Barry Island could work out well or an old disused line which still has some track on it. But it will cost a pretty penny. Some of the EMU's at Coventry will then have a good home.

 

[trash80]

The EMUs have all gone from Coventry to good homes around the country btw.

 

[Ploughman]

A Preserved Merseyrail 502 unit did do some railtours way back when.
http://www.class502.org.uk/history/history-2.php

 

[A0wen]

A Preserved Merseyrail 502 unit did do some railtours way back when.
http://www.class502.org.uk/history/history-2.php

Well, "preserved" is an interesting word in this context - technically it's an NRM exhibit, though they've not exactly looked after it.

It was more likely maintained by one of the BR Merseyrail depots as a 'pet' a bit like the 4 SUB, 2 BIL and 306 were, which meant from time to time they were allowed out to be exercised on the national network - this was over 20 years ago though and given the lines these can run on are fairly busy, together with the risk of problems, I'm inclined to think such things are unlikely to happen again.

 

[87electric]

I've often wondered this; steam and diesel is easily preserved and run on private lines. Electric not so much, as there's so much infrastructure needed, and exta safety precautions with the live rail/catenary.

Are there any preserved railways operating electric traction anywhere (UK or worldwide)?

I've recently had a jaunt through America and experienced 2 preserved lines with electric overhead Streetcar traction. Orange Empire Museum in Perris, California & the Pennsylvanian Trolley Museum.
All good fun and made a change from my usual Crich outings.

 

[markindurham]

Well, "preserved" is an interesting word in this context - technically it's an NRM exhibit, though they've not exactly looked after it.

It was more likely maintained by one of the BR Merseyrail depots as a 'pet' a bit like the 4 SUB, 2 BIL and 306 were, which meant from time to time they were allowed out to be exercised on the national network - this was over 20 years ago though and given the lines these can run on are fairly busy, together with the risk of problems, I'm inclined to think such things are unlikely to happen again.

It was 'de-accessioned' (I hate that expression) a few years ago. There's a private group looking after it now, and they're working wonders restoring it cosmetically.

The 502 was OK whilst tucked up inside the old Steamport, Southport shed, but the rot (literally) set in when the Southport operation moved to Preston, and the 502 went to open store at Kineton. We're lucky that it's survived, tbh.

 

[Richard Knight]

How about converting a locomotive or carriage into a dedicated 750v PSU. It could be attached to one end and provide power via suitable wired connection. It might not be able to provide all the amps needed but enough to pootle along at 25mph. In the first 3 carriages you might get that EMU experience.

 

[Journeyman]

I've often wondered this; steam and diesel is easily preserved and run on private lines. Electric not so much, as there's so much infrastructure needed, and exta safety precautions with the live rail/catenary.

Are there any preserved railways operating electric traction anywhere (UK or worldwide)? Are there any plans to get preserved lines electrified? I often see the occasional southern EMU behind some sort of other power, but other than if they allowed out onto NR for a railtour or something, they just sit in sidings doing nothing, which is a bit of a shame really. Especially for locomotives, at least an EMU can be used for coaching stock, just unpowered.

While installing electrification equipment is no doubt completely prohibitive for safety and expense reasons on most preserved railways, I'm sure modern battery technology must offer some hope for preserved EMU operation. If you take something like the SR 2-BIL unit, all the traction equipment is located on one vehicle, and there's a huge amount of space below the underframe on the driving trailer. The power and range required for occasional trips at 25mph on a short preserved line must be within the capability of modern batteries, which hopefully could be fitted relatively unobtrusively in black-painted cabinets that wouldn't affect the authenticity of the vehicle too much - or could perhaps go in the fairly large guards' van. Has anyone ever looked into the feasibility of this?

 

[mushroomchow]

The Ferrymead Heritage Park in New Zealand has an electrified running line about 1.5 miles long.

The Illinois Railroad Museum in the USA also has an electrified running line, not sure about the distance though.

 

[yorksrob]

While installing electrification equipment is no doubt completely prohibitive for safety and expense reasons on most preserved railways, I'm sure modern battery technology must offer some hope for preserved EMU operation. If you take something like the SR 2-BIL unit, all the traction equipment is located on one vehicle, and there's a huge amount of space below the underframe on the driving trailer. The power and range required for occasional trips at 25mph on a short preserved line must be within the capability of modern batteries, which hopefully could be fitted relatively unobtrusively in black-painted cabinets that wouldn't affect the authenticity of the vehicle too much - or could perhaps go in the fairly large guards' van. Has anyone ever looked into the feasibility of this?

I believe that some (East Kent perhaps ? and possibly the Eden Valley Railway) have MLV's for that purpose as they have battery capabilities and are compatible with 2nd gen SR EMU's.

I still think that main line running should be the ultimate goal, for at least one 2nd gen Southern EMU.

 

[Journeyman]

The Ferrymead Heritage Park in New Zealand has an electrified running line about 1.5 miles long.

The Illinois Railroad Museum in the USA also has an electrified running line, not sure about the distance though.

Do the electric railways on the Isle of Man count? They're obviously a commercial operation, though. I suspect a lot of the infrastructure is quite modern, but the vehicles are ancient.

 

[pdeaves]

Someone above mentioned Seaton tramway. There are also tramways at Beamish, Birkenhead, Black Country Living Museum, Heath Park (Cardiff), Heaton Park (Manchester) and Summerlee Museum of Scottish Industrial Life (Coatbridge) that manage live overhead. Admittedly, none of them at 25kV!

 

[alexl92]

Would the Sommer train in Majorca count as preserved? That’s electrified and runs vintage stock on overhead wires.

 

[madannie77]

I believe that some (East Kent perhaps ? and possibly the Eden Valley Railway) have MLV's for that purpose as they have battery capabilities and are compatible with 2nd gen SR EMU's.

The Eden Valley Railway has a pair of MLVs which have been operated in passenger service with 4-CEP 2315, although not for several years.

Plans are, however, afoot for a return to passenger use in the near future.

 

[markindurham]

Would the Sommer train in Majorca count as preserved? That’s electrified and runs vintage stock on overhead wires.

I would suggest that it's better described as "vintage". But, regardless of its name, it's a fabulous trip to do. The tram from Soller to the port is also good to do.