Lothian Buses and ECB Discussion

[Jordan Adam]

The trackers are pretty old now, I don't think there's been any new installations since around 2010.
I believe the council's reasoning is that most people have smartphones so can get live times using bus tracker apps - at least that's what I was told at the time.

Only about 20% of people over 65 own a smart phone, even for people between the age of 50 and 64 it's only about 45%. While it's true that most people under 50 own a smart phone, you still require that bus stop infrastructure. Some teens and poorer people for example may have a limited monthly data allowance on their phone, if they were to run out of data they'd have no clue when the bus is due, tourists are very unlikely to have the app or even consider downloading it. While the the world is moving on with technology you can't leave the elderly and tourists out. This is also part of the reason why i'm also against operators ditching paper timetables.

 

[nesw]

I believe that Lothian/Edinburgh Council should’ve invited tenders for a new supplier and awarded the contract this year.

This document from a December meeting of the council gives more info. http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloa..._-_provision_during_new_system_implementation

 

[oldman]

Only about 20% of people over 65 own a smart phone, even for people between the age of 50 and 64 it's only about 45%. While it's true that most people under 50 own a smart phone, you still require that bus stop infrastructure. Some teens and poorer people for example may have a limited monthly data allowance on their phone, if they were to run out of data they'd have no clue when the bus is due, tourists are very unlikely to have the app or even consider downloading it. While the the world is moving on with technology you can't leave the elderly and tourists out. This is also part of the reason why i'm also against operators ditching paper timetables.

People without smartphones are in the same position as everyone was B.S., i.e. dependent on non-realtime information on the bus stop, so it's not total deprivation. It's the same thing as people without bank accounts, or, for that matter, people without cars. How much do we spend providing for those who cannot afford or access things most people have? Probably more than we do, but it's a genuine dilemma.

 

[Mitchell Hurd]

I'm quite shocked to learn of complaints about the tri-axle Volvo B8L / ADL E400XLB's - one problem I'm particularly surprised at is the new heating / cooling system has resulted in fumes in the drivers cab area which I believe has been modified.

I've not been to Scotland but that's a typical example of modern engineering. I bet the Olympians (or a handful of them) never had this problem!

 

[pgfb1306]

I know, likewise the ones up here are council operated. To be honest i'm surprised they still make the ones in Edinburgh given how ancient they appear! The screens used in Aberdeen are actually LCD so you have much more versatility, not to mention they're easier to read.

Unfortunately each installation required planning permission in Edinburgh, and as certain stops are in conservation areas, Lothian / CEC were forced to use the dreadful black on green screens to keep illumination to a minimum. Best to keep them all the same for spares, and also kept the power needs down as well.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Unfortunately each installation required planning permission in Edinburgh, and as certain stops are in conservation areas, Lothian / CEC were forced to use the dreadful black on green screens to keep illumination to a minimum. Best to keep them all the same for spares, and also kept the power needs down as well.

Thanks i wasn't aware of that. And yes the same system across the board is the most logical option, even if the system is lacking!

 

[pgfb1306]

Thanks i wasn't aware of that. And yes the same system across the board is the most logical option, even if the system is lacking!

It was quite something when it was new all those years ago - actual proper real time as opposed to a timetable on a screen which a lot of other areas had

 

[Gingerbus1991]

I'm quite shocked to learn of complaints about the tri-axle Volvo B8L / ADL E400XLB's - one problem I'm particularly surprised at is the new heating / cooling system has resulted in fumes in the drivers cab area which I believe has been modified.

I've not been to Scotland but that's a typical example of modern engineering. I bet the Olympians (or a handful of them) never had this problem!

Combustion heaters on them aren't a standard feature, they were optioned on because of there sheer size to help keep the interiors warm, I believe most of the time it's only when the cab windows are down and the wind blows in a certain direction or so I'm led to believe anyways from some ex-work friends.

 

[Jordan Adam]

It was quite something when it was new all those years ago - actual proper real time as opposed to a timetable on a screen which a lot of other areas had

Out of interest, when was the system installed? My guess would be the mid 00s, however that's just a random guess!

 

[OmniCity999]

Out of interest, when was the system installed? My guess would be the mid 00s, however that's just a random guess!

Believe the first ones were added around 2006-2009. They started on the 22 route.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

I'm sure it was 2005 that bus tracker was starting to be rolled out although not sure if it was active until early 06 but I think it was mid 05.

 

[Tom B]

By 2007 it was pretty much as widespread as it is now,odd additions excepting. (Calder Road at Longstone garage didn't have one for some time which I'd have thought would be an early one to do).

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

One thing which suprised me was when the council signed an agreement contract with JCDecaux over the new bus stops, that this contract never included that all bus stops should have a bus tracker display. Surely this was an oversight.

 

[OmniCity999]

One thing which suprised me was when the council signed an agreement contract with JCDecaux over the new bus stops, that this contract never included that all bus stops should have a bus tracker display. Surely this was an oversight.

The contact should have included every single Edinburgh bus stop (thats got a shelter). But it doesnt, it only includes City Centre and Portobello.

the new style of bus stop should also have included a bus tracker built into the frame, in every bus stop shelter, with the ones removed used elsewhere.

 

[OmniCity999]

The contact should have included every single Edinburgh bus stop (thats got a shelter). But it doesnt, it only includes City Centre and Portobello.

the new style of bus stop should also have included a bus tracker built into the frame, in every bus stop shelter, with the ones removed used elsewhere.

And personally i believe buses at Terminal points should have a countdown shown on their screens until the bus is due to depart.

 

[Auld reekie]

One thing which suprised me was when the council signed an agreement contract with JCDecaux over the new bus stops, that this contract never included that all bus stops should have a bus tracker display. Surely this was an oversight.

Is there any particular reason that some bus stops are still maintained by the council?
You would’ve thought that all would be the new type of bus stop.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

The contact should have included every single Edinburgh bus stop (thats got a shelter). But it doesnt, it only includes City Centre and Portobello.

the new style of bus stop should also have included a bus tracker built into the frame, in every bus stop shelter, with the ones removed used elsewhere.

This is exactly what I mean. They could have had a LED TV screen in to the wall of the shelter with display on both sides for the buses.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

Is there any particular reason that some bus stops are still maintained by the council?
You would’ve thought that all would be the new type of bus stop.

The new shelters are to replace older "advertising" ones or where an advertising one could go. JCD are installing them for free, because they can control what adverts are shown in and on the bus stops plus they have those large advertising eletronic bilboards in the city, all part of that contract. It's all down to advertising revenue for JCD.

 

[Auld reekie]

The new shelters are to replace older "advertising" ones or where an advertising one could go. JCD are installing them for free, because they can control what adverts are shown in and on the bus stops plus they have those large advertising eletronic bilboards in the city, all part of that contract. It's all down to advertising revenue for JCD.

Thanks.

 

[ScotRail158725]

113-120 heading into LC livery with 116 being done already. 750 is apparently being painted into mill race livery if not that then playing cards 44 livery

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

113-120 heading into LC livery with 116 being done already. 750 is apparently being painted into mill race livery if not that then playing cards 44 livery

Even partially cannibalised 115?

 

[alchemy]

Even partially cannibalised 115?

118 and 120 have not been showing on tracker for some time.

 

[alangla]

I've not been to Scotland but that's a typical example of modern engineering. I bet the Olympians (or a handful of them) never had this problem!

The K plate ex-New World First Bus that First Glasgow had certainly made some spectacular hot smells upstairs when they were climbing Cathkin Brae, so it’s not a new problem! The 09 plate E500s always seemed fine, though I don’t think I ever had a fast run on one.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Even partially cannibalised 115?

Not sure but the bach are for LC, 115 isnt in Seafield anymore so it could be getting done

 

[Siemens Trains]

Airlink would seem to be the least beneficial service for a dual door vehicle, since all (or almost all) passengers either join or leave at the Airport. Even in days when LRT bought dual door vehicles previously, I believe that the airlinks were single doored? (such as the coach seated Olympians latterly used on the 15s).

Perhaps they're considering the potential for cascading stock from service 100 in years to come. Is there an age limit on Airlink vehicles? They don't seem to stick around for very long on that route nowdays. Not sure how much it would cost to introduce a centre door on a model built without one originally. Maybe it is done for older buses going to London but there probably isn't a huge demand for this kind of conversion.

 

[alchemy]

Lothian Motorcoaches Minibus in Orkney today

 

[OmniCity999]

Perhaps they're considering the potential for cascading stock from service 100 in years to come. Is there an age limit on Airlink vehicles? They don't seem to stick around for very long on that route nowdays. Not sure how much it would cost to introduce a centre door on a model built without one originally. Maybe it is done for older buses going to London but there probably isn't a huge demand for this kind of conversion.

Everything that has 1 passenger door now will have 1 passenger door at the end of it's working life. Unless it has a fatal crash leaving it with a hole in the side.

 

[OmniCity999]

Everything that has 1 passenger door now will have 1 passenger door at the end of it's working life. Unless it has a fatal crash leaving it with a hole in the side.

Although now I've said that, they'll want us to start cutting holes in the side of buses when I go into work on Monday...

Likely on one of the B7 projects...

You never know with Lothian nowadays.

 

[A330Alex]

Anyone know when the ex-London two door Geminis might be entering service?

 

[VioletEclipse]

113-120 heading into LC livery with 116 being done already. 750 is apparently being painted into mill race livery if not that then playing cards 44 livery

Wonder if Lothian Country have realised that they are better off with single deckers than double deckers, but they are using 15 year old Eclipses...