Edinburgh but not Waverley

[robertclark125]

One that appears to have slipped through the net, since yesterday, Edinburgh Waverley is now officially called "Edinburgh", automated station announcements on Scotrail no longer use the Waverley tag. Indeed, the official name no longer uses "Waverley".

Apparently BR once tried to drop the Waverley tag, but public complaints led to BR retaining the name.

 

[Journeyman]

One that appears to have slipped through the net, since yesterday, Edinburgh Waverley is now officially called "Edinburgh", automated station announcements on Scotrail no longer use the Waverley tag. Indeed, the official name no longer uses "Waverley".

Apparently BR once tried to drop the Waverley tag, but public complaints led to BR retaining the name.

Really? I'll have to look out for that. ScotRail have always used Waverley when other TOCs haven't. In a similar vein, I'm surprised Haymarket is not referred to as Edinburgh Haymarket.

 

[robertclark125]

This is the current Scotrail website page for Edinburgh

https://www.scotrail.co.uk/plan-your-journey/stations-and-facilities/edb

 

[Journeyman]

I've just had a look at old versions on archive.org - it's been the same for at least 18 months.

 

[robertclark125]

The automated announcements at Kirkcaldy station only changed to Edinburgh yesterday. BTW, once on the loco hauled Fife Circle service, the guard did call the station "Edinburgh Haymarket"

 

[scotrail158713]

I think I’ll still be calling it Edinburgh Waverley
In practical terms, “Waverley” makes sense as well. If I’m coming on a train from Glasgow or Fife, getting off at “Waverley” makes more sense than solely “Edinburgh”.

 

[LowLevel]

Network Rail still list it as Edinburgh Waverley as do plenty of other TOCs.

The station will always be Waverley, just contemporary usage of that may vary. We have the same at Lincoln. It's well known as Central station, some CIS screens call it Central, some don't.

Shortening the length of announcements where possible is no bad thing either.

 

[Mag_seven]

The correct terms are "Edinburgh Waverley" and "Haymarket".

 

[Glenmutchkin]

In a similar vein, I'm surprised Haymarket is not referred to as Edinburgh Haymarket.

On my last couple of trips on the E&G I have noticed that the on train announcements do say "Edinburgh Haymarket". I'm sure that never used to be the case but I have no idea when it changed

 

[Siemens Trains]

On my last couple of trips on the E&G I have noticed that the on train announcements do say "Edinburgh Haymarket". I'm sure that never used to be the case but I have no idea when it changed

I do feel that's a step backwards in terms of clarity for some passengers, especially when it's used on the Glasgow services. For example it gives an impression that both Haymarket and Edinburgh Waverley are in the same group when it comes to ticketing, similar to Glasgow Central and Glasgow Queen Street. Although fares are the same in most cases, and you'd probably get away with using a ticket for the other station, I believe you can buy tickets at significantly different fares for some journeys.
However the precedent for confusion was set in the 1990s by naming the station at Hermiston Gait "Edinburgh Park" then compounded recently when naming the station at Gogar "Edinburgh Gateway". The latter sounds similar to Edinburgh Waverley when spoken quickly. So I'm not going to lose a huge amount of sleep over this.

 

[13h202]

The issue I have is that there is no consistency at all with it, complete disjointed thinking...

Haymarket is almost always referred to as just 'Haymarket' but SR's 385s announce it as 'Edinburgh Haymarket' whilst only showing 'Haymarket' on the screen itself.
Edinburgh Waverley is almost always referred to as just 'Edinburgh' in stations (SR being the exception up until now) but onboard is almost always referred to as 'Edinburgh Waverley'.

Tickets to Edinburgh should really just show 'Edinburgh Waverley/Haymarket' as they do in Glasgow and each station should be announced as such across the network. Convoluted names such as Bristol Temple Meads are never shortened to 'Bristol' so why should Edinburgh's stations?

 

[AlbertBeale]

If you try to enter "Waverley" on the BRE website, to search for a time/fare, it doesn't recognise that "Waverley" is any part of any station name anywhere...

Although my Scottish friends always refer to Waverley (not even Edinburgh Waverley), the Waverley name seems not to be recognised by some parts of "the system" at all - and it's been like that for a very long time; you've long had to search for simply Edinburgh. Given that Waverley is so well known as part of the station name (in fact as the whole of the name by many people) - whether official or not - it seems silly not to at least include "Waverley" in the name of the main Edinburgh station wherever it's officially listed.

Is the idea that it's useful for Haymarket to include "Edinburgh" in its name, so taking out the "Waverley" and saying just "Edinburgh" for the other one makes the latter more obviously the main station? If that is the logic, I don't think it really makes sense.

Very usefully, Loco2 (as was), if you try to put in "Edinburgh" as a ticket destination, offers you
"Edinburgh (Waverley, city centre)" and "Haymarket (Edinburgh, west)" - as well as Edinburgh Park and Edinburgh Gateway.

That's the only place I know that shows this information in such a useful way, linking the official name to what real people call it and to its position/importance - the only problem (if you see it as such) with it being that if you just put in "Waverley", it initially accepts that without adding an "Edinburgh" - though that change is made when it displays the results of your search.

Overseas journey planners I've used haven't recognised Waverley as a UK station name at all.

 

[47271]

Anyone from the city knows that the correct name for the station is 'The Waverley'.

 

[Aictos]

Anyone from the city knows that the correct name for the station is 'The Waverley'.

Of course so why change what has worked for decades?

 

[gavin1985]

Anyone from the city knows that the correct name for the station is 'The Waverley'.

Agreed, as a resident of Edinburgh I wouldn't even call it "The Waverley", to me it is known as Waverley. But makes more sense to have it as Edinburgh Waverley.

 

[Western Lord]

The "Waverley" bit was dropped by BR decades ago and the two Edinburgh stations were simply "Edinburgh" and "Haymarket". Of course, locals (and many others) continued to use the suffix "Waverley", but Haymarket has never been known as "Edinburgh Haymarket".

 

[Esker-pades]

The correct terms are "Edinburgh Waverley" and "Haymarket".

Actually, all the departure boards and tickets refer to it simply as 'Edinburgh'. I disagree, but that's the thing that's used now.

 

[Siemens Trains]

The issue I have is that there is no consistency at all with it, complete disjointed thinking...

Well, it is the railway industry after all. Does give a poor impression though. If they can't resolve station names sensibly then what about something that relates to safety?

as a resident of Edinburgh I wouldn't even call it "The Waverley"

I'd have said "The Waverley" was a paddle steamer. I tend to think of Waverley as a district of Edinburgh in its own right too. Of course the station name has to be meaningful for people who don't live here. Residents should already know what's what.

The "Waverley" bit was dropped by BR decades ago and the two Edinburgh stations were simply "Edinburgh" and "Haymarket". Of course, locals (and many others) continued to use the suffix "Waverley", but Haymarket has never been known as "Edinburgh Haymarket".

One problem is that they've started naming stations that are barely inside Edinburgh with Edinburgh prefixes (creating ambiguity if you just stop at saying 'Edinburgh'). So should a station comfortably within Edinburgh's urban area that doesn't have an Edinburgh prefix now follow suit? And with a busy Metro station in Newcastle also called Haymarket maybe there's a case to make a distinction.
Maybe just my age, but can't say I'm a fan of calling it Edinburgh Haymarket. I could have lived with just Edinburgh for Waverley but someone (don't know if it was BR, Railtrack or the general public) spoiled this.

 

[Railwaysceptic]

When I was a boy - a very long time ago! - London termini were known only by their original name. There was none of this London Kings Cross or London Waterloo waffle. It was Kings Cross, Waterloo, Paddington etc. If the nomenclature of London's major stations needed to be changed, why are we going in the opposite direction with Edinburgh Waverley? Edinburgh, like London, every year receives enormous numbers of visitors who are unfamiliar with the transport system.

 

[2392]

Shade of Darlington. The "mainline" station being to many of old "Darlington Bank Top" and the other "Darlington North Road" on the old S & D line to Bishop Auckland. The last time I travelled to the NYMR by train I remarked to the Guy in the Booking Office that I usually travelled out via "Bank Top" get the Saltburn train there and changing at Middlesbrough and the coast train back via Hartlepool and Sunderland. He remarked it'd been a long time since he'd heard "Darlington" referred to as "Bank Top!" Equally if the Conductor is opening/unlocking the doors where I'm getting of at Darlington and I remark "Bank Top" that quite often beings out a degree of puzzlement on their part....... Even after I've explained.

 

[Glenmutchkin]

On my last couple of trips on the E&G I have noticed that the on train announcements do say "Edinburgh Haymarket". I'm sure that never used to be the case but I have no idea when it changed

Yesterday the on train announcements had reverted to "Haymarket".

 

[Sad Sprinter]

Down here in London the station has been referred to simply as “Edinburgh” for many years.

 

[oldman]

It would be useful to call it Edinburgh Haymarket - it is not just a suburban station like Slateford but is served by many long-distance services used by non-local people. It is the better choice for some long-distance passengers and including Edinburgh in the name would increase awareness of its potential usefulness.

To locals, of course they are just Waverley (some maybe older people do say 'The Waverley') and Haymarket, just like Victoria and Piccadilly to Manchester people.

(Apart from London, is there any other city with two centrally-located stations used by long-distance trains, which don't include the city name for both stations?)

 

[BenW390Fan]

Here in Liverpool we call Liverpool Lime Street just Lime Street for short and Liverpool South Parkway just South Parkway, although we don't do it for Liverpool Central, that stays the same. Usually in some cities people don't mention the city name before the actual station name whereas tourists do.

 

[InOban]

It would be useful to call it Edinburgh Haymarket - it is not just a suburban station like Slateford but is served by many long-distance services used by non-local people. It is the better choice for some long-distance passengers and including Edinburgh in the name would increase awareness of its potential usefulness.

To locals, of course they are just Waverley (some maybe older people do say 'The Waverley') and Haymarket, just like Victoria and Piccadilly to Manchester people.

(Apart from London, is there any other city with two centrally-located stations used by long-distance trains, which don't include the city name for both stations?)

I now count as old, although I'm in denial. I lived in Edinburgh for many years and it's still a second home
I've never heard it called The Waverley.
With the massive growth in employment nearer Haymarket than Waverley, its numbers are growing much faster than Waverley.

 

[oldman]

I've never heard it called The Waverley.

Old man Google threw up this (from rm.web) - 'Nice layout, takes me back to the 80s when I was a second man up at Haymarket TMD before we got moved down to the Waverley.'

Edit: and this 'A RETURN to the golden age of railway travel is the promise when the legendary Flying Scotsman puffs into the Waverley on Sunday' (Evening News)

 

[InOban]

Old man Google threw up this (from rm.web) - 'Nice layout, takes me back to the 80s when I was a second man up at Haymarket TMD before we got moved down to the Waverley.'

Edit: and this 'A RETURN to the golden age of railway travel is the promise when the legendary Flying Scotsman puffs into the Waverley on Sunday' (Evening News)

I only said that I had never heard it called the Waverley. Seems a rather pompous usage.

 

[47271]

I only said that I had never heard it called the Waverley. Seems a rather pompous usage.

My bringing up 'The Waverley' was mainly in jest, but it's definitely a thing. Taxi drivers often take you to 'The Waverley'.

I've no idea why some people call it that out of habit, but it isn't at all pompous. I don't believe that I've heard it in relation to any other station anywhere. You'd never hear 'The Haymarket' for example.

It's just a funny local thing.

 

[InOban]

I've a feeling that KX is sometimes referred to as the Cross.

 

[AlbertBeale]

I've a feeling that KX is sometimes referred to as the Cross.

It is by locals in the area - but we tend to mean the immediate district around the station, not specifically the station as such.