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Royal Mail Post by Train

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bcarmicle

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Do Royal Mail still transport any post/parcels on trains, and if so, do they use dedicated stock? Obviously the Travelling Post Office went many years ago, but there seems to be disagreement about whether or not Class 325s are still in service along the WCML?

I'm particularly curious about London-Cornwall--I would have thought that it would be cheaper to do by rail than road, but can't seem to find much evidence of post going by rail.
 
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Darandio

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Which 325 disagreement? They are up and down the WCML every day.
 

ainsworth74

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Which 325 disagreement? They are up and down the WCML every day.

And the ECML, I regularly see them scuttling past Darlington (or pass them near there). Failing that there's often one hiding in Low Fell (just before Newcastle) next to the Royal Mail office.
 

Darandio

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And the ECML, I regularly see them scuttling past Darlington (or pass them near there). Failing that there's often one hiding in Low Fell (just before Newcastle) next to the Royal Mail office.

Indeed, or it's often sat at the bottom end of Tyne Yard during the day.
 

InterCity:125

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Apart from the well known EMU mail trains , some lower priority bulk mail can be found on standard container trains between / to ports. I recall a panic one Saturday morning when a train from Stratford to Felixstowe detached a 5 set with overheating wheels at Gidea Park - a panicking ships agent told us that there was a box on there from the London Overseas Mail Office at West Ham for the 6 monthly ship to St Helena. Cue frantic messages to get this 5 set repaired PDQ and specialled to Felixstowe (which was done - using a class 31 from memory) .....would have been a miserable Xmas otherwise if this box had not made the ship.
See above.
 

jkkne

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Indeed, or it's often sat at the bottom end of Tyne Yard during the day.

Afaik, the nearby Team Valley Sorting Centre has its own station (or at least loading platform). It’s visible from the ECML just before you reach Bensham.
 

sw1ller

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Big depot near Warrington BQ called Dallam. They use 8-12 car converted EMUs. Easily identifiable in the dark as they have blue hazard lights illuminated. Not a clue on the class.
 

tsr

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The Royal Mail Class 325s are essentially the mail van equivalent of the (passenger) Class 319 unit, but with a Networker cab exterior. Quite a good idea really. The basics of 319s, since they are fast, flexible and yet quite uncomfortable, would always be much better suited to parcels than passenger work anyway.

Not to be confused with the “parcels” 319s - various units had an area of the passenger accommodation which could be locked shut to provide a mail storage area. I’m not sure if this feature was ever used.
 
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mmh

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The Royal Mail Class 325s are essentially the mail van equivalent of the (passenger) Class 319 unit, but with a Networker cab exterior. Quite a good idea really. The basics of 319s, since they are fast, flexible and yet quite uncomfortable, would always be much better suited to parcels than passenger work anyway.

Not to be confused with the “parcels” 319s - various units had an area of the passenger accommodation which could be locked shut to provide a mail storage area. I’m not sure if this feature was ever used.

The Brighton Express/Connex Express refurbished 319s were by far the most comfortable units of that era of them. It was stunning what difference a new interior could do to a train.
 

tsr

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The Brighton Express/Connex Express refurbished 319s were by far the most comfortable units of that era of them. It was stunning what difference a new interior could do to a train.

But still noisy, rattly, draughty and with some bizarre interior features. All of which would not worry a parcel.
 

mmh

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But still noisy, rattly, draughty and with some bizarre interior features. All of which would not worry a parcel.

I'll give you 319s weren't quiet at all, and had a horrendous door layout, the narrowest double door I've ever seen. Bizarre interior features? OK, the "lounge" bit was a little strange, but I liked it. The two toilets next to each other was a bit odd too, but pre-rebuild that coach had two toilets opposite each other, so it was always a little unusual.
 

Journeyman

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Do Royal Mail still transport any post/parcels on trains, and if so, do they use dedicated stock? Obviously the Travelling Post Office went many years ago, but there seems to be disagreement about whether or not Class 325s are still in service along the WCML?

I'm particularly curious about London-Cornwall--I would have thought that it would be cheaper to do by rail than road, but can't seem to find much evidence of post going by rail.

A lot of long distance mail traffic goes by air these days, even domestically. According to Wikipedia, there's regular flights from Stansted to Belfast and Edinburgh.
 
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driver9000

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Big depot near Warrington BQ called Dallam. They use 8-12 car converted EMUs. Easily identifiable in the dark as they have blue hazard lights illuminated. Not a clue on the class.

The class 325 wasn't converted, it is a purpose built postal unit.

There are also dedicated mail terminals at Sheildmuir, Willesden and Low Fell.
 

ainsworth74

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I'm particularly curious about London-Cornwall--I would have thought that it would be cheaper to do by rail than road, but can't seem to find much evidence of post going by rail.

As far as I'm aware the only scheduled mail services are between Willesden Royal Mail Terminal (Princess Royal Distribution Centre) and Warrington, Low Fell (Newcastle) and Shildmuir (Glasgow) Royal Mail Terminals. I believe there may be some moves between Warrington and Shildmuir as well. At Christmas there may be some extra's between those destinations. As far as I'm aware nothing moves by rail (in a significant quantity) outside of those services and hasn't done so since the early 00s when mail stopped being carried by rail entirely for a period of time. It's slowly built back up again over the last decade or so from a few ad-hoc services to the current regular flows. For example, Low Fell used to only be served by rail in the build up to Christmas but now has a year round service again as of a few years ago.

Afaik, the nearby Team Valley Sorting Centre has its own station (or at least loading platform). It’s visible from the ECML just before you reach Bensham.

Team Valley is Low Fell (at least in Railway terms).

Plus in December, on the WCML at least, extra services are put on loco hauled.

Out of curiosity with what stock do those run? I know the 325s went through a phase of being hauled everywhere by locomotive (presumably it wasn't felt to be worthwhile doing traction training when the flows were so restricted) but I hadn't realised that there were other services?
 

DarloRich

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Do Royal Mail still transport any post/parcels on trains, and if so, do they use dedicated stock? Obviously the Travelling Post Office went many years ago, but there seems to be disagreement about whether or not Class 325s are still in service along the WCML?

I'm particularly curious about London-Cornwall--I would have thought that it would be cheaper to do by rail than road, but can't seem to find much evidence of post going by rail.

No disagreement - 3 x 325 rumble past me at 17:15 every night! They are painted red and have the Royal Mail crest on them. Might all be a cover mind ;) Theyalso run up the ECML to Low Fell In Gateshead on an almost daily basis.

A lot of the mail goes by air or by road now. Driving overnight i see numerous RM lorries trundling up and down the motorway. I think RM have an air hub at East Midlands airport and run services to all points of the compass from there.

I suspect London > Cornwall is done by air these days with final distribution by road

Plus in December, on the WCML at least, extra services are put on loco hauled.

sometimes
 
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Aictos

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Not to be confused with the “parcels” 319s - various units had an area of the passenger accommodation which could be locked shut to provide a mail storage area. I’m not sure if this feature was ever used.

Not forgetting of course that the Classes 317s, 321s, 150s, 156s, 158s, 165s and even 142s also had this as well, however while the Class 317s kept their bench seating in this area, the Class 156s soon had it removed.
 

Tim R-T-C

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Yes, the 325s work to a regular, timetabled pattern on the WCML and late evening on the East Coast.


325011 on an empty working Carlisle to Crewe
by Timothy Young, on Flickr

I wonder if the OP's confusion is over whether mail is actually sorted on trains, which it was when the 325s were introduced, but now they are just used to transport the post.
 

driver9000

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Out of curiosity with what stock do those run? I know the 325s went through a phase of being hauled everywhere by locomotive (presumably it wasn't felt to be worthwhile doing traction training when the flows were so restricted) but I hadn't realised that there were other services?

When it runs it has been a 90 hauling VGA vans.
 

driver9000

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Yes, the 325s work to a regular, timetabled pattern on the WCML and late evening on the East Coast.


325011 on an empty working Carlisle to Crewe
by Timothy Young, on Flickr

I wonder if the OP's confusion is over whether mail is actually sorted on trains, which it was when the 325s were introduced, but now they are just used to transport the post.

325s have never been TPO units though, they have always been used to carry containerised post.
 

LowLevel

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For a while EWS also had an express parcels service from Walsall using GUVs/CCTs after everything else had finished (for DHL?) but they finished that quite a while back.
 

ivanhoe

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A lot of long distance mail traffic goes by air these days, even domestically. According to Wikipedia, there's regular flights from Stansted to Belfast and Edinburgh.
Missed out East Midlands Airport there. It's an important Royal Mail Hub. My son works there. Flights to and from Jersey/Guernsey, Belfast and Inverness.
 

michael74

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Missed out East Midlands Airport there. It's an important Royal Mail Hub. My son works there. Flights to and from Jersey/Guernsey, Belfast and Inverness.

Top Gear did a race car versus a letter from the Isles of Scilly to Orkney. It showed the letter going by road to Exeter Airport, Air to East Midlands then Air again to either RAF Lossiemouth or Inverness Airport (I forget), then road. (Spoiler..........the Letter won).
 

Jamm

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Sightly off-topic but does anyone know what does class 325 interior look like?
 

Dr Hoo

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Top Gear did a race car versus a letter from the Isles of Scilly to Orkney. It showed the letter going by road to Exeter Airport, Air to East Midlands then Air again to either RAF Lossiemouth or Inverness Airport (I forget), then road. (Spoiler..........the Letter won).
I am intrigued as to how the 'road' legs from Scilly to Exeter and Mainland Scotland to Orkney worked given that they are islands. Am I missing something?
 
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