Rubbish towns

[Typhoon]

Surely you cannot find against Halifax with the best urban setting of any town in the North. Majestic hills, honeyed sandstone, I get damp eyed just thinking about it.

I must say I was surprised. I've only been there a couple of times (to walk the hills - hardly saw a soul) but I got the impression of a solid town, same half a century ago, same half a century from now. Buildings built to last, and have done. If ever you wanted to develop a financial institution with a reputation for dependability, this is the place. Its been a few years, but it can't have changed that much can it?

 

[Greetlander]

I must say I was surprised. I've only been there a couple of times (to walk the hills - hardly saw a soul) but I got the impression of a solid town, same half a century ago, same half a century from now. Buildings built to last, and have done. If ever you wanted to develop a financial institution with a reputation for dependability, this is the place. Its been a few years, but it can't have changed that much can it?

Unfortunately the financial institution nearly set to the wall. I just think it’s a stunning town with an awful lot going for it. There’s a lot of redevelopment going on too.

 

[433N]

Halifax is certainly on my to-do list. There again, I like Bradford and always enjoy visiting (tho' the Tellybox museum has gone downhill). Lovely stone buildings with alot of character and great ethnic mix to brighten the place up.

To be honest, I find alot of the 'Rubbish Towns' listed here are just the sort of places I would go. Beauty is where you find it and they have, at least, character. The places that I hate are soulless, southern, suburban, dormitory towns like Staines and Farnborough.

 

[Busaholic]

I googled Redruth to see if it’s worth a visit while I’m on my Cornwall Rover, and stuff came up about it being one of the most deprived towns in the country. That surprised me, I thought all Cornwall was pretty okay due to tourism.

So I’m off to Penzance instead!

Trouble is, you can't as a county make a living from tourism alone. There are more failed businesses in the S.W. than anywhere, many in the food/hospitality side. Got to tell you, Penzance still had two of the top ten 'deprived' council wards in England the last time I looked. I've lived here for 31 years and managed, just, to run a business for the vast majority of that time. But I still think PZ is a fairly magic place, without being 'up itself' unlike certain of its neighbours, one in particular, and driving through those wards you don't see burnt-out cars, open drug dealing (by day at least) or some of the ills of other deprived places.

Anyway, Penzance's public transport is better than anywhere else in Cornwall, on a par with Truro.

 

[Typhoon]

Unfortunately the financial institution nearly set to the wall. I just think it’s a stunning town with an awful lot going for it. There’s a lot of redevelopment going on too.

That's the institution letting the town down. Rather than sticking to the aims of founding fathers of the two largest building societies in the country - mutual benefit for all members, managers went down the greed and growth are good path much in vogue in the mid 90s. A message of dependability reinforced by images of the architecture of the town, would have helped the organisation ten years later. I had a single account at the time of the vote, the local branch manager was good enough to see me and try to persuade me of the benefits of demutualisation but his heart didn't appear to be in it - possibly he, like I, saw the end of the old ethos.

 

[bramling]

Funnily enough, I think the distance from a motorway is what helps to keep Cromer and Sheringham so pleasant.

On the subject of the thread in general, there's a lot of dissing of the South Coast resorts going on. I think that with one or two exceptions perhaps, the South Coast is generally splendid and charming, from Margate to Mousehole.

I would agree in terms of the places themselves, however factor in the people and I can see why they have a bad reputation. The only places in Britain outside London where I’ve felt *really* uneasy have been Eastbourne, Gosport, Hastings and Worthing, and this compares even with some of Glasgow or South Manchester’s finest!

 

[yorksrob]

Trouble is, you can't as a county make a living from tourism alone. There are more failed businesses in the S.W. than anywhere, many in the food/hospitality side. Got to tell you, Penzance still had two of the top ten 'deprived' council wards in England the last time I looked. I've lived here for 31 years and managed, just, to run a business for the vast majority of that time. But I still think PZ is a fairly magic place, without being 'up itself' unlike certain of its neighbours, one in particular, and driving through those wards you don't see burnt-out cars, open drug dealing (by day at least) or some of the ills of other deprived places.

Anyway, Penzance's public transport is better than anywhere else in Cornwall, on a par with Truro.

And great walks along the coast to Moushole and Marazion.

I would agree in terms of the places themselves, however factor in the people and I can see why they have a bad reputation. The only two places in Britain outside London where I’ve felt *really* uneasy have been Eastbourne, Gosport, Hastings and Worthing, and this compares even with some of Glasgow or South Manchester’s finest!

I must admit, I visited Eastbourne last year and it felt like I'd stepped back into another era. It was the most genteel tidy place I've visited on the coast.

 

[underbank]

That's the institution letting the town down. Rather than sticking to the aims of founding fathers of the two largest building societies in the country - mutual benefit for all members, managers went down the greed and growth are good path much in vogue in the mid 90s.

Shame those same "members" didn't value it then isn't it? They voted en-masses to demutualise to get their hands on the windfall profits. If the members hadn't agreed/encouraged the demutualisation, the mutuals would still exist.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Eastbourne rather surprising - thought it was the ultimate in gentility - bar a few odd murders in the 20thC ........one I recall being a GP doing odd things for legacies.

 

[Old Yard Dog]

I take it you didn’t go for a walk southwards along the sea front, towards Jaywick / Seawick / St Osyth?

Clacton itself is okay (ish) in my view, but it sits as the focal-point of a *very* troubled area. A friend of mine took a job on a holiday park near there, packed it in within days as there was so much trouble.

We did drive through Jaywick and St Osyth, intrigued by the former being deemed, somewhere or other, to be the most deprived area in Britain. It seemed nothing like it but outward appearances can of course be misleading.

 

[Typhoon]

Shame those same "members" didn't value it then isn't it? They voted en-masses to demutualise to get their hands on the windfall profits. If the members hadn't agreed/encouraged the demutualisation, the mutuals would still exist.

You are absolutely right. They responded to the bribes that were offered. I am not certain they encouraged the demutualisation but they certainly put their crosses next to 'Yes'. I am proud to say that I voted against each one I was offered; when my fixed term bond with the Halifax matured, I had no problem withdrawing the money and investing in a mutual simply because the Halifax were no longer paying such good rates of interest, probably inevitably. Unfortunately I was in a minority.
The problem was that some of these societies outgrew their geographic base. There are still mutuals out there, supporting people to buy their own home, mostly small and mostly in the north or midlands.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You are absolutely right. They responded to the bribes that were offered. I am not certain they encouraged the demutualisation but they certainly put their crosses next to 'Yes'. I am proud to say that I voted against each one I was offered; when my fixed term bond with the Halifax matured, I had no problem withdrawing the money and investing in a mutual simply because the Halifax were no longer paying such good rates of interest, probably inevitably. Unfortunately I was in a minority.
The problem was that some of these societies outgrew their geographic base. There are still mutuals out there, supporting people to buy their own home, mostly small and mostly in the north or midlands.

There's also the Nationwide which never demutualised if you want a larger one. That said, my vote (if I bothered using it) would be used for the long-term benefit of the institution and customers and much less so to protect employment in any given locality.

 

[bramling]

I must admit, I visited Eastbourne last year and it felt like I'd stepped back into another era. It was the most genteel tidy place I've visited on the coast.

I can only speak from experience, perhaps I was unlucky as I was in the bit round the station on something like a Friday night. Presumably all the zimmer-frames are safely tucked away by that time!

Another place which is apparently troublesome is Lewes. I have relatives there and they say the town is extremely rough at night.

 

[yorksrob]

I can only speak from experience, perhaps I was unlucky as I was in the bit round the station on something like a Friday night. Presumably all the zimmer-frames are safely tucked away by that time!

Another place which is apparently troublesome is Lewes. I have relatives there and they say the town is extremely rough at night.

I suppose lots of towns are a bit rough and ready on a Friday/Saturday night.

 

[Busaholic]

We did drive through Jaywick and St Osyth, intrigued by the former being deemed, somewhere or other, to be the most deprived area in Britain. It seemed nothing like it but outward appearances can of course be misleading.

I remember being quite traumitised as a young child being driven through Jaywick when we were on holiday in Frinton. It was only a couple of years after the North Sea flooding had wreaked devastation, and death, on Jaywick, and the place seemed like a bomb site. Then, on the same holiday, the Big Wheel at Clacton got blown down: never holidayed in Essex ever again!

 

[Calthrop]

Another place which is apparently troublesome is Lewes. I have relatives there and they say the town is extremely rough at night.

Thinking about Lewes's November 5th traditions -- it'll be all those Protestant zealots out Papist-bashing ...

 

[underbank]

I am not certain they encouraged the demutualisation

Can't remember which, but there were certainly some Mutuals where the Board was against a demutualisation - what then happened was that there were "takeover" attempts and votes forced upon the mutual by members/member groups, which either forced out the Board or forced them to put forward demutualisation. So, in some cases, it was driven by the members and not the Board, who tried in vain to retain the mutual status.

At that time, there was also a stampede from Joe Public to open accounts in lots of mutuals with, say, £100 in each, just in the hope of a windfall. In the same way, lots of Joe Public set up pension and other insurance products in the likes of life insurance firms like Standard Life, Norwich Union, etc., likewise in the hope of windfalls from demutualisation. Joe Public opened accounts in their droves and then used their vote to demutualise and take the windfalls.

Just like all the privatisations/listings of the utility firms. All those Joe Publics who subscribed for shares on the back of the "tell sid" campaign for British Gas and then couldn't wait to sell at a profit on the first day of trading.

Joe Public is certainly not an innocent bystander, nor victim, of the City, stock exchange, merchant bankers, etc. - Joe Public was very much in favour at the time and couldn't wait to get their hands on the windfalls.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I remember being quite traumitised as a young child being driven through Jaywick when we were on holiday in Frinton. It was only a couple of years after the North Sea flooding had wreaked devastation, and death, on Jaywick, and the place seemed like a bomb site. Then, on the same holiday, the Big Wheel at Clacton got blown down: never holidayed in Essex ever again!

It's funny how a bad holiday puts you off a place. When I was about 5 we went for a week camping in Cornwall, it rained the whole time and we abandoned in the middle of the night and went home. Never went there on a family holiday again.

I was there this weekend and it was stunning.

 

[SteveP29]

All those Joe Publics who subscribed for shares on the back of the "tell sid" campaign for British Gas and then couldn't wait to sell at a profit on the first day of trading.

Joe Public is certainly not an innocent bystander, nor victim, of the City, stock exchange, merchant bankers, etc. - Joe Public was very much in favour at the time and couldn't wait to get their hands on the windfalls.

And that's why our energy companies are ran by companies based in Germany, France and Holland etc, paying through the nose and the government talking about having to put caps on charges.

Now, back on topic please....

 

[transportusers]

Anywhere that is on the seaside is a dump. The problem with the UK is that simply all of our towns that are on the seaside are complete and utter dumps. In fact i can't even think of a single nice place that's on the sea. Any town on the sea could fit in to this category of being a rubbish town. You have to go inland to find somewhere nice.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Anywhere that is on the seaside is a dump. The problem with the UK is that simply all of our towns that are on the seaside are complete and utter dumps. In fact i can't even think of a single nice place that's on the sea. Any town on the sea could fit in to this category of being a rubbish town. You have to go inland to find somewhere nice.

OK, it's a city not a town, but have you never been to Brighton, that's nice.

Littlehampton is quite nice too.

So I don't think you can assume that "if it's on the coast it's nasty". The Lancashire and Yorkshire mill towns, despite being nowhere near the coast, are also fairly nasty.

 

[underbank]

Anywhere that is on the seaside is a dump. The problem with the UK is that simply all of our towns that are on the seaside are complete and utter dumps. In fact i can't even think of a single nice place that's on the sea. Any town on the sea could fit in to this category of being a rubbish town. You have to go inland to find somewhere nice.

A lot of seaside resorts are run down because they've been deprived of the same levels of grants/funding given to towns and cities (and rural areas like national parks).

Because of the high levels of former boarding houses, they've often been used as dumping grounds for immigrants (legal and illegal), newly released prisoners, etc from the towns and cities. Some seaside resort councils actually advertised inside prisons to encourage ex-prisoners to relocate. It's basically caused the deprivation in such towns, rather than prevented it. Who would have guessed than literally bus-ing in huge numbers of people with problems would have caused social problems in those areas! (Doh!).

Whilst plenty of money has been given to towns and cities, it's only more recently that grants/funding has started to come on stream to tackle the problems of the coasts and seaside resorts, so it will take time to filter through into real improvements.

But, there are still plenty of lovely coastal and seaside places to go, and still plenty of pretty horrid towns and cities. I'd rather live in a half decent seaside resort than a deprived town or city any day.

 

[Butts]

Anywhere that is on the seaside is a dump. The problem with the UK is that simply all of our towns that are on the seaside are complete and utter dumps. In fact i can't even think of a single nice place that's on the sea. Any town on the sea could fit in to this category of being a rubbish town. You have to go inland to find somewhere nice.

Have you ever been to St Andrews ?

I would certainly not describe it as a dump and it is right by the sea.

 

[greyman42]

Anywhere that is on the seaside is a dump. The problem with the UK is that simply all of our towns that are on the seaside are complete and utter dumps. In fact i can't even think of a single nice place that's on the sea. Any town on the sea could fit in to this category of being a rubbish town. You have to go inland to find somewhere nice.

Dunbar is nice.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Can I raise Berwick on Tweed -superb on a Summers evening , used to break journey there for next day Scottish meetings - travel up late afternoon and do the L S Lowry trail and more - continue the next morning for an uplifting journey to Edinburgh.

Seaside resorts / towns can be superb. Berwick is. (or was when I stayed there 10 or so years back)

 

[bramling]

Can I raise Berwick on Tweed -superb on a Summers evening , used to break journey there for next day Scottish meetings - travel up late afternoon and do the L S Lowry trail and more - continue the next morning for an uplifting journey to Edinburgh.

Seaside resorts / towns can be superb. Berwick is. (or was when I stayed there 10 or so years back)

Agreed on Berwick, quite a spectacular setting especially when the sky is blue. Having said that, a lot of the people are conspicuously downtrodden, and beyond the immediate town centre the ambience does deteriorate quite sharply! Not sure I’d describe it as a resort either, although it does have a good few caravan parks (which possibly contributes to the slightly drossy feel!).

I still maintain at present that the most pleasant seaside town I can recall recently for me has been Aberystwyth. Others nearby which spring to mind as being not bad are Aberdovey, Criccieth, Aberaeron and of course Barmouth (the latter out of school holidays at least!). I’d presume the likes of Cardigan and Newcastle Emlyn are quite nice too although not been there myself yet. Llandudno is also nice, but for me slightly spoiled by *so many* geriatric coach-tour types!

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Agreed on Berwick, quite a spectacular setting especially when the sky is blue. Having said that, a lot of the people are conspicuously downtrodden, and beyond the immediate town centre the ambience does deteriorate quite sharply! Not sure I’d describe it as a resort either, although it does have a good few caravan parks (which possibly contributes to the slightly drossy feel!).

I still maintain at present that the most pleasant seaside town I can recall recently for me has been Aberystwyth. Others nearby which spring to mind as being not bad are Aberdovey, Criccieth, Aberaeron and of course Barmouth (the latter out of school holidays at least!). I’d presume the likes of Cardigan and Newcastle Emlyn are quite nice too although not been there myself yet. Llandudno is also nice, but for me slightly spoiled by *so many* geriatric coach-tour types!

Clearly with you on Aberystwyth - a few dark corners , but a place where someone said it could be the graveyard of ambition if you were comfortably settled. He said the same about Ilkley - I dare say Skipton could be added to the Yorkshire portfolio. (and more) - Cardigan has about the lowest level of reported crime in the UK. Machynlleth (bar one great tragedy) , is also a very pleasant small town.

In passing , and OT , I had the very best meat filled Yorkshire puddings of my life in the pub near Ben Rhydding station some years ago. Coma inducing they were so good.

 

[muddythefish]

The Lancashire and Yorkshire mill towns, despite being nowhere near the coast, are also fairly nasty.

Insulting and not true. They're good places to live, with friendly people

 

[muddythefish]

I'd always thought that Wellingborough was quite a pleasant, well-to-do place so we decided to go for a wander.
Won't be doing that again.

Not surprised. Like most Northants towns, it's gone downhill over the past 20 years. The centre is truly awful - the inhabitants wouldn't look out of place in Deliverance

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Anywhere that is on the seaside is a dump. The problem with the UK is that simply all of our towns that are on the seaside are complete and utter dumps. In fact I can't even think of a single nice place that's on the sea.

Yarmouth Isle of Wight is very nice.