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TfW Class 170's

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Y Ddraig Coch

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Here is the press release about 170207 from TfW

https://news.tfwrail.wales/news/extra-trains-arrive-for-transport-for-wales

Extra trains arrive for Transport for Wales


Transport for Wales has taken delivery of the first Class 170 Turbostar from Greater Anglia.



Unit 170207 pulled into the Canton depot on Sunday 1 September. The three-car train has 186 seats and will shortly be joined by a further seven three car-units and four two-car units that each provide seating for 110 passengers.

Driver training is scheduled to begin on 16 September with the units expected in to service on the Cheltenham to Maesteg line in December 2019. Subject to route clearance, Transport for Wales are also exploring future options to run the trains on the Ebbw Vale line and Heart of Wales.

Speaking about the arrival of the new fleet, Rolling Stock Director Sara Holland said that the delivery of the first Class 170 is an important milestone for Transport for Wales: “The Class 170s provide a more modern and reliable service with air conditioning and power sockets. These are comfortable trains that will significantly improve capacity and provide a high standard of on-board customer experience.”

“With the support of our industry partners, our fleet colleagues are working incredibly hard to introduce new rolling stock, refurbish existing trains and carry out much needed modification works. This is an £800 million programme that will transform the experience for our customers and colleagues alike; the average age of the fleet will drop from 25 years to seven years by 2024 and 95% of journeys will be made on a new fleet of 148 trains by 2023.”

James Price, Transport for Wales CEO added: “It’s great that the first class 170 train has arrived at our depot in Canton. Our staff have been working hard in preparation for the Autumn period and in the very near future, this additional rolling stock will provide more capacity for our customers and help create more resilience throughout our network. The Class 170s will all be fitted with power sockets and air conditioning.

“Our focus as always been on improving the customer experience and this is another example on how we are delivering on this
 
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Mitchell Hurd

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Hello there. I'm not sure if there's a similar thread but assuming they're isn't I thought I'd create one.

The first one has arrived at Canton depot in Cardiff.

To and from Cardiff Central and Cheltenham Spa st least, I can see these being more popular than the XC 170's as it's reported the TfW 170's will have plug sockets.

These will be a major improvement over the existing TfW Pacer and 15x stock!
 

Envoy

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The TfW trains on the Cheltenham route are so terrible that I bet many people who can - will only try and use the XC services - which are 170’s. Hopefully, when the 170’s appear on the Cheltenham route, perhaps it will take some off the pressure off XC who have enough to cope with the loadings going longer distances. I also note that Worcester Parkway will be opening soon - thus putting further pressure on the Cardiff to Nottingham trains. It also looks like when GWR change their timetable in December, that passengers from points west of Cardiff may make a very quick change to the Nottinghams in order to proceed to the Midlands rather than do a change at Bristol Parkway.
 

deltic08

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Here is the press release about 170207 from TfW

https://news.tfwrail.wales/news/extra-trains-arrive-for-transport-for-wales


Extra trains arrive for Transport for Wales


Transport for Wales has taken delivery of the first Class 170 Turbostar from Greater Anglia.



Unit 170207 pulled into the Canton depot on Sunday 1 September. The three-car train has 186 seats and will shortly be joined by a further seven three car-units and four two-car units that each provide seating for 110 passengers.

Driver training is scheduled to begin on 16 September with the units expected in to service on the Cheltenham to Maesteg line in December 2019. Subject to route clearance, Transport for Wales are also exploring future options to run the trains on the Ebbw Vale line and Heart of Wales.
I assume that as 170s already run Cardiff-Cheltenham and 170207 has already cleared itself on the route on Sunday that only west of Cardiff needs doing?
 

PHILIPE

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I assume that as 170s already run Cardiff-Cheltenham and 170207 has already cleared itself on the route on Sunday that only west of Cardiff needs doing?

They have been running between Cheltenham and Cardiff for years now on the XC Cardiff to Nottingham services.
 

deltic08

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They have been running between Cheltenham and Cardiff for years now on the XC Cardiff to Nottingham services.
I know, I originate from Lydney. I always try to spend an hour at the station just marvelling at 170s actually stopping there and now 170s are going to replace dogboxes on the locals. Can't believe it is actually going to happen. The best service now for Lydney since the Swindon built DMUs were withdrawn.
 

anamyd

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Twelve 170s aren't enough to displace 30 pacers on their own.


Is a thread on "rolling stock shortages" the best place to discuss the arrival of a new class of rolling stock? We do have dedicated threads for the 769s and 230s.

I'll report this post to an Admin to ask for an adjudication.
The official TfW video on 170207's arrival is also linked to in the Transport for Wales Livery thread. Would be nice to have everything in one place!
 

Brissle Girl

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Twelve 170s aren't enough to displace 30 pacers on their own.
But a 3 car 170 has 186 seats, twice that of a pacer. So the total number of Class 170 seats will be 1928, equivalent to 21 pacers. I know it's not that simple as the 3 car sets will almost certainly be replacing 2 car units and thus giving an increase in capacity for those services, but reducing the seats available for the cascade.
 

krus_aragon

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But a 3 car 170 has 186 seats, twice that of a pacer. So the total number of Class 170 seats will be 1928, equivalent to 21 pacers. I know it's not that simple as the 3 car sets will almost certainly be replacing 2 car units and thus giving an increase in capacity for those services, but reducing the seats available for the cascade.
True, but that still falls short of the 30 pacers that are to go. We'll need some 769s or 230s to get over the line, even with the loco-hauled Rhymney trains.
 

Brissle Girl

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True, but that still falls short of the 30 pacers that are to go. We'll need some 769s or 230s to get over the line, even with the loco-hauled Rhymney trains.
No, but it’s the bulk of the trains needed, and so if TfW is confident (maybe more confident than we are, but they will be the ones talking to Porterbrook and Vivarail and will have the latest position) of getting enough 769s and 230s then you can see why they may believe they can withdraw the Pacers as planned. It will undoubtedly be tight though, and staff training will be a challenge.
 

Caaardiff

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The 170's will run Maesteg - Cheltenham and Cardiff - Ebbw Vale services. Recently Ebbw Vale diagrams have been a mix of 2 car 150/158, 2x 153s, 3x 153's and 2 or 3 car 175 diagrams. In recent weeks it's mostly been 2x 153's but sometimes 3x 153's during peak services. So 1 170 can potentially free up 2, sometimes 3 153's at certain times. The 153's can then be reallocated to better fitting services like Heart of Wales or West Wales or Cityline thus freeing up 150's. It may not cover all Pacer diagrams but don't forget not all 30 Pacers are in use during the day.
There's also a good few trains in for PRM mods and 175's for interior refurbs as well, which although the PRM mods will still be going on into 2020, it will be less trains out at one time as there's a big rush at the moment to get as many done as possible. I heard it might be about 6/7 currently out of service. (150/153/158's)
 

PHILIPE

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The 170's will run Maesteg - Cheltenham and Cardiff - Ebbw Vale services. Recently Ebbw Vale diagrams have been a mix of 2 car 150/158, 2x 153s, 3x 153's and 2 or 3 car 175 diagrams. In recent weeks it's mostly been 2x 153's but sometimes 3x 153's during peak services. So 1 170 can potentially free up 2, sometimes 3 153's at certain times. The 153's can then be reallocated to better fitting services like Heart of Wales or West Wales or Cityline thus freeing up 150's. It may not cover all Pacer diagrams but don't forget not all 30 Pacers are in use during the day.
There's also a good few trains in for PRM mods and 175's for interior refurbs as well, which although the PRM mods will still be going on into 2020, it will be less trains out at one time as there's a big rush at the moment to get as many done as possible. I heard it might be about 6/7 currently out of service. (150/153/158's)

Quite a variety on Ebbw Vales and Pacers as well, 1534 ex Cardiff as one example.
 

krus_aragon

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No, but it’s the bulk of the trains needed, and so if TfW is confident (maybe more confident than we are, but they will be the ones talking to Porterbrook and Vivarail and will have the latest position) of getting enough 769s and 230s then you can see why they may believe they can withdraw the Pacers as planned. It will undoubtedly be tight though, and staff training will be a challenge.
Perhaps we can both agree on:
  • The confirmation of the timeline for introducing the 170s is good news
  • The 170s will allow a large proportion of the Pacers to be withdrawn on time
  • TfW will also need some other stock introduced (230s/769s) in order to withdraw all Pacers
Common ground? :)
 

PHILIPE

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Perhaps we can both agree on:
  • The confirmation of the timeline for introducing the 170s is good news
  • The 170s will allow a large proportion of the Pacers to be withdrawn on time
  • TfW will also need some other stock introduced (230s/769s) in order to withdraw all Pacers
Common ground? :)

TFW seem confident that the 230/769s will be in service by December
 

RealTrains07

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And I hope they put out a press release (sharing that confidence) soon, so that we'll all know.

Am I really coming across as such as pessimist? :(
Check modern railways their was an update on TfWs plans on the 170s and 769s i think
 

Brissle Girl

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Perhaps we can both agree on:
  • The confirmation of the timeline for introducing the 170s is good news
  • The 170s will allow a large proportion of the Pacers to be withdrawn on time
  • TfW will also need some other stock introduced (230s/769s) in order to withdraw all Pacers
Common ground? :)
Agree, and for those who will be using the 170s, a significant improvement in rolling stock too.

As RealTrains07 has said, MR is quoting TfW as saying that the 769s will be in service in November and the 230s in December. Driver training to start on the 769s this month between Cardiff and Ystrad Mynach. (Caerphilly could soon become the national hot spot for unusual traction enthusiasts!) However, the article also noted that in June TfW was saying it was targeting Sep to launch them, so in two months the anticipated launch had slipped by, err, two months, which might suggest little progress over that period. So I can fully understand anyone who has a healthy degree of scepticism of any launch dates.
 

anamyd

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@ainsworth74 now that you've closed the "stock shortages" thread, might you consider moving the recent 170-related posts (and the ones from the livery thread) to this thread...?
 

Cambrian359

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@ainsworth74 now that you've closed the "stock shortages" thread, might you consider moving the recent 170-related posts (and the ones from the livery thread) to this thread...?
I don’t understand the logic behind locking it anyway, Especially given there are still shortages due to PRM mods etc it will just end up with people creating new topics and then getting moaned at for creating duplicate topics.....
 

PHILIPE

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I don’t understand the logic behind locking it anyway, Especially given there are still shortages due to PRM mods etc it will just end up with people creating new topics and then getting moaned at for creating duplicate topics.....


I'm inclined to agree although I'm not in the habit of questioning an Admin decision, for which I must apologise,but the locked thread refers to an ongoing situation and those created for different class are more of a development nature
 

RealTrains07

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Agree, and for those who will be using the 170s, a significant improvement in rolling stock too.

As RealTrains07 has said, MR is quoting TfW as saying that the 769s will be in service in November and the 230s in December. Driver training to start on the 769s this month between Cardiff and Ystrad Mynach. (Caerphilly could soon become the national hot spot for unusual traction enthusiasts!) However, the article also noted that in June TfW was saying it was targeting Sep to launch them, so in two months the anticipated launch had slipped by, err, two months, which might suggest little progress over that period. So I can fully understand anyone who has a healthy degree of scepticism of any launch dates.
Wondered if it was November.

At least the 170s getting started on means at least 1 TOC can get a type of train introduced on schedule
 

Cambrian359

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Today's Railways UK says that all 9 Eversholt-owned class 170s ( including those converted to class 171s) will head for EMR, as will all those currently operated by WMR and, interestingly, most of the 3-car former Greater Anglia units once TfW's new trains have arrived.
View attachment 68238

It’s been noted in the East Midlands franchise thread that tfw 170 aren’t staying.....only a couple of 2 cars will be staying with the rest gone within 2 years. Was this a known a fact? First time I’ve heard it.
 
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