Future of Newhaven Marine and Harbour Stations?

[swt_passenger]

Newhaven Town - Newhaven Harbour Annual Gold Card Season Ticket is just £164. Might tempt a few people who may never go to Newhaven.

Subsequently discussed in the Gibb report into GTR. They seem well aware of the fact that the Newhaven Harbour usage figure is completely skewed by it.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

With regard to Newhaven Marine station, since nearly a year has elapsed since the last posting on this thread, have any matters changed since then with regards to the legal status of the railway station.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

All I know is that the (former) station is fenced off but the line connection and signalling remains.

I know that the signalling will come under Three Bridges in the not too distant future - are the powers that be waiting for finalisation of dates etc before deciding?

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

According to an article recently it is planned for closure to improve freight connectivity.
https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=ce9614bb-73c7-4ef0-8bb0-2348b0bd6816

Not sure how true it is

 

[Kite159]

According to an article recently it is planned for closure to improve freight connectivity.
https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=ce9614bb-73c7-4ef0-8bb0-2348b0bd6816

Not sure how true it is

For the benefit of others the relevant section is:

Kent and Sussex ports – the study notes that ports in this area are vital for trade with Europe, yet still the region suffers from connectivity issues: the A27 and the Dartford crossing on the M25 are bottlenecks, the A2/M2 route is seen as inadequate, and access roads to Newhaven are currently unsuitable for HGV traffic. Newhaven is the only port in this area to have a connection to the national rail network (Dover is not currently rail connected since the opening of the Channel Tunnel), and it is hoped that the planned closure of Newhaven Marine station to passengers will enable greater prioritisation for rail freight from the port

I guess their big idea is to knock down whatever remains of the Marine station to create a freight loading area?

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

For the benefit of others the relevant section is:


I guess their big idea is to knock down whatever remains of the Marine station to create a freight loading area?

I also found the possible projects in CP6 which lists one for freight in the Newhaven Marine area so it is likely the station needs to be closed. Finally!!!
https://www.constructionnews.co.uk/...4bn-private-project-pipeline/10029339.article

 

[MarkyT]

According to an article recently it is planned for closure to improve freight connectivity.
https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=ce9614bb-73c7-4ef0-8bb0-2348b0bd6816

Not sure how true it is

I think it was always considered to be a strategic freight site. The formal closure status of the passenger platform has little bearing on access to the sidings though I suppose the platform track itself could be considered another siding. The tracks all need re-extending round the corner as well. At the moment each road is limited to about 240m standage and currently there's no access to the run round spur.

 

[MarkyT]

I also found the possible projects in CP6 which lists one for freight in the Newhaven Marine area so it is likely the station needs to be closed. Finally!!!
https://www.constructionnews.co.uk/...4bn-private-project-pipeline/10029339.article

A terminal for importing aggregates it appears.

 

[cactustwirly]

For the benefit of others the relevant section is:


I guess their big idea is to knock down whatever remains of the Marine station to create a freight loading area?

But the port is barely big enough to accomodate a ferry, let alone a Container ship (unless I'm misinterpreting it?)

 

[MarkyT]

But the port is barely big enough to accomodate a ferry, let alone a Container ship (unless I'm misinterpreting it?)

The port handles bulk goods in smaller vessels. I've seen scrap there and the document above suggests an aggregates rail terminal could be built.

 

[Strat-tastic]

I saw Vicki Pipe's trip to Newhaven Marine on YouTube the other day. Very interesting. I believe this is it, but can't check as I'm at work and they don't allow me to onto YouTube for some reason...

 

[Spankthemonkey]

I saw Vicki Pipe's trip to Newhaven Marine on YouTube the other day. Very interesting. I believe this is it, but can't check as I'm at work and they don't allow me to onto YouTube for some reason...

Watched one of those RED DVDs the other day featuring the Seaford Branch and a fatigued signaller messing up. Interesting stuff. Guess all those old boxes are gone now.

Ah Vicki Pipe. Just about the perfect woman I reckon: attractive in a cute/geeky way AND a massive railway enthusiast to boot.

 

[Cowley]

Ah Vicki Pipe. Just about the perfect woman I reckon: attractive in a cute/geeky way AND a massive railway enthusiast to boot.

Deleted.

(I said something I shouldn’t have which was related to your username.)

 

[Strat-tastic]

Ah Vicki Pipe. Just about the perfect woman I reckon: attractive in a cute/geeky way AND a massive railway enthusiast to boot.

The railway enthusiast's crumpet

 

[Kite159]

Having pay a little visit to Newhaven this afternoon I decided to have a short walk to see what remains of the Marine station. No fencing blocking access (so nothing really stopping someone walking further) and as suspected pretty much nothing remains of the former station buildings.

 

[Cowley]

Having pay a little visit to Newhaven this afternoon I decided to have a short walk to see what remains of the Marine station. No fencing blocking access (so nothing really stopping someone walking further) and as suspected pretty much nothing remains of the former station buildings.

Blimey that looks a bit distopian.

 

[Mag_seven]

Is this station formally closed then i.e. have they gone through the formal closure procedure or are they still cynically trying to pretend its open?

 

[Esker-pades]

Is this station formally closed then i.e. have they gone through the formal closure procedure or are they still cynically trying to pretend its open?

It is not formally closed.

 

[swt_passenger]

Is this station formally closed then i.e. have they gone through the formal closure procedure or are they still cynically trying to pretend its open?

No it isn’t, they haven’t applied as far as is known. The whole of this thread is the answer to your last question.

 

[sarahj]

There are 'sayings' around the mess room that after the signalling work closure on the whole Lewes to Seaford branch in August, is that the points into Marine will be clipped for some time, with both Newhaven boxes going and Lewes box, it seems it will be some time before the TBD Roc gets it's paws on the points. Note: Not 100% confirmed.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Having pay a little visit to Newhaven this afternoon I decided to have a short walk to see what remains of the Marine station. No fencing blocking access (so nothing really stopping someone walking further) and as suspected pretty much nothing remains of the former station buildings.

Given that the original reason for the "temporary" closure was the unstable/unsafe roof, is the continuation of the closure (now the unsafe roof has been removed) not now in a bit of a legal grey-area? At least in terms of any closure process having not been gone through?

Please note, I'm not advocating revival of the service as it would be neither use nor ornament. Simply asking the question as to whether the letter of the law has been followed in this case. Ridiculous though "parliamentary" services often are, should one not need to be reintroduced to Newhaven Marine until the proper permanent closure processes have taken place?

 

[Esker-pades]

Given that the original reason for the "temporary" closure was the unstable/unsafe roof, is the continuation of the closure (now the unsafe roof has been removed) not now in a bit of a legal grey-area? At least in terms of any closure process having not been gone through?

Please note, I'm not advocating revival of the service as it would be neither use nor ornament. Simply asking the question as to whether the letter of the law has been followed in this case. Ridiculous though "parliamentary" services often are, should one not need to be reintroduced to Newhaven Marine until the proper permanent closure processes have taken place?

Pretty much what the DfT said. They don't have to run any passenger services because the station is "temporarily" closed.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Pretty much what the DfT said. They don't have to run any passenger services because the station is "temporarily" closed.

Though as I said, the reason for the temporary closure no longer applies. Whilst a lack of service to NVM harms nobody (except shack-baggers) I can imagine some future scenario where a station with low usage (but some unrealised potential for growth) be "temporarily" closed only to never reopen. I worry about "closure by stealth", basically.

 

[Esker-pades]

Though as I said, the reason for the temporary closure no longer applies. Whilst a lack of service to NVM harms nobody (except shack-baggers) I can imagine some future scenario where a station with low usage (but some unrealised potential for growth) be "temporarily" closed only to never reopen. I worry about "closure by stealth", basically.

The station buildings themselves are owned by the Newhaven Port Authority and not Network Rail. This might explain the lack of movement since the near-complete demolition of the structure.

 

[Esker-pades]

Quote from my response from the Department for Transport:

"Under normal circumstances, Network Rail would be obliged to carry out the necessary repairs to the fabric of the station to make it safe for use. However, the position at Newhaven Marine is somewhat unusual as the station buildings are the property of a third (non-rail) party and Network Rail just leases the platform from the owners; the owners of the rest of the buildings are the Newhaven Port Authority. Newhaven Port Authority has confirmed that the only pedestrian access to the Port will be via the terminal at Newhaven Town for the foreseeable future."

 

[61653 HTAFC]

So why hasn't the official, permanent closure process been begun? If there's no future for the station as a way of connecting to the port (which appears to be the case) surely nobody would justifiably object to the closure. Officially closing the station wouldn't make the freight proposals more difficult, and will need to happen anyway if the freight plans are to go ahead.

The inaction, and what is effectively a permanent closure without due process, sets a far more dangerous precedent than simply closing the station properly.

 

[Kite159]

And if you are going to close Marine, you might as well look into closing Harbour as it's very close to the town station.

 

[najaB]

However, the position at Newhaven Marine is somewhat unusual as the station buildings are the property of a third (non-rail) party and Network Rail just leases the platform from the owners...

Does that make it immune/exempt from normal closure processes?

 

[Esker-pades]

Does that make it immune/exempt from normal closure processes?

It doesn't. If the DafT of Network Rail want to close the station, they can go through the normal closure procedures.

 

[The_Train]

It doesn't. If the DafT of Network Rail want to close the station, they can go through the normal closure procedures.

Even if they don't actually own the building or platforms at the station? Wouldn't NR just end the lease and state that because of this no trains can call there as part of the national network? Surely it is down to the owners of it to actually close it down.