Alliance Blackpool service to be run by Grand Central and start in 2021

[323235]

There’s a huge market for trains to Preston / Blackpool from Stafford... We only have 3 a day

Presumibly there isn't enough slack in the timetable to stop at Junction stations like Crewe and Stafford plus they've gone for stations where there is DIRECT traffic and demand to London and other services already in existance (minus Blackpool to a degree which is more about continuing to expand direct service provision) so they can price themselves at the lower end and pull in passengers who are happy with a cheaper but less frequent service.

 

[AndyW33]

Who'd have thought the 91s and MK4s would be such hot property.
East Mids potentially having some, GNWR and Wales all interested.

East Mids with 91s and Mk4s was one suggestion - no more - in the days before Grayling cancelled the electrification project.
There were quite a few arguments against them being used.
They'd be somewhat useless now, unless they shuttle up and down to Corby, due to lack of wires north of Kettering (or perhaps Market Harborough). Bimodes, bimodes all the way is what the new franchise looks like getting.

 

[whhistle]

East Mids with 91s and Mk4s was one suggestion - no more - in the days before Grayling cancelled the electrification project.

Sorry, I should have been clearer...
I meant just the MK4s for EMT to cover for the lack of PRM on the MK3s.

 

[DarloRich]

Presumably the same way it's justified running five car trains up and down valuable ECML paths. Personally I'm not wholly sold but hey ho.

i was quite happy when those 5 cars were an HST. Now it is a 180 it is a disgraceful use of capacity

 

[59CosG95]

Any further news on this?

 

[pt_mad]

http://www.alliancerail.co.uk/images/blackpoolconsultation/blackpool-form-p.pdf

From the above track application. Screenshots of the application timings from the above document:


Bearing in mind at least some timings may have changed due to odd clashes with Northern services and a Network Rail train on certain days (according to a letter linked to earlier by another poster ^^, clashes had or were being addressed.) Plus also bearing in mind the VT Blackpool services have since been introduced with on the face of it one or more potentially conflicting movements (1033 Dep from Euston?).

All rights to content remain with Alliance Rail Holdings / GNWR, and/or The Office of Rail and Road.

 

[PR1Berske]

Fingers are crossed but I don't want to hold my breath.

 

[The Planner]

Rumours floating around saying September 19.

 

[pt_mad]

Rumours floating around saying September 19.

I think that was the proposed date when the ORR approved it right?

 

[swt_passenger]

I think that was the proposed date when the ORR approved it right?

Yes, it’s in the linked press release in post #13. But that assumes stock availability with the ECML 80x introduction proceeding as planned back then, and I don’t suppose it has...

 

[driver_m]

Not impressed with those timings. Sat right in front of a Liverpool leaving MK. Liverpool's pass MK at xx28-30 arriving at Euston xx59-00 typically, so how is that particular square going to be circled?

 

[pt_mad]

Yes, it’s in the linked press release in post #13. But that assumes stock availability with the ECML 80x introduction proceeding as planned back then, and I don’t suppose it has...

There's a video on YouTube claiming GNWR have purchased two 91s. It gives the numbers. Searching for Alliance Rail GNWR Blackpool on YouTube should bring the video up last time I looked.

Don't know how many sets GNWR were saying they needed. At a guess, 4? So might be doable? Bearing in mind some of the MK4s are destined for the Wales and Borders franchise very soon too.

 

[pt_mad]

Not impressed with those timings. Sat right in front of a Liverpool leaving MK. Liverpool's pass MK at xx28-30 arriving at Euston xx59-00 typically, so how is that particular square going to be circled?

As far as I could see, the plan involves an overtaking move (Northbound) at Milton Keynes.

The set leaves Euston, takes a 110mph path on the fast line, is platformed onto the slow line at Milton Keynes station for the station call. The following express overtakes on the fast. The Blackpool then leaves Milton Keynes back onto the fast line where it has enough give to get to Colwich before the following Manchester catches up 4 or 5 mins later ish and goes off to Stoke.

In theory it has a fast path all the way onto Preston but presumably with the odd clashes with a Northern service and the Network Rail Train one day a week as mentioned in the letter someone linked to previously. Apparently these clashes were being addressed.

Mostly assumptions from the info provided from the letter and the application timetable and obviously subject to change.

 

[DanNCL]

There's a video on YouTube claiming GNWR have purchased two 91s. It gives the numbers. Searching for Alliance Rail GNWR Blackpool on YouTube should bring the video up last time I looked.

The video claims its 91110 and 91111 - I think it's extremely unlikely that either of them will go to GNWR as both have been designated for the National Collection.

 

[pt_mad]

The video claims its 91110 and 91111 - I think it's extremely unlikely that either of them will go to GNWR as both have been designated for the National Collection.

Does the source for that YouTube video say from email from GNWR?

 

[DanNCL]

Does the source for that YouTube video say from email from GNWR?

It does, however a very similar video (now deleted) once appeared on the same channel with the exact same info, other than that time it was Grand Central rather than GNWR (still Blackpool though). I don't think that YouTube video is a reliable source based on the info available.

 

[pt_mad]

Can't remember if it said on the ORR letter or original application how many sets were needed for the 6 return journeys but I think it was 4 trains sets. Can anyone confirm?

 

[The Planner]

There is/was things going on in the background that makes September more relevant than just GNWR attempting to start. They are still a long way from proving they can yet anyway.

 

[snowball]

Can't remember if it said on the ORR letter or original application how many sets were needed for the 6 return journeys but I think it was 4 trains sets. Can anyone confirm?

The application linked in #96 seems to confirm it:

Servicing and Maintenance
Currently it is expected that two sets will be serviced overnight and maintained at Arriva
TrainCare Crewe, with one serviced overnight at Wembley. A spare set will be kept at
Crewe depot. However discussions with other maintenance providers are on-going.

 

[Bletchleyite]

As far as I could see, the plan involves an overtaking move (Northbound) at Milton Keynes.

The set leaves Euston, takes a 110mph path on the fast line, is platformed onto the slow line at Milton Keynes station for the station call. The following express overtakes on the fast.

Platform 5 at MKC exists for exactly that purpose and is only used once an hour in normal operations, I think.

 

[Darandio]

There's a video on YouTube claiming GNWR have purchased two 91s. It gives the numbers. Searching for Alliance Rail GNWR Blackpool on YouTube should bring the video up last time I looked.

This one?

"GNWR have also purchased 2 Class 91's which contain British Memorial for who gave our today"

Yeah, that looks like an extremely reliable source...... I believe I also did see a one for Grand Central as mentioned above. Clickbait.

 

[swt_passenger]

Aren’t we going round in circles here?

Post #95 quite reasonably asked if there was any news. The immediate reply, post #96, was simply to repeat the timetable information that was available/known since the thread first started.
AFAICS the intended timetable hasn’t changed, the intended stock hasn’t changed, and the proposed start date hasn’t changed. A homemade YouTube video, of dubious status, has also been discussed.

So the real answer for 59CosG95 is that there is no news.

 

[pt_mad]

Aren’t we going round in circles here?

Post #95 quite reasonably asked if there was any news. The immediate reply, post #96, was simply to repeat the timetable information that was available/known since the thread first started.
AFAICS the intended timetable hasn’t changed, the intended stock hasn’t changed, and the proposed start date hasn’t changed. A homemade YouTube video, of dubious status, has also been discussed.

So the real answer for 59CosG95 is that there is no news.

What about the phrase 'no news is good news'? lol

 

[pt_mad]

This one?

Yeah, that looks like an extremely reliable source...... I believe I also did see a one for Grand Central as mentioned above. Clickbait.

The photo of the guy in the corner of the video preview looks like an extremely reliable source does it not?

 

[Darandio]

The photo of the guy in the corner of the video preview looks like an extremely reliable source does it not?

I'd stake my mortgage on his knowledge.

 

[pt_mad]

I'd stake my mortgage on his knowledge.

A wise decision. He could be the director of Network Rail for all we know

 

[Darandio]

A wise decision. He could be the director of Network Rail for all we know

It is clickbait, the previous one was too. Are you affiliated/related by any chance?

 

[pt_mad]

It is clickbait, the previous one was too. Are you affiliated/related by any chance?

No, I was talking more tongue in cheek when I said the source looks very reliable from the photo. He could have been the director of Virgin East Coast for all we know from his photo.

Clickbait? He's clicking and we're taking the bait?

 

[Darandio]

No, I was talking more tongue in cheek when I said the source looks very reliable from the photo. He could have been the director of Virgin East Coast for all we know from his photo.

Clickbait? He's clicking and we're taking the bait?

He's baiting and we're clicking!

 

[pt_mad]

He's baiting and we're clicking!

True