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EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

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nidave

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In what way has the U.K. attempted to impose “some imperial hold” over ROI?

I suspect most people find the whole Irish border situation pretty frustrating if not ridiculous, but then so is much of Northern Irish politics.

As for Scotland, they voted to remain part of the U.K. in their referendum. Consequences come with that decision. Is public opinion in Scotland quite so entrenched towards the EU as the SNP advocate? I’ve heard it said that the Scottish EU referendum result was partly an attempt to avoid Sturgeon re-igniting the independence debate, as opposed to a love of the EU. How true is this? I’ve heard it suggested by a number of Scottish people.
Are you serious? MPs saying we should stop all trade with them to let them starve (while forgetting we import more food from ROI than we export to them) so they will give up the border.
Telling Ireland to rejoin the UK so it doesn't have to be a member of the EU
N. Ireland.
 
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Howardh

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There are carers who come daily for mum and seriously don't have a clue about Brexit. It's not on their radar. Big Brother, Strictly, Kyle...experts. Politics? nothing. Yet they think they can carry on having holidays just the same, expecting european food in the supermarket....they are in for a shock.
 

DynamicSpirit

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Are you serious? MPs saying we should stop all trade with them to let them starve (while forgetting we import more food from ROI than we export to them) so they will give up the border.
Telling Ireland to rejoin the UK so it doesn't have to be a member of the EU
N. Ireland.

When have MPs said we should stop all trade with Ireland and let them starve? Which MPs? That seems highly unlikely. Can you provide a reliable source?
 

Ken H

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Can someone please explain why labour are so against May's deal, apart from the obvious of they don't want Tory success over Brexit? May's deal keeps workers rights, and is almost staying in the customs union due to the backstop. Seems madness that Brexiteers reject it for not being a true Brexit, yet Labour claim it's too hard a Brexit.
because Labours tactic in the commons is to do everything to shaft the tories rather than doing whats best for the UK. They think that by shafting mays deal there is a chance there will be an election and they will form the next government.
 

A Challenge

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Latest vote from the House of Commons

Request EU agreement for Brexit delay:
Aye: 412
Noe: 202

Majority 210 (for)

We are now less likely to leave the EU on the 29th March, increasing uncertainty.
 

Esker-pades

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Those Amendements in Full:

Wollaston - Call for a 2nd Referendum: REJECTED by 249 (334 to 85)
Powell - Extend Article 50 Deadline to 30th of June: REJECTED by 3 (314 to 311)
Benn - MPs take control of the Brexit Process: REJECTED by 2 (314 to 312)
Labour - PMs deal & No Deal rejected, extension to Article 50: REJECTED by 16 (318 to 302)
Government - If PMs deal is not passed, extension to Article 50: PASSED by 210 (412 to 202)
 

Ken H

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The intention of the present deal is for the UK to leave the customs union. The backstop may end up keeping us in, since no workable alternative solution to the Irish border has been found. But Labour would stay in the customs union regardless, and forgo the negligible benefits of striking our own free trade agreements outside the EU.

However Labour also appears to be wanting something that't not on offer - closeness to the single market without free movement.
because ending free movement was probably a major factor in many voting to leave. Especially in the old labour heartlands up North
 

Darandio

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because Labours tactic in the commons is to do everything to shaft the tories rather than doing whats best for the UK. They think that by shafting mays deal there is a chance there will be an election and they will form the next government.

As opposed to the Tory tactic which is to do everything possible in order to shaft the UK. Everyone in that building is shafting the UK whether it be Tory, Labour, Klingon, Ewok.....
 

Ken H

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Extraordinary comments by Nigel Farage getting lost amid the noise: he is lobbying EU governments (possibly Italy) to *veto* any British govt request to extend A50 so as to force a No Deal Brexit on March 29.

That's Farage lobbying foreign govts to oppose Britain's parliament

The irony is too good.
Thats the UK parliament ignoring the will of the people in a referendum the same UK Parliament allowed so long ago
 

Ken H

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That may have been the prudent choice anyway - EHIC just gets you what the locals get, which may not be 100% free treatment and definitely doesn't include repatriation if that was to be necessary.
I have heard that Spanish hospitals wont accept EHIC. They want paying and leave you to reclaim from the NHS later.

and to be gloomy, repatriation meand both when you need an air ambulance because you are too ill for a commercial flight, or you need to come back to the UK in a box - which is very expensive.
Even repatriating ashes costs a shedload of cash.
 

Esker-pades

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it was made clear that 'leave the EU' meant leave the single market, the customs union, the jurisdiction if the ECJ and ending freedom of movement at the time of the referendum.
Not all of those were clear. (Single market, customs union mainly.)

During the campaign, no deal was dismissed by the Leave campaign as part of "project fear".
 

nidave

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When have MPs said we should stop all trade with Ireland and let them starve? Which MPs? That seems highly unlikely. Can you provide a reliable source?
How about this
A suggestion that the threat of food shortages be used to force Ireland to drop the Brexit backstop has sparked a furious reaction on both sides of the Irish Sea as the British government faces the final days of its hard sell on Theresa May's deal.

https://www.herald.ie/news/starve-t...ng-tory-sparks-furious-backlash-37606031.html
 

Jonny

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The worst thing is that this clears up precisely nothing whatsoever. There seems to be even less appetite for a second referendum than there is for a no-deal Brexit. Why are the EU insisting on so many terms that don't apply to trade deals with countries such as Japan?
 

nidave

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it was made clear that 'leave the EU' meant leave the single market, the customs union, the jurisdiction if the ECJ and ending freedom of movement at the time of the referendum.
Let's remind ourselves of what we were told about brexit shall we...
"Absolutely nobody is talking about threatening our place in the Single Market" - Daniel Hannan MEP

"Only a madman would actually leave the Market" - Owen Paterson MP, Vote Leave backer

"Wouldn't it be terrible if we were really like Norway and Switzerland? Really? They're rich. They're happy. They're self-governing" - Nigel Farage, Ukip leader

"The Norwegian option, the EEA option, I think that it might be initally attractive for some business people" - Matthew Elliot, Vote Leave chief executive

"Increasingly, the Norway option looks the best for the UK" - Arron Banks, Leave.EU founder

So nope - you are lying - it was not made clear.
 

simonw

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The worst thing is that this clears up precisely nothing whatsoever. There seems to be even less appetite for a second referendum than there is for a no-deal Brexit. Why are the EU insisting on so many terms that don't apply to trade deals with countries such as Japan?
What terms are the EU insisting on?
 

Jonny

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How about this
A suggestion that the threat of food shortages be used to force Ireland to drop the Brexit backstop has sparked a furious reaction on both sides of the Irish Sea as the British government faces the final days of its hard sell on Theresa May's deal.
https://www.herald.ie/news/starve-t...ng-tory-sparks-furious-backlash-37606031.html

Perhaps Mr Varadkar should be very careful what he wishes for... My view is that the threat of negative consequences for Ireland will be enough to get a good agreement for Britain, unless the EU can find enough ships to bypass the UK with goods from Continental Europe directly to Eire.
 

Jonny

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What terms are the EU insisting on?

The EU-Japan agreement, as I understand it, is basically a free trade agreement, with no free movement and no influence of one on the other's legislation. Why can't Britain have the same?
 

simonw

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The EU-Japan agreement, as I understand it, is basically a free trade agreement, with no free movement and no influence of one on the other's legislation. Why can't Britain have the same?
We haven't even reached the stage of negotiating a trade agreement with the EU, so any comparison with the EU-Japanese FT agreement is comparing something that exists with something that doesn't exist.
 

Ken H

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The EU-Japan agreement, as I understand it, is basically a free trade agreement, with no free movement and no influence of one on the other's legislation. Why can't Britain have the same?
why cant we have the same as canada?
 

nidave

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Perhaps Mr Varadkar should be very careful what he wishes for... My view is that the threat of negative consequences for Ireland will be enough to get a good agreement for Britain, unless the EU can find enough ships to bypass the UK with goods from Continental Europe directly to Eire.
You know the EU will help Ireland though this. The UK government is screwing over most of the UK just to keep the Conservatives in power.

France and Ireland are well underway with plans for direct routes to Ireland skipping out the UK
France preparing additional sea ports for Irish freight traffic after Brexit
French transport minister says plans in place to segregate Irish freight traffic from UK freight arriving after Brexit
https://www.irishtimes.com/business...-irish-freight-traffic-after-brexit-1.3708174
and
Dublin Port is creating extra parking for hundreds of lorries from the UK awaiting inspection after Brexit.

Dozens more bays to carry out potential checks will also be created in an attempt to avoid delaying other traffic, according to the Irish plans for a no-deal withdrawal by the UK.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/port-creates-capacity-for-no-deal-brexit-70kbhc208
Unlike the UK with seabourn freight - this is happening plus there are ships available.


Plus the zero checks promised on the NI/ROI border - smugglers paradise has been agreed by Westminster .
Northern Ireland could become a Wild West-style smugglers’ paradise under the Government’s no-deal Brexit plans, hauliers have warned.

Seamus Leheny of the Freight Transport Association held confidential talks with civil servants ahead of Wednesday’s official announcement.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/ni-could-become-wild-west-125533554.html

So much for taking back control. Plus WTO has far more rules than we ever had to follow with the EU
 
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Howardh

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The EU-Japan agreement, as I understand it, is basically a free trade agreement, with no free movement and no influence of one on the other's legislation. Why can't Britain have the same?
Why can't we have the same deal as Britain currently has, which looked a darned good one? Oh, no, because we've thrown it away and replaced it with next to nothing.
 

simonw

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why cant we have the same as canada?
We can, if and when we get around to negotiating a free trade deal with the EU and they are amenable and we are amenable. However FAT do not equate to free access to the single market and still mean customs checks etc. See the North America Free Trade agreement and then look at the queues at the Mexican and Canadian borders.
 
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