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LNER Azuma (Class 800/801)

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59CosG95

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Assuming most of the diagrams from yesterday will stick. This, however, is 5Q80 from Doncaster Carr to Bounds Green - 801201 is the unit in question.
As @JamesGar said yesterday, 800202 went up to Newton Aycliffe last night and picked up 801106, running as 5X40 from Merchant Park to Acton Main Line, and then 5X41 to Eastleigh.
 
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Tetchytyke

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Fewer facing tables on the single seat side in first. Not sure about that. Better when I'm on business or travelling alone, not so good when I'm with t'missus
 

hwl

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At the risk of rehashing old ground they met the specification for electrical interference but it then turned out the specification was not actually an accurate measure of the amount of interference they could get away with generating. So retrofits are now required to the trains and the signalling. It was covered in some detail on this thread at the time and also by Roger Ford in Modern Railways.

As to who botched it, that would depend on peoples biases. Some blame Hitachi for not going above and beyond the specification, others blame the DfT for issuing a faulty specification, others blame Network Rail for not having better signalling and also not informing the DfT when creating their specification. And so on and so on.

A big part of the issue is measurement which wasn't well enough defined in the spec. Depending on how you measure it, it does or doesn't meet the spec. The EMI picked up in the real world environment is above the specification at which point claiming it did in test lab doesn't really cut the mustard as this isn't emission testing!

Hitachi swapped to a lower switching frequency in order to reduce equipment weight to meet the overall weight and energy efficiency target which backfired spectacularly as the units will end up heavier than if they had stuck with 900Hz (the same as everyone else did and they had for the 395s). (Smaller lighter reactor at 900Hz than 750Hz).

Siemens similarly got the New Tube for London design spectacularly wrong and are now having to find space for heavy bulky reactors too. But at least they are still on the drawing board!
 

59CosG95

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Monday's gatherings of test workings.

5Q30/5Q31/5Q32/5Q33/5Q34 - confirmed to be 800106 (unchanged since last week's debut).
5Q01/5Q02/5Q03/5Q04/5Q05/5Q06 - confirmed to be 800109 (now FULLY stickered).
5Q11/5Q12/5Q13 (cancelled); 5Q14/5Q15/5Q16/5Q17/5Q18 - confirmed to be 800107.
5Q70/5Q71/5Q72/5Q73 - shown as 'ZZ' on RTT, so might be a TPE 802.
5Q94/5Q95/5Q96 - confirmed to be 800111 - fully stickered.

And coming up on delivery: 5X82/5X83 - confirmed to be 800202 - thanks to @3973EXL.
This'll be edited as the day unfolds.
Some changes today: the 5Q01-5Q06 circuit appears to be 800107 this morning.
Conversely, the 5Q11-5Q18 circuit (running in full) has produced 800109.
The 5Q30-5Q34 circuit is unchanged.
 
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swt_passenger

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It will then go forward to Merchant Park this evening, to collect 801106 and return south to Acton Mainline then forward to Eastleigh.
Yes, I can see that from RTT, but my question was WHY they don’t just use one headcode between Eastleigh and Merchants Park?
 

59CosG95

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Hitachi swapped to a lower switching frequency in order to reduce equipment weight to meet the overall weight and energy efficiency target which backfired spectacularly as the units will end up heavier than if they had stuck with 900Hz (the same as everyone else did and they had for the 395s). (Smaller lighter reactor at 900Hz than 750Hz).
Ahh, is that the reason why the 80x units sound slightly lower-pitched when accelerating than the 395s? (e.g. giving off a 'C'-key frequency sound rather than the 'F'-key followed by the 'G'-key)
 

superjohn

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I’ve just seen 800108 passing eastbound through Gospel Oak (1120am, 12/3).

The seats appeared to be frames only, no cushions.
 

jzw95

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Is there anywhere I can see the seat layouts for the LNER Azumas? I haven't been able to find anything either on this forum, or the wider internet. From the promotional video/VR on LNER's site, it looks like the few tables in standard class coaches will all have a big pillar in the middle. I was hoping the Azumas would continue the tradition of the current LNER fleet of having (some) tables aligned with the window. Does anyone know more about this? Thanks!
 

ainsworth74

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Is there anywhere I can see the seat layouts for the LNER Azumas? I haven't been able to find anything either on this forum, or the wider internet. From the promotional video/VR on LNER's site, it looks like the few tables in standard class coaches will all have a big pillar in the middle. I was hoping the Azumas would continue the tradition of the current LNER fleet of having (some) tables aligned with the window. Does anyone know more about this? Thanks!
There have definitely been seating plans released to the public. I've seen them on Twitter (possibly LNER's twitter?) and also on this Forum I'm sure of it.
 

Mitchell Hurd

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Is there anywhere I can see the seat layouts for the LNER Azumas? I haven't been able to find anything either on this forum, or the wider internet. From the promotional video/VR on LNER's site, it looks like the few tables in standard class coaches will all have a big pillar in the middle. I was hoping the Azumas would continue the tradition of the current LNER fleet of having (some) tables aligned with the window. Does anyone know more about this? Thanks!

Type in the Google search box 'lner azuma seating plan' and you'll see a page that says in green something like 'www.whatdotheyknow.com'. Click on that And you'll find a link to it by moving down the page.

Here's a clue: the Quiet Coach you'll be surprised at - I was. In my opinion, it explains the popularity of the Quiet Coach on LNER routes.
 

hwl

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Ahh, is that the reason why the 80x units sound slightly lower-pitched when accelerating than the 395s? (e.g. giving off a 'C'-key frequency sound rather than the 'F'-key followed by the 'G'-key)
Partially
 

greyman42

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Standard class looks ok, although the seat padding still remains a question.

First class looks horrid and a significant downgrade on the current trains. The maroon/brown colour is very 80s
The carpet looks awful already.
 

47271

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First class looks horrid and a significant downgrade on the current trains. The maroon/brown colour is very 80s

The colours are the least of our worries. If the travelling environment offered in First is the same as I find in GWR IETs then all I can say is that LNER had better up their F&B offer from the James Martin 'gourmet' sausage roll or soggy ham hock sandwich and thimblefuls of wine. Othwerwise I'll be shifting to Standard and a quick trip to M&S in fast order. There's a risk of these trains piling woeful First Class ambience on top of woeful First Class hospitality, and that isn't a criticism of the crew who have to serve it up.

But I'm sure that LNER's thought of that in their menu and drinks planning. Or maybe they'll cheapskate it as they do now and hope for the best...
 

FQTV

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Is there anywhere I can see the seat layouts for the LNER Azumas? I haven't been able to find anything either on this forum, or the wider internet. From the promotional video/VR on LNER's site, it looks like the few tables in standard class coaches will all have a big pillar in the middle. I was hoping the Azumas would continue the tradition of the current LNER fleet of having (some) tables aligned with the window. Does anyone know more about this? Thanks!

There have definitely been seating plans released to the public. I've seen them on Twitter (possibly LNER's twitter?) and also on this Forum I'm sure of it.

LNER Class 800 and Class 801 seat maps in the attached document:
 

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  • Azuma 800 and 801 seat map.pdf
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E100

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Probably to avoid confusion which might arise between which class it is. For example, if an Azuma is 9 coaches long and numbered 103, it's an 800 (in this case, 800103). It's the same for the planned 801s for GWR; they would have been 9-car 801/0s, which would have been the opposite of the 5-car bi-modal 800/0s.
To avoid any confusion, they should have avoided any duplication of the last 2 digits.
eg 9 car units 800101 - 800113 & 812021 - 812050
5 car units 800261 - 800270 & 801180 - 801192.
Many thanks for the replies. This does make sense now.
 

ainsworth74

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The colours are the least of our worries. If the travelling environment offered in First is the same as I find in GWR IETs then all I can say is that LNER had better up their F&B offer from the James Martin 'gourmet' sausage roll or soggy ham hock sandwich and thimblefuls of wine. Othwerwise I'll be shifting to Standard and a quick trip to M&S in fast order. There's a risk of these trains piling woeful First Class ambience on top of woeful First Class hospitality, and that isn't a criticism of the crew who have to serve it up.

But I'm sure that LNER's thought of that in their menu and drinks planning. Or maybe they'll cheapskate it as they do now and hope for the best...

Well, I'm hoping that they may be looking at upping the quality of their on-board catering (in both classes to be fair but in particular first) as there was a survey done by IPSOS MORI who power their customer panel around catering on board when their new trains arrive. From that a few things seemed to come out that suggested a rethink. For instance they seemed to be quite keen on the idea of bacon rolls or toasties later in the day on weekends (so something hot compared to just cold sandwiches!) and that everyone on a journey of over 70 minutes would get a two course meal of some description. I can't really recall much of the detail beyond that and obviously they were only ideas but it does seem like there was some impetus behind revamping the onboard service in light of the arrival of the new fleet.
 

Craig2601

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What is with the big gap in the first class area on coach E/M between the seats and drivers cab?
 

Grandnat

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Well, I'm hoping that they may be looking at upping the quality of their on-board catering (in both classes to be fair but in particular first) as there was a survey done by IPSOS MORI who power their customer panel around catering on board when their new trains arrive. From that a few things seemed to come out that suggested a rethink. For instance they seemed to be quite keen on the idea of bacon rolls or toasties later in the day on weekends (so something hot compared to just cold sandwiches!) and that everyone on a journey of over 70 minutes would get a two course meal of some description. I can't really recall much of the detail beyond that and obviously they were only ideas but it does seem like there was some impetus behind revamping the onboard service in light of the arrival of the new fleet.

Fingers crossed.

I travel from Edinburgh to Newcastle and York a lot and I find the full breakfast a satisfying size - once you add in extra toast and fruit and multiple coffees.

On the return I’ve recently found they’ve run out of most things or there aren’t enough staff to offer the full service and the soggy sarnie chucked on the table doesn’t feel very First Class at all.
 

geml90

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Saw 67004 on the way to Merchant Park this evening.

Lots of Azuma banners up in Darlington now:

IMG_20190313_172648.jpg IMG_20190313_165906.jpg
 
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