Stagecoach North Scotland (Bluebird and Highland)

[TheGrandWazoo]

I must admit, when I was driving, I loved driving coaches on bus routes, leopards, tigers that sort of thing.

However, the boot now being on the other foot as it were, I can't do steps and narrow aisles any more so they're a right pain!

I must admit to being a lover of the older vehicles a nice RELL, or LHS does exactly the same job as an enviro, and after a few years in service the enviro is probably a rougher ride too. I'm sure with a bit of modernisation the RE or LH could have been developed into s low floor vehicle!

Pretty certain the LH couldn't have been developed as low floor - they were underfloor engined.

To be fair the simple reason why the Enviro may be a rougher ride once some time has passed is because it's a light weight bus. I wish Stagecoach had ordered B7RLE's rather than Enviro300's as the B7RLE is a far superior product and can handle rural work quite well unlike Enviro's.

B7RLE fuel economy is much worse than an e300 though - more of an issue on rural services

 

[Jordan Adam]

B7RLE fuel economy is much worse than an e300 though - more of an issue on rural services

I'd question whether that's still the case on faster rural runs, i can't see how a E300 at very high RPM for long periods of time is more economical than a B7RLE (I'm more talking D7E engine models).

Even if the E300's were better on fuel, in my view vehicle suitability should really be a bigger factor, obviously operators don't think down this path.

 

[Caleb2010]

Yes, the LH was underfloor engined, it was one of the better designs as s lightweight saloon though, which is what I was getting at!

I suppose the suspension let them down, but when you're being rattled around inside one of Elgin's finest enviro's hanging on for grim death, you hark for the days old when the ride was decidedly softer!!

Or is it just the way it's driven?

 

[GusB]

If you're going to go retro, it really should be an old Fordie, or better still - an Albion Viking with a six-speed crash gearbox.

I'll get my coat.

 

[computerSaysNo]

To be fair the simple reason why the Enviro may be a rougher ride once some time has passed is because it's a light weight bus. I wish Stagecoach had ordered B7RLE's rather than Enviro300's as the B7RLE is a far superior product and can handle rural work quite well unlike Enviro's. The current Enviro200MMC is based on the same chassis that the original Dart SLF was.

I quite frequently see Panther's on the 38, which is laughable given that it was meant to be the low floor alternative to the 35. But now the 35 has went low floor with totally unsuitable deckers!

Out of interest why is the B7RLE better than the Envrio, and why does it handle rural work better in particular?

Also why do you say the double deckers are unsuitable? They are certainly better than the Enviro's I was on, at least the doubles have charging ports, heating and reasonably comfortable seats!

In my opinion all the rural routes should have a bus with similar specification to the single deckers which East Coast Buses run between Edinburgh and Dunbar (sorry, I don't know what type these are!). They've got basically a coach-spec interior but with low-floor access, so they're comfortable enough for long journeys and are still easily accessable to those with limited mobility.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Out of interest why is the B7RLE better than the Envrio, and why does it handle rural work better in particular?

Also why do you say the double deckers are unsuitable? They are certainly better than the Enviro's I was on, at least the doubles have charging ports, heating and reasonably comfortable seats!

In my opinion all the rural routes should have a bus with similar specification to the single deckers which East Coast Buses run between Edinburgh and Dunbar (sorry, I don't know what type these are!). They've got basically a coach-spec interior but with low-floor access, so they're comfortable enough for long journeys and are still easily accessable to those with limited mobility.

The B7RLE is a heavy weight full size single decker, where as the E300 is a light weight single decker (almost a glorified Midi-bus). The Enviro400MMC's are not suited to the 35 due to it's length and challenging nature, there's been issues with unreliability since they arrived with them frequently running 20+ Minutes late or being replaced by Panthers.

 

[Jordan Adam]

The timetable for the new service 44 is now online.

https://www.stagecoachbus.com/servi...rticle?SituationId=ID-03/06/2019-15:13:05:421

New service 44 to Countesswells

Brand new service 44 to Countesswells will begin on Monday 24th June 2019. Download the timetable here.

Service 44 operates between Countesswells and Kingswells P&R. Connections are available at Kingswells P&R to service X17. This connection requires a change of bus at Kingswells P&R.

Return travel between Countesswells and the City Centre is available at a discounted rate of £3 - this ticket is only valid on service 44 and X17. Service 44 is within our Aberdeen zone 1 ticket area and for £3.70 you can travel on any Stagecoach bus within Aberdeen City.

For more details of this service see our press release.

In addition to that the timetables for the changes from the 7th of July are starting to appear.

NEW Service 39 (Elgin - Aviemore).
Elgin - Toremore (Bluebird Journeys)
Elgin - Toremore (Highland Journeys)
Toremore - Aviemore (Bluebird Journeys)
Toremore - Aviemore (Highland Journeys)

Service 727 (Aberdeen-Airport). Now operates overnight and via TECA.
*Note the 727 PDF also includes the current timetable so you may have to scroll through.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

Out of interest why is the B7RLE better than the Envrio, and why does it handle rural work better in particular?

Also why do you say the double deckers are unsuitable? They are certainly better than the Enviro's I was on, at least the doubles have charging ports, heating and reasonably comfortable seats!

In my opinion all the rural routes should have a bus with similar specification to the single deckers which East Coast Buses run between Edinburgh and Dunbar (sorry, I don't know what type these are!). They've got basically a coach-spec interior but with low-floor access, so they're comfortable enough for long journeys and are still easily accessable to those with limited mobility.

Those East Coast B8's you refer too are simply a bus with uprated seats.

On the subject of heavy duty singles with a GVW of 18t, it may have been the case that the B7 singles were comfortable but the newer B8RLE has lossed some of that finesse and ride comfort of its older brother through searching for improved fuel economy. ECB longer wheel base version causes them to feel less bouncy on undulating road surfaces, thats for sure!

There's less to differentiate between the 11.8m Enviro 200 MMC and a 11.8m Wright Eclipse nowadays except weight.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

The B7RLE is a heavy weight full size single decker, where as the E300 is a light weight single decker (almost a glorified Midi-bus). The Enviro400MMC's are not suited to the 35 due to it's length and challenging nature, there's been issues with unreliability since they arrived with them frequently running 20+ Minutes late or being replaced by Panthers.

When you say length, 10.9m?
What else could be used if these aren't suitable, length wise?

If a decker is needed for capacity on such a route that's demanding the scania N250UD chassis would be a better choice given the option of the 280hp/1400nm rated engine.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Those East Coast B8's you refer too are simply a bus with uprated seats.

On the subject of heavy duty singles with a GVW of 18t, it may have been the case that the B7 singles were comfortable but the newer B8RLE has lossed some of that finesse and ride comfort of its older brother through searching for improved fuel economy. ECB longer wheel base version causes them to feel less bouncy on undulating road surfaces, thats for sure!

There's less to differentiate between the 11.8m Enviro 200 MMC and a 11.8m Wright Eclipse nowadays except weight.

Regarding the "drop in quality" with the B8RLE i couldn't agree more. The shorter version of the B8RLE is longer than 11.8M however, IIRC it's 12.1M with the LWB versions ECB have being 13.2M.

When you say length, 10.9m?
What else could be used if these aren't suitable, length wise?

If a decker is needed for such a route that's demanding the scania N250UD chassis would be a better choice given the option of the 280hp/1400nm rated option.

Length as in the length of the route not the bus.

I wouldn't agree with the Scania offering, the engine only being 5 cylinders gives it a noticeable disadvantage and you still have the issue of a "city bus" operating a "coach" route. The 280hp option is only on the CNG models. These E400MMC's on the whole were just a massive downgrade. Stagecoach have lost passengers on other "coach corridors" before when they started allocated buses, so i'm surprised they're still doing it.

They should have bought B11R/Panther's with the ZF Ecolife gearbox for the 35, the Elites on the 10 already use this drive train and often end up on the 35 (Elgin has two duties on the 35 and 9 of the 10 Elites), they're probably the most suited vehicle type on the market at the moment for such a service.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

Regarding the "drop in quality" with the B8RLE i couldn't agree more. The shorter version of the B8RLE is longer than 11.8M however, IIRC it's 12.1M with the LWB versions ECB have being 13.2M.



Length as in the length of the route not the bus.

I wouldn't agree with the Scania offering, the engine only being 5 cylinders gives it a noticeable disadvantage and you still have the issue of a "city bus" operating a "coach" route. The 280hp option is only on the CNG models. These E400MMC's on the whole were just a massive downgrade. Stagecoach have lost passengers on other "coach corridors" before when they started allocated buses, so i'm surprised they're still doing it.

They should have bought B11R/Panther's with the ZF Ecolife gearbox for the 35, the Elites on the 10 already use this drive train and often end up on the 35 (Elgin has two duties on the 35 and 9 of the 10 Elites), they're probably the most suited vehicle type on the market at the moment for such a service.

You need to do your research.

The scania gas option is rated at 280hp with 1350nm.

The diesel options are 250hp/1250nm or 280hp/1400nm.

Converting a diesel engine to gas operation in practice lowers engine output hence why the 280 rating had been chosen for gas specification, thats why the 250 rating was not chosen.

The elites might use the 10.8ltr 380hp/1800nm option but the elites are also heavier than a decker, word round the grapevine says that Plaxton is pushing volvo for the 430 option with the Ecolife, ZFs Ecolife can now support an engine putting out 2300nm so theoretically the D11K with 460hp/2200nm is possible, as the likes of VanHool and Irizar have specified DAF engines with, we have been through this before but engine longevity isn't necessarily just down to displacement size.

 

[Jordan Adam]

You need to do your research.

The scania gas option is rated at 280hp with 1350nm.

The diesel options are 250hp/1250nm or 280hp/1400nm.

Converting a diesel engine to gas operation in practice lowers engine output hence why the 280 rating had been chosen for gas specification, thats why the 250 rating was not chosen.

The elites might use the 10.8ltr 380hp/1800nm option but the elites are also heavier than a decker, word round the grapevine says that Plaxton is pushing volvo for the 430 option with the Ecolife, ZFs Ecolife can now support an engine putting out 2300nm so theoretically the D11K with 460hp/2200nm is possible, as the likes of VanHool and Irizar have specified DAF engines with, we have been through this before but engine longevity isn't necessarily just down to displacement size.

That may be the case for the diesel option but to my knowledge no 280hp diesel models have been built for the UK. Either way that's off topic and i wouldn't deem them at all suitable for the 35 regardless of if they have or haven't got 30 extra horses!

I don't see what relevance the Elite being heavier has to my point? I'm talking about vehicle suitability to a route, not what has better economy. Megabus aren't going to start using Optare Solo's on the M9 just because they're cheaper to run than an Astromega!

The Elite's on the 10 rated at 380BHP have more than enough get up and go, actually substantially more than enough. Possibly some of the fasted PSV's on the road up here in terms of acceleration. At higher speed the engine isn't being strained either, albeit with the route 35 you spend most of your time between 40/50MPH. A higher power rating with the Ecolife wouldn't be a bad thing, but to be honest i don't see the urgency for it when it comes to the 2 axle models. Plaxton will just be wanting the Ecolife with the 430 option so they can start offering it in the Tri-axle's.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

That may be the case for the diesel option but to my knowledge no 280hp diesel models have been built for the UK. Either way that's off topic and i wouldn't deem them at all suitable for the 35 regardless of if they have or haven't got 30 extra horses!

I don't see what relevance the Elite being heavier has to my point? I'm talking about vehicle suitability to a route, not what has better economy. Megabus aren't going to start using Optare Solo's on the M9 just because they're cheaper to run than an Astromega!

The Elite's on the 10 rated at 380BHP have more than enough get up and go, actually substantially more than enough. Possibly some of the fasted PSV's on the road up here in terms of acceleration. At higher speed the engine isn't being strained either, albeit with the route 35 you spend most of your time between 40/50MPH. A higher power rating with the Ecolife wouldn't be a bad thing, but to be honest i don't see the urgency for it when it comes to the 2 axle models. Plaxton will just be wanting the Ecolife with the 430 option so they can start offering it in the Tri-axle's.

Plaxton openly states too choose at least the 430hp on 2-axles, obviously with the iShift atm.

The Elites weigh around 13.5t, given that the scania-decker I proposed is around 12t, the EXTRA torque from volvos 380hp engine is made null and void by that extra weight if indeed a decker is the alternative, albeit with some uprated seats & tinted windows fitted.

The Ecolife has no power loss between gears adding to its acceloration.

Large displacement, Low-Revving/High Torque diesel engines found in buses and Coaches aren't developed with outright top end power in mind.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Plaxton openly states too choose at least the 430hp on 2-axles, obviously with the iShift atm.

The Elites weigh around 13.5t, given that the scania-decker I proposed is around 12t, the EXTRA torque from volvos 380hp engine is made null and void by that extra weight if indeed a decker is the alternative, albeit with some uprated seats & tinted windows fitted.

The Ecolife has no power loss between gears adding to its acceloration.

Large displacement, Low-Revving/High Torque diesel engines found in buses and Coaches aren't developed with outright top end power in mind.

I think there's a difference between numbers on a piece of paper and reality, that being said the Elite is far more aerodynamic than a decker. And again back to my original argument which was about suitability a decker like a E400MMC regardless of how specified is unsuitable for the Aberdeen-Moray corridor. You can't just put in some DP seats, tint the windows and then say it's a suitable replacement to the coach. They tried that with Buchan years ago when they brought in some Tri-axle Olympians fitted with Toilets, the idea quickly backfired and they replaced them with Volvo B10MA Artics, of course now the route is operated using unsuitable Interdecks! The coaches offer a far superior passenger experience compared with a bus along with being fitted with a toilet, something which is very much needed on such a long route like the 10 or 35.

On another note if you want an idea of how well the new E400MMC's are doing. They have 15 of them to cover a PVR of 12 but yet are still having to use Panther's as the E400MMC's are already "dying out" despite only being on the road 2 months! To make matters worse 19375 is now at Macduff and has been a regular on the 35 this past week, i wouldn't even put 19375 on a staff shuttle, never mind the 35!

 

[Red Onion]

The timetable for the new service 44 is now online.

https://www.stagecoachbus.com/servi...rticle?SituationId=ID-03/06/2019-15:13:05:421


In addition to that the timetables for the changes from the 7th of July are starting to appear.

Interestingly from that timetable, it looks like they are offering a combined through ticket from Countesswells to Union Square. Something I’d like to see more of, for example I do Ellon to Westhill frequently by car and stay overnight which rules out using the zone 3 day ticket (which isn’t bad value). The cost of two period returns makes it somewhat prohibitive to do by bus! I don’t make the trip often enough for a week/month ticket.

I’d like to see some sort of return ticket, even if it’s just between major points as it would help change my travel habits. The 747/x17 route actually works not too bad timewise!

On another note, I haven’t looked at a westhill timetable in ages but when I last lived there, the last bus was 2345 from Union Square and always seemed busy. I’m guessing this stopped for logistic/staffing reasons.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Interestingly from that timetable, it looks like they are offering a combined through ticket from Countesswells to Union Square. Something I’d like to see more of, for example I do Ellon to Westhill frequently by car and stay overnight which rules out using the zone 3 day ticket (which isn’t bad value). The cost of two period returns makes it somewhat prohibitive to do by bus! I don’t make the trip often enough for a week/month ticket.

I’d like to see some sort of return ticket, even if it’s just between major points as it would help change my travel habits. The 747/x17 route actually works not too bad timewise!

On another note, I haven’t looked at a westhill timetable in ages but when I last lived there, the last bus was 2345 from Union Square and always seemed busy. I’m guessing this stopped for logistic/staffing reasons.

I agree, some through tickets for the 747 would be a massive improvement. It would likely attract more passengers from Westhill. £3 for a return from Countesswell's in to the City is a great offer and could potentially be what makes this service work long term.

Many of the evening journeys on the X17 were council subsidised and have been cut along with the rest of the Westhill network in recent years. Stagecoach are clearly trying to expand their presence in the city with them now operated the 9U (Contract), 14, 15A, 44, 59 & 94. However i think they should be putting more effort in to what they currently run rather than trying to expand when they're struggling to cover the services they already have as it is!

On another note, if you live in Ellon i feel incredibly sorry for you if you're not near the main route of the 60/67/68, the frequency of the 54 is abysmal.

 

[Red Onion]

I think it would be good, would certainly help the 747/757 services in terms of passenger growth. It’s disheartening to see them so empty, I just hope there can be a good growth in numbers. As for the three quid return from Countesswells, a cracking deal, hopefully it will get passengers onto the service.

Ah, I didn’t realise there was a level of subsidy but that makes sense. I still remember when the old council subsidised services ran out to Alford and the likes, my old man fell foul of the 2315 service after a night out and woke up some distance from home. Ie Alford I have noticed they are expanding in town which has benefits but yes, reliability on current services is needed first!

Ah I am lucky in that the Ellon interchange is no more than a ten minute walk for me so I have easy access to all services, even the park and ride is about 15/20 minutes away if I can avoid stopping in brewdog for a pint or three!

 

[Jordan Adam]

I think it would be good, would certainly help the 747/757 services in terms of passenger growth. It’s disheartening to see them so empty, I just hope there can be a good growth in numbers. As for the three quid return from Countesswells, a cracking deal, hopefully it will get passengers onto the service.

Ah, I didn’t realise there was a level of subsidy but that makes sense. I still remember when the old council subsidised services ran out to Alford and the likes, my old man fell foul of the 2315 service after a night out and woke up some distance from home. Ie Alford I have noticed they are expanding in town which has benefits but yes, reliability on current services is needed first!

Ah I am lucky in that the Ellon interchange is no more than a ten minute walk for me so I have easy access to all services, even the park and ride is about 15/20 minutes away if I can avoid stopping in brewdog for a pint or three!

The 757 is partially subsidised by a house builders fund from Chapelton, however once that runs out it could put the service at risk. The main downfall for the 757 is the lack of connection with the X6/X7/7B. Quite often you'll just miss the bus to/from Aberdeen by two or three minutes.

The Aberdeen-Westhill-Alford service still runs, albeit as the much reduced 218. I should note that all their expanding in the city so far has been through winning contracts to operate subsidised routes. So no Commercial risks as of yet.

It's a shame Ellon no longer has the old 50/51 (Different to the current services of the same number), the 54 really is poor for residents in the west side of Ellon.

 

[DMU180]

I think there's a difference between numbers on a piece of paper and reality, that being said the Elite is far more aerodynamic than a decker. And again back to my original argument which was about suitability a decker like a E400MMC regardless of how specified is unsuitable for the Aberdeen-Moray corridor. You can't just put in some DP seats, tint the windows and then say it's a suitable replacement to the coach. They tried that with Buchan years ago when they brought in some Tri-axle Olympians fitted with Toilets, the idea quickly backfired and they replaced them with Volvo B10MA Artics, of course now the route is operated using unsuitable Interdecks! The coaches offer a far superior passenger experience compared with a bus along with being fitted with a toilet, something which is very much needed on such a long route like the 10 or 35.

On another note if you want an idea of how well the new E400MMC's are doing. They have 15 of them to cover a PVR of 12 but yet are still having to use Panther's as the E400MMC's are already "dying out" despite only being on the road 2 months! To make matters worse 19375 is now at Macduff and has been a regular on the 35 this past week, i wouldn't even put 19375 on a staff shuttle, never mind the 35!

Not that I necessarily disagree with you regarding the double deckers being a strange choice for the 35, but, I'd be interested to know how many people actually make longer or end to end journeys. Whenever I've used the 35 it seems to be lots of short journeys but very few long ones. Thinking of it in that way the Enviro 400's actually make a lot of sense.

Anyone going to Elgin would obviously get the 10, if you were going to somewhere at the Elgin end of the 35 route you'd change at Fochabers and catch a 35 heading back toward Aberdeen. I can't imagine there would be many people travelling from Aberdeen all the way to Buckie or somewhere. Although I could be wrong.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Not that I necessarily disagree with you regarding the double deckers being a strange choice for the 35, but, I'd be interested to know how many people actually make longer or end to end journeys. Whenever I've used the 35 it seems to be lots of short journeys but very few long ones. Thinking of it in that way the Enviro 400's actually make a lot of sense.

Anyone going to Elgin would obviously get the 10, if you were going to somewhere at the Elgin end of the 35 route you'd change at Fochabers and catch a 35 heading back toward Aberdeen. I can't imagine there would be many people travelling from Aberdeen all the way to Buckie or somewhere. Although I could be wrong.

You are partially right, getting the 10+38 from Aberdeen to Buckie is not that quicker though, you're talking about 10/15 minutes if that and even then that's if you make the very tight 2 minute connection! Not to mention the lack of through ticketing means it's more expensive. Because of this the bulk of people in Buckie do just use the 35. So you're asking people to spend 3 hours on what is pretty much a "city bus" with uncomfortable DP seats and no toilet (which the previous Panther's had). Add to that the awful endless high pitch scream of the flywheel from the "Smart Hybrid" system.

The only reason they've went with E400MMC's is "capacity issues" and the fact you can't get anything longer than 13M round Buckpool. Swapping the routes of the 35 and 38 between Buckie and Fochabers would solve this issue. Additionally if they hadn't reduced frequency by 50% in under 2 years they wouldn't have the issue either!

 

[GusB]

Not that I necessarily disagree with you regarding the double deckers being a strange choice for the 35, but, I'd be interested to know how many people actually make longer or end to end journeys. Whenever I've used the 35 it seems to be lots of short journeys but very few long ones. Thinking of it in that way the Enviro 400's actually make a lot of sense.

Anyone going to Elgin would obviously get the 10, if you were going to somewhere at the Elgin end of the 35 route you'd change at Fochabers and catch a 35 heading back toward Aberdeen. I can't imagine there would be many people travelling from Aberdeen all the way to Buckie or somewhere. Although I could be wrong.

I once took what was the 305 from Aberdeen to Elgin one Sunday because I'd just missed the 10. It was freezing cold and I really didn't fancy hanging about waiting for the next one. On the 305 it was an hour longer, and I was charged a quid extra for the scenic route! These days if I was only travelling to Buckie, I'd probably just put up with the longer route and not bother faffing about changing at Fochabers. It would all be weather-dependent I suppose.

There used to be an "express" Buckie-Aberdeen route many moons ago - the 308.

 

[Jordan Adam]

I once took what was the 305 from Aberdeen to Elgin one Sunday because I'd just missed the 10. It was freezing cold and I really didn't fancy hanging about waiting for the next one. On the 305 it was an hour longer, and I was charged a quid extra for the scenic route! These days if I was only travelling to Buckie, I'd probably just put up with the longer route and not bother faffing about changing at Fochabers. It would all be weather-dependent I suppose.

There used to be an "express" Buckie-Aberdeen route many moons ago - the 308.

The 308 still remains today, albeit in the much reduced Inverurie - Aberchirder route.

I can only imagine the bulk of people who use the 35 in it's entire length are enthusiasts, indeed i know a few who done it in it's full length back when it was a 6 hour long route going to Inverness!

 

[GusB]

Pre-Stagecoach there were three options for Elgin to Aberdeen: 305 (via Coast), 306 (via Huntly where drivers swapped over) and the limited stop 540/960/560 "Citylink" route.

I'd quite like to do the 35 again, although it would be on a rover explorer ticket and getting off at various places along the way. I'd probably end up getting the 10 back, though!

 

[Jordan Adam]

Pre-Stagecoach there were three options for Elgin to Aberdeen: 305 (via Coast), 306 (via Huntly where drivers swapped over) and the limited stop 540/960/560 "Citylink" route.

I'd quite like to do the 35 again, although it would be on a rover explorer ticket and getting off at various places along the way. I'd probably end up getting the 10 back, though!

iirc the Bluebird Xplorer (funnily enough the cheapest option if you want to go from Buckie to Aberdeen via the 10) is only £17.90 which given the area it covers is not too bad. In a number of cases it works out cheaper than single/return fares!

 

[GusB]

iirc the Bluebird Xplorer (funnily enough the cheapest option if you want to go from Buckie to Aberdeen via the 10) is only £17.90 which given the area it covers is not too bad. In a number of cases it works out cheaper than single/return fares!

Absolutely, and one that I would recommend to anyone who would like to visit our wee corner of the country. I have my grumbles about fares from time to time; I noticed the Elgin Dayrider Plus is £5.10 nowadays, but when I worked in Lossie it was a case of having to purchase two separate returns to get to work (on mornings when I'd been out the night before, so entirely self-inflicted!) The Dayrider Zone has since been extended, so one ticket would cover both legs of the journey.

The Explorer with its coverage from Dundee to Inverness is superb. Even for someone doing a single journey between those points it's a fairly reasonable price, and they wouldn't have to do the whole thing in one go (technically two goes, I suppose).

 

[overthewater]

Timetable Consultation 18 Jun 2019 to 29 Jun 2019

Timetable Consultation18 Jun 2019 to 29 Jun 2019

We are inviting customers to review our proposed timetables from Tuesday 18th June until Friday 28th June 2019. All feedback received will be reviewed ahead of the final timetables being submitted for registration. The new timetables are planned to take effect from Monday 19th August 2019.

Aberdeenshire Council made some changes to supported services and in line with these changes coming into effect on Monday 19th Augustwe have reviewed our network across Aberdeen and Aberdeenshire. Also from the same date a series of revisions are proposed to take place in the Highlands.

David Liston, Managing Director for Stagecoach North Scotland said: “Our plans to revise our network in August follow a thorough analysis of the performance of our bus services and also take on board feedback from our customers, stakeholders and staff. We continually monitor our services and these revisions will allow us to improve our reliability and use all of our resources in the best way to meet the demand for bus travel across the region. All feedback received helps us to ensure we have optimised departure times and routes and would be grateful for all comments by Friday 28th June 2019 either via email or in person at one of the events we will be hosting or attending.”

How to give your feedback –

Send via email no later than Friday 28th June 2019 to [email protected].



At an event –



Stagecoach representatives will be available to discuss the proposals at the below events –

• Thursday 20th June Inverness Bus Station, 10:00-12:00
• Thursday 20th June: Aberdeenshire Area Bus Forum, Gordon House, Inverurie, 19:30 – 21:30
• Monday 24th June: Kemnay Town Hall 12:30-14:30.
• Tuesday 25th June: Union Square Bus Station, Aberdeen 15:00-17:00
• Thursday 27th June Lochardil Hotel, Inverness, 14:00-15:30
• Thursday 27th June Inverness Bus Station, 16:00-18:00

Summary of the proposals (click the service number to download the proposed timetable) –

MORAY

Service 10 (Inverness-Elgin-Aberdeen): Revised evening services between Inverness and Elgin in the evenings to reflect lower levels of usage.

Poorly used Service 37/X37 journeys in the mornings and evenings will be withdrawn and replaced by Service 10B, which will retain similar links.

On weekday afternoons an additional journey from Aberdeen to Huntly will provide additional capacity from Aberdeen Royal Infirmary. This journey will replace the 1615 journey on service X37.

On a Saturday, an additional return journey between Huntly and Aberdeen will provide additional capacity, these journeys will replace Service X37 between Aberdeen and Inverurie.

Service 31 (Elgin-Findhorn-Forres): Revised timetable. All journeys, including school service 31D journeys, will operate as service 31/31A. A 0759 Service 31A journey will offer morning peak arrival from Forres estates into Elgin, partly replacing a journey on service 10. New 1715 Service 31A journey will replace a Service 10 journey to and from Inverness and will extend through to the estates to offer a commuter return link.

Service 35 (Elgin-Banff-Aberdeen): Timetable changes to improve service punctuality and offer improved links and connections. Monday-Friday journeys at 0550 and 0650 from Macduff to Elgin will operate 10 minutes earlier to offer earlier commuter arrivals into Elgin.

The Monday-Friday journey at 1550 from Aberdeen to Banff to operate 5 minutes earlier.

The Monday-Friday journeys at 1610, 1640, 1710 from Aberdeen to operate 5 minutes later.

The Monday to Saturday journey 2035 from Aberdeen to operate 10 minutes later.

Journeys on Sunday at 1700 and 1830 from Elgin to operate 8 mins later.

The journey on Sunday at 2035 from Aberdeen to Elgin to now operate at 2100.

The journey on Sunday at 1649 from Banff to Aberdeen to operate 30 minutes later.

An additional Saturday journey from Aberdeen to Oldmeldrum will operate at 0825.

The following journeys will be withdrawn:

Weekday 0637 from Elgin to Macduff.

Weekday 1530 from Aberdeen to Banff.

Saturday 0818 from Banff to Oldmeldrum.

Service 38 (Elgin-Buckie): Minor timetable changes including an additional weekday journey at 0650 from Elgin to Buckie.

ABERDEENSHIRE

Service 301: Timetable changes as a result of Aberdeenshire Council contract changes. The 1605 journey from Huntly Square to Aberchirder will extend through to Macduff.

The 1657 journey from Aberchirder to Huntly will be withdrawn.

Service 10 (Inverness-Elgin-Aberdeen): Revised evening services between Inverness and Elgin in the evenings to reflect lower levels of usage.

Poorly used Service 37/X37 journeys in the mornings and evenings will be withdrawn and replaced by Service 10B, which will retain similar links.

On weekday afternoons an additional journey from Aberdeen to Huntly will provide additional capacity from Aberdeen Royal Infirmary. This journey will replace the 1615 journey on service X37.

On a Saturday, an additional return journey between Huntly and Aberdeen will provide additional capacity, these journeys will replace Service X37 between Aberdeen and Inverurie.

Service 37/X37 (Aberdeen-Inverurie): Timetable and route changes. Journeys only operating between Aberdeen and Kintore will be replaced by Service 220.

Poorly used Service 37/X37 journeys in the mornings and evenings will be withdrawn and replaced by Service 10B.

The 1615 Service X37 to be replaced by a 1615 Service 10 to Huntly.

Service 41 (Insch-Inverurie): Timetable changes. On weekdays the 0625 and 0658 from Insch to Inverurie will be retimed to 0602 and 0702.

On weekdays the 1846 and 1935 from Inverurie to Insch will be retimed to 1812 and 1925.

On Saturdays 0602 from Insch to Inverurie will operate 4 minutes earlier.

On Saturdays the 1810 and 1852 from Inverurie to Insch will be retimed to 1810 and 1852.

An additional Sunday journey from Insch to Inverurie will operate at 1202.

Service 218 (Aberdeen-Alford): Journeys will be retimed to improve the overall frequency between Aberdeen and Alford with Services 220/420.

An additional journey will be added from Alford to Aberdeen at 1116.

Service 220/420 (Aberdeen-Kemnay-Alford, replaces services 220/X20): Services will operate as either Service 220 or 420.

Service 220 journeys will replace journeys on Service 37 between Aberdeen and Kintore during the off peak and operate via Aberdeen Royal Infirmary.

Service 420 journeys will not serve Kintore.

Additional journeys will operate to and from Alford.

On a Sunday an additional journey to Alford will operate and services will operate every 2 hours; this improves the return options from the City.

Service 221/421/422: Morning School journeys from Inverurie to Kemnay will operate 10 minutes later, following changes to School timetable.

Weekday journeys on service 421 will be withdrawn following the transfer of this service to another operator (Bain’s Coaches). The Saturday service will continue to be operated by Stagecoach.

Minor changes to service 422

NEW Service 26 (Stonehaven-Laurencekirk-Luthermuir): Following the award of a contract from Aberdeenshire Council, this service will operate 10 return journeys per day (Monday-Friday) between Stonehaven and Laurencekirk.

Service 50 (Ellon-Newburgh): Revised timetable.

Service 54 (Ellon-Aberdeen): Monday to Saturday, two additional off peak journeys will operate between Aberdeen, Balmedie and Foveran.

Revised Sunday timetable.

Service 60/63 (Peterhead-Aberdeen): Revised timetable. The Monday to Friday 0655 Service X60 from Grange Road to Ellon will be replaced with a journey at 0645 on Service 60 from Peterhead Interchange to Ellon.

The Monday to Friday 1205 Service X60 from Ellon to Aberdeen will be withdrawn.

The Monday to Saturday journeys at 1945 and 2045 from Peterhead to Aberdeen will be replaced with a journey at 2016.

The Monday to Saturday journeys at 2030, 2130, 2230 from Aberdeen to Peterhead will be replaced with departures at 2045 and 2215.

The Saturday journey at 0721 on Service X60 from Peterhead Grange Road to Ellon will be withdrawn.

Service 67/68 (Fraserburgh-Aberdeen): On Saturdays an additional Service 67 journey from Fraserburgh to Ellon will operate at 0700.

On Sundays, the 2047 journey from Fraserburgh to Aberdeen will operate 30 minutes later at 2117.

On Sundays, the 2205 from Aberdeen to Fraserburgh will operate 30 minutes later at 2235.

Service 290/291/292/293: Revised timetable. The 0740 journey from Aberdeen to Tarves will be withdrawn

All journeys to now extend through to Methlick.

Journeys to Fyvie will operate through as services 291/292, with no journeys operating as service 293.

The 2355 journey from Methlick to Aberdeen will operate as Service 290 on Monday to Friday.

The 2355 journey from Methlick to Aberdeen on Saturdays wil be withdrawn, the 2250 journey from Aberdeen will extend through to Fyvie.

The Saturday 0620 journey on Service 291 from Aberdeen to Methlick will be withdrawn and replaced with a Service 290 journey at 0740

The Sunday timetable will be revised to offer an additional return trip to Aberdeen.

Service 119 (Aboyne-Culter-Aberdeen): This service will operate between Peterculter and Aberdeen only.

Service 201/202/203/901 (Braemar-Ballater-Aberdeen): Revised timetable. On weekdays the 1315 journey from Aberdeen to Lumphanan will extend to Aboyne and Ballater.

On weekdays the 1430 journey from Aberdeen to Banchory will be re-timed to 1415 and will extend through to Lumphanan.

On weekdays the 1448 journey from Lumphanan to Aberdeen will be withdrawn and replaced with a journey at 1548.

On weekdays the 1515 journey from Braemar to Aberdeen will operate 20 minutes later starting at 1535.

On Sundays a number of Service 901 journeys retimed to offer a through link in the morning and evening.

Service 210: This service will be withdrawn.

Service 747/757 (Peterhead/Ellon-Aberdeen Airport-Stonehaven-Montrose and Aberdeen Airport-Portlethen-Chapleton):

Service 747 will operate to a revised timetable to reflect travel patterns that have developed since the introduction of this new service in January 2019. The weekday timetable will be revised to operate between Stonehaven and Montrose every 2 hours, with a reduction in the evening service. Connections towards the South from Stonehaven will be available on service X7. The route will also be revised to include Balmedie.

On Saturdays and Sundays, the service will operate every 2 hours between Montrose and Stonehaven.

Service 757 will be withdrawn. This service was introduced following requests from customers and stakeholders to introduce links from the Portlethen area to Aberdeen Airport. Unfortunately, despite constructive discussions with stakeholder groups, the level of patronage on the service has been very low. It is therefore not sustainable for us to continue to operate this service. Connections to Aberdeen Airport will still be available at Stonehaven and Kingswells Park and Ride on service 747, or in Aberdeen city centre using JET 727.

HIGHLANDS

Service 1/1A/1B: Service 1B journeys will extend during the off peak to Milton of Leys - customers will be able to connect at Milton of Leys to Service 4 every hour for additional links to Raigmore Hospital.

Services in the evening will increase in frequency to every 30 minutes with hourly extensions through to Milton of Leys. This service improvement is partially supported by developer funding.

The 0755 journey from Tomatin Road will be withdrawn.

Revisions to the evening timetable on Sundays.

Service 2vening service withdrawn and replaced by journeys on services 3 and 5.

Service 2S: New service to operate 2 return journeys Monday-Friday from the city centre to serve Royal Northern Infirmary and Highland Hospice following customer feedback.

Service 2U:The 0815 journey from Westhill will now operate at 0810.

Service 3/3A/3B:Revised timetable.

South Kessock will now be served by new service 3B every 30 minutes Monday-Saturday and by service 3A every 30 minutes on Sundays.

Service 3U withdrawn.

Revised evening timetable.

Service 4: Revised timetable.

The 0812 journey from Milton of Leys will operate on School holidays only.

The 1710 journey from Union Street to Highfield will operate 2 minutes later.

The 1728 journey from Highfield to Queensgate will operate 2 minutes later.

The 1145 journey from Highfield will terminate at Queensgate at 1205.

The 1210 journey from Queensgate will not operate on Fridays during the school term.

The 1547 journey from Milton of Leys to Highfield will operate as two journeys, one from Milton of Leys to the city centre, followed by a journey from the city centre to Highfield.

Revised evening timetable, all journeys will operate as service 4.

Service 4F:No changes.

Service 4S:Revised route and timetable. This service will now serve Dunain Road.

Service 5/5A/5D/105: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

Several journeys will extend to Cawdor, Piperhill and Nairn on weekdays.

Revised evening timetable featuring hourly services between the city centre and Culloden and journeys every 2 hours to Ardersier (via Inverness Airport) and Croy and Tornagrain.

Service 6/7:Revised route, route numbers and timetable.

Services will operate as 7A (anti-clockwise) and 7C (clockwise) to offer hourly circular services, linking Locahardil with Holm Mains and Tesco. This follows feedback from customers in the Lochardil area.

These services will no longer serve South Kessock, which will be served by service 3A/3B.

Revised Sunday timetable to offer improved arrival times for customers travelling to church in Inverness city centre.

Service 8:Revised timetable.

The frequency of early morning journeys will be reduced to every 45 mins.

The service will operate hourly between 1200 and 1400 Monday-Friday.

Service 9:Revised timetable.

The first journey to Inverness Shopping Park will now depart Telford Retail Park at 0806, serving Scorguie at 0811, arriving at UHI campus at 0849 and Inverness Shopping Park at 0855. This improved journey will provide better links to customers commuting to the campus and shopping park.

Service 11/11A/11B/11D:Revised timetable.

Journeys have been retimed to improve service punctuality.

A limited number of journeys will be withdrawn.

Ardersier will be served in the evenings by service 5A.

Certain journeys which operated as services 110 and 120 will now operate as service 11D.

Service 14:Minor changes to timetable.

The 1140 journey from Inveness to Farr will now depart at 1130.

Service 16 and 17:No changes

Service 18/118:Revised timetable. Most journeys which operate as service 18 or 118 will operate as service 28.

Service 20:Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

Service 21/21A:Revised timetable. The late afternoon journey from Cromarty will now terminate at Culbokie, with the 1638 from Culbokie to Dingwall withdrawn.

Service 22/22A/22B:Minor changes to timetable. An additional journey will operate on Saturdays from Inverness to Culbokie at 1630, returning from Culbokie to Inverness at 1713.

Service 23: Revised Saturday timetable. The 1630 journey from Inverness will be withdrawn and replaced by a journey on service 22A.

Service 24:Revised timetable to take account of potential changes to class times at Tain Royal Academy.

Service 25:Revised timetable to improve service punctuality. The 1648 journey from Dingwall to Inverness will be withdrawn.

Service 25U:No changes.

Service 25X: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality, particularly at peak times. Certain journeys between Invergordon and Tain will be withdrawn and transferred to services 130 and 168.

Service 26/26A/26C:Revised timetable to improve service punctuality. Additional journeys will operate on Saturday evenings between Inverness and Fortrose.

On Sundays, the evening service will be withdrawn.

Service 27/27D:Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

Service 28/28A/28X/128:Revised timetable. Regrettably, due to low levels of usage, services to Dingwall will operate every 2 hours, with Beauly and Muir of Ord served approximately every hour.

Service 29:Revised timetable to take account of potential changes to class times at Tain Royal Academy.

Service 30A/30B/30C:Revised timetable to take account of potential changes to class times at Tain Royal Academy. Route revised to improve service to Tain Medical Centre.

Service 61: Minor changes to timetable. The 1520 journey from Ullapool to Inverness will be adjusted to in order to improve service from Ullapool Primary School.

Service 62, 66, T20 and 104: No changes.

Service 73 Thurso – Reay: Minor timetable changes.

Service 74/274 Thurso - Bettyhill : Minor timetable changes.

Service 76 Wick Town Service: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

Service 77 Wick - John O' Groats - Gills Bay: Revised timetable and route. Services now operate twice per day directly to Gills Bay to connect with sailings to/from St Margarets Hope.

Service 78A/C Thurso Town Service: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

Service 80 Thurso - John O' Groats: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

Service 81 Thurso - Wick – Berriedale: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality. School buses between Wick and Berriedale will be incorporated into this service.

Service 82 Thurso – Wick: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality

Services 274 - 283 Services to Dounreay: Revised timetables will be introduced to improve service punctuality.

Service X98 Inverness – Thurso: Revised Monday-Friday timetable to improve service punctuality and to offer more balanced journeys with service X99.

Service X99 Inverness – Wick –Thurso: Following customer and stakeholder feedback, minor time changes will be made to the timetable to improve service punctuality. Additionally, following customer requests, a comfort break will be introduced at Dornoch.

Service 110: Minor changes to timetable.

Service 111:Revised timetable on Fridays to improve service from Culloden Academy.

Service 112:The additional journey on Fridays from Culloden Academy to Sunnyside at 1235 will be withdrawn. The journey at 1235 from Culloden Academy to Sunnyside, Croy, Tornargrain and Inverness will continue to operate.

Service 113: Service withdrawn and incorporated into service 5.

Service 114:Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

Service 119:No changes.

Service 120:Revised timetable to improve service punctuality. The 0852 Lochloy-Auldearn and 1520 Audlearn-Lochloy journeys will be withdrawn.

Service 121:No changes.

Service 122:The 0756 journey from Culbokie will now depart at 0746 to improve service punctuality.

Service 129:No changes.

Service 130:An additional journey from Tain Royal Academy to Invergordon will operate at 0730 (previously operated as service 25X).

Service 134:The 0724 journey from Inverness and 1615 journey from Tomatin will be withdrawn.

Service 135:No changes.

Service 141:The 1240 journey on Fridays from Inverness Royal Academy will now additionally serve Croy.

Service 142:No changes.

Service 143: Revised route and timetable. This service will no longer serve Culcabock and Crown to improve service punctuality.

Service 144:Revised route and timetable. This service will no longer serve Inverness City Centre.

Service 145 and 146:No changes.

Service 148:Revised timetable on morning journeys to improve service punctuality.

Service 149, 163, 165, 167:No changes.

Service 168: Revised timetable to improve service punctuality.

All feedback should be submitted no later than Friday 28th June 2019 and can be emailed to [email protected].

 

[Jordan Adam]

Timetable Consultation 18 Jun 2019 to 29 Jun 2019

Darn, i was just typing my post...

These are some bloody awful changes, possibly the worst i've seen yet. Clearly "D.L" is working his magic...

On the whole some points to note (Bluebird only).

• Service 10/10A/10B/10C/X10, some journeys retimed or axed. Addition peak journey to Huntly filling in for the axed X37 journeys
• Service 37 cut to Hourly, merged with the 220. Some 37 journeys axed and replaced by 10B
• Service X37 some journeys axed and replaced by retimed 10/10A/10C's
• 37/X37 (Inverurie Town Section) cut from half hourly to a infrequent service with 2 hour gaps
• Service X20 Renumbered 220 now follows the route of the 37 to Kintore and most journeys extend to Mo.
• Level of service to Kintore has now been reduced from 6BPH to 2BPH
• Service 26, service tender won.
• Service 31, retimed. New 31A replacing a 10 journey.
• Service 35/38, some journeys retimed and axed.
• Service 50, retimed.
• Service 54, new Sunday service 54B, two addition 54 short workings offpeak.
• Service 60/61/63, some journeys axed
• Service 67/68, some journeys retimed
• Service 119 extension axed
• Service 201/202/901, some journeys axed and retimed
• Service 210 axed
• Service 218/220, more consistent. Alford now has roughly an hourly frequency again.
  
• Service 221/422, retimed
• Service 421, service contract won by Bain's Coaches
• Service 290/291, all journeys now serve Methlick
• Service 292 axed (bar 2 journeys)
• Service 293 axed (Replaced by 290/291)
• Service 747 massively cut, frequency south of Stonehaven reduced to 2 hourly.
• Service 757 axed

Once again they're using service cuts to aid fleet replacement and the fleet shortage.

 

[jamieintercity]

The 26 is currently run by mw nicoll and it was originally run by stagecoach strathtay's Montrose depot before it closed in 2010. I do recall seeing a photo of a strathtay metrobus and a east lancs pyroneer on the 26 somewhere on the net

 

[Jordan Adam]

The 26 is currently run by mw nicoll and it was originally run by stagecoach strathtay's Montrose depot before it closed in 2010. I do recall seeing a photo of a strathtay metrobus and a east lancs pyroneer on the 26 somewhere on the net

Funnily enough Nicoll currently use one of the former 305 (Aberdeen-Elgin) B10M's on the service.

Photo link - https://www.flickr.com/photos/jordanadam44/45923522105/

 

[Jordan Adam]

On another note i do like how the Nairn Town Service (20) is in the Black Isle guide... Shows how much management know about the area!