But we could go round in circles and say how do we know it's clearly not intended? I guess one might say the presence of a vending machine is key here.My own take on this is that if a member of railway staff says you can't use a socket that's within railway premises (and clearly not intended to be used by the public as in the OP) then you can't use it - full stop.
My own take on this is that if a member of railway staff says you can't use a socket that's within railway premises (and clearly not intended to be used by the public as in the OP) then you can't use it - full stop.
Thank you all for continuing to contribute to this thread.
I was wondering about the matter of the name and address and found this elsewhere:
Is it correct to say that the security guard is an "authorised person" but "abstracting electricity" is not a Byelaw breach?
Why be so anti-social and keep it all to yourself? Surely you'd want to entertain the rest of us?
ROFL!!If electricity is stolen, what is the charge?
If electricity is stolen, what is the charge?
I just laughed out loud in McDonald’s. This forum needs like buttonsBattery!
It would be a matter for Inspector Coulombo, I expect.If electricity is stolen, what is the charge?
A few months ago when I was waiting for a taxi and waited in a hospital entrance area, I needed to urgently charge my phone with the battery charge being less than 5% and I plugged it into a socket with a red switch and nothing bad happened. A security guy approached me but merely to ask if I was needed any assistance as I looked lost to them.Conversely, hospitals many years ago had red "X-ray" sockets for the mobile X-ray machines. Nothing untoward would happen if you plugged anything else in. They were just on high current circuits. However at one hospital I worked at a radiographer plugged the machine into a standard white socket. That didn't end well. Soon after the red plugs and sockets were changed to something physically different to the rest.
Today it's all changed. All battery powered with standard 13A charging.
A few months ago when I was waiting for a taxi and waited in a hospital entrance area, I needed to urgently charge my phone with the battery charge being less than 5% and I plugged it into a socket with a red switch and nothing bad happened. A security guy approached me but merely to ask if I was needed any assistance as I looked lost to them.
I mean, a large number of waiting rooms do have sockets that are meant for the public to use.
So I would ask why would someone assume they couldn't use a socket that wasn't marked to say they couldn't.
As above. Many waiting rooms, and other similar areas and coffee shops and the like do have publicly usable sockets. That is what has caused a lot of this discussion.
As above, many places do have sockets that are meant for public use, without being marked as such. If anything the usual convention on the railway is for sockets not for public use to be marked.
On a slight tangent, a while back I once saw a bloke with a standard class ticket put his phone in first class (which was empty save for one or two people) and sit in standard whilst it charged. I think the guard later saw what he was doing, and started trying to get his details for using the first class facilities without a valid ticket. Unfortunately I had to get off whilst they were still arguing so I don't know the eventual outcome, but given that first class was pretty much empty and the man was sitting in standard, I did think it was a bit officious. Although obviously a line has to be drawn somewhere, otherwise standard passengers will start helping themselves to free food, etc.
What are peoples' opinions on that?
In my view, common sense and reasonableness needs to be applied.
If a standard type of power socket is readily accessible to the public, in a place that is open to the public, then common sense suggests that use of that socket is reasonable, unless specifically prohibited.
There is however no "right" or "entitlement" to use the power socket, and anyone so doing must immediately cease use if told to by the owner or manager of the premises (including by a security officer employed by the owner or manager)
In the absence of any specific prohibition, I very much doubt that any prosecution for theft or abstraction of electricity would succeed. The situation is arguably comparable to taking a drink of tap water from a water tap in a place open to the public.
Or perhaps comparable to use of toilet paper or hot water in a toilet open to the customers.
I have never seen a sign that invites one to use the toilet paper, but that does not mean that use is theft. It is accepted practice, despite the lack of any specific granting of permission.
If a TOC wish to prohibit charging of portable electronics, then IMHO that is a bit bloody minded, but they are entitled to make such a rule.
Anyone refusing to comply could be asked to leave.
The cost of charging portable electronics is utterly trivial, and as said might be compared to providing toilet paper, water, maybe even hot water, and electric light in places used by customers.
Maybe the answer is to do something comparable to needing to use the toilet but there are no publlic toilets around; go into a pub, and ask permission to use their toilet (if you are not intending to purchase anything).
If there is an accessible plug socket at the station, seek permission from a member of staff first before using it. That should cover you.
A guard told me about the number of people using first class with standard class tickets just to charge their phone. It does seem a bit pedantic for a guard to make a big deal in your case where the passenger remained in standard class although presumably there's a risk of his phone getting nicked?On a slight tangent, a while back I once saw a bloke with a standard class ticket put his phone in first class (which was empty save for one or two people) and sit in standard whilst it charged. I think the guard later saw what he was doing, and started trying to get his details for using the first class facilities without a valid ticket. Unfortunately I had to get off whilst they were still arguing so I don't know the eventual outcome, but given that first class was pretty much empty and the man was sitting in standard, I did think it was a bit officious. Although obviously a line has to be drawn somewhere, otherwise standard passengers will start helping themselves to free food, etc.
What are peoples' opinions on that?
I was in the doctors recently and somebody was charging their phone using a plug socket in the waiting room, nobody seemed to mind.A few months ago when I was waiting for a taxi and waited in a hospital entrance area, I needed to urgently charge my phone with the battery charge being less than 5% and I plugged it into a socket with a red switch and nothing bad happened. A security guy approached me but merely to ask if I was needed any assistance as I looked lost to them.
A guard told me about the number of people using first class with standard class tickets just to charge their phone. It does seem a bit pedantic for a guard to make a big deal in your case where the passenger remained in standard class although presumably there's a risk of his phone getting nicked?
I have it in my mind that they are or were a fire riskcan't be bothered carrying a power bank.
I have it in my mind that they are or were a fire risk
I have it in my mind that they are or were a fire risk
I was in the doctors recently and somebody was charging their phone using a plug socket in the waiting room, nobody seemed to mind.
A guard told me about the number of people using first class with standard class tickets just to charge their phone. It does seem a bit pedantic for a guard to make a big deal in your case where the passenger remained in standard class although presumably there's a risk of his phone getting nicked?
An SIA badge is not required by security staff working for their employer (i.e. not contractors) unless they are performing door supervisor duties, i.e. controlling access to a licensed premises.No because there is no such rule. Security staff should have their SIA badge on display though.
Thanks. Do any TOCs employ them directly?An SIA badge is not required by security staff working for their employer (i.e. not contractors)