• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Bad day for Liverpool & Newcastle on TPE

Status
Not open for further replies.

Old Yard Dog

Established Member
Joined
21 Aug 2011
Messages
1,466
Yesterday (Sat 21st Dec) was a very bad day for TPE services from Liverpool - Manchester and York - Newcastle in particular. TPE had announced a reduced service earlier in the week but then cancelled many more trains on the day. The service was particularly poor later in the afternoon and evening. Two services from Newcastle were cancelled between 1730 and 1830 which would have been disastrous for those trying to get back from St James Park. And very few trains were operating between Leeds and Manchester - or between Manchester and Liverpool. Northern also cancelled a lot of trains but weren't quite as bad as TPE.

Does anybody have any idea why the service was so bad? Was it lack of properly trained staff on new units, staff sickness or staff simply wanting Saturday off and refusing to work overtime?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

BeHereNow

Guest
Joined
30 Dec 2017
Messages
308
Even though Liverpool Newcastle trains don't go there, I think the problem is the lack of extra platforms at Manchester Piccadilly.
 

Bertie the bus

Established Member
Joined
15 Aug 2014
Messages
2,781
Even though Liverpool Newcastle trains don't go there, I think the problem is the lack of extra platforms at Manchester Piccadilly.
Thanks for posting that. It should go in the things that made you smile today thread.
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
31,267
Yesterday (Sat 21st Dec) was a very bad day for TPE services from Liverpool - Manchester and York - Newcastle in particular. TPE had announced a reduced service earlier in the week but then cancelled many more trains on the day. The service was particularly poor later in the afternoon and evening. Two services from Newcastle were cancelled between 1730 and 1830 which would have been disastrous for those trying to get back from St James Park. And very few trains were operating between Leeds and Manchester - or between Manchester and Liverpool. Northern also cancelled a lot of trains but weren't quite as bad as TPE.

Does anybody have any idea why the service was so bad? Was it lack of properly trained staff on new units, staff sickness or staff simply wanting Saturday off and refusing to work overtime?
Have you seen this thread:
https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...land-cancellations.195406/page-4#post-4346567
Probably all the reasons you mentioned combined, but surely it isn’t a sudden new issue this weekend?
 

Andyh82

Established Member
Joined
19 May 2014
Messages
3,489
I'm wondering how many different threads there can be about Northern and TPE cancelling trains...
 

Carlisle

Established Member
Joined
26 Aug 2012
Messages
4,124
I'm wondering how many different threads there can be about Northern and TPE cancelling trains...
The fact they’ve still got the franchise at all is evidence of just how proficient those in charge must have become at simply diverting blame elsewhere for the vast majority of its failings
 

AndrewE

Established Member
Joined
9 Nov 2015
Messages
5,072
On RTT it looks like about a third of TPE trains through Leeds to Manchester cancelled today, including all Newcastle and Edinburgh services - which ironically are shown as "due to late arrival of an inbound service!" They are fibbing again... not arriving at all is not late.
 

APT618S

Member
Joined
7 Dec 2018
Messages
429
Just passed the departure boards at Newcastle and noticed the 2201 to Man Airport and 2246 to Huddersfield are showing as Bus Services also the 2221 arr from Liverpool is cancelled.
 

LNW-GW Joint

Veteran Member
Joined
22 Feb 2011
Messages
19,555
Location
Mold, Clwyd
Just passed the departure boards at Newcastle and noticed the 2201 to Man Airport and 2246 to Huddersfield are showing as Bus Services also the 2221 arr from Liverpool is cancelled.

Meanwhile the service indicator on NRE says "Good Service" for TPE.
 

AndrewE

Established Member
Joined
9 Nov 2015
Messages
5,072
Meanwhile the service indicator on NRE says "Good Service" for TPE.
That is scandalously dishonest. I wonder if there is a regulator that could call them to account?
And would someone doing a review of the current structure even be aware of this low-level dishonesty and misleading of customers?
 

DanNCL

Established Member
Joined
17 Jul 2017
Messages
4,196
Location
County Durham
First northbound train to stop at Chester-le-Street today wasn't until 17:02 thanks to the cancellations. It's becoming way too frequent an occurance now, it's got to the point where the train service from Chester-le-Street is no longer useable as Transpennine Express just can't be trusted to actually operate the service.
 

cuccir

Established Member
Joined
18 Nov 2009
Messages
3,659
I commute Durham to Newcastle and I'm glad I don't have to rely on TPE (they provide 2 of 5 trains per hour). Their service has been unreliable since May 2018, with peaks and troughs; the last fortnight has definitely been a trough and I've no reason to believe it'll improve radically when the temporary timetable ends.

Of course, all of this has been well documented across their Network. I have every sympathy with people making journeys where they are the only operator.
 

Vespa

Established Member
Joined
20 Dec 2019
Messages
1,576
Location
Merseyside
A friend regularly commutes to Liverpool and quite often his TPE is regularly cancelled or delayed then cancelled, he uses Northern trains when that happens, even Northern have cancellations as well.

It doesn't inspire confidence not knowing if your train is running on time or even running at all.
 

AndrewE

Established Member
Joined
9 Nov 2015
Messages
5,072
It's more than "a bad day!"
Yesterday (Sat 21st Dec) was a very bad day for TPE services from Liverpool - Manchester and York - Newcastle in particular. TPE had announced a reduced service earlier in the week but then cancelled many more trains on the day. The service was particularly poor later in the afternoon and evening. Two services from Newcastle were cancelled between 1730 and 1830 which would have been disastrous for those trying to get back from St James Park. And very few trains were operating between Leeds and Manchester - or between Manchester and Liverpool. Northern also cancelled a lot of trains but weren't quite as bad as TPE.

Does anybody have any idea why the service was so bad? Was it lack of properly trained staff on new units, staff sickness or staff simply wanting Saturday off and refusing to work overtime?
On TPE's website https://www.tpexpress.co.uk/travel-updates/december-2019-timetable-changes we have the following
The following services will not run:

Monday to Saturday until 04 January


0600, 0900, 1000, 1100, 1300, 1600 & 1900 to Huddersfield, Leeds, York, Darlington, Durham, Newcastle, Morpeth and Edinburgh
2000 to Huddersfield, Leeds, York, Darlington, Durham, and Newcastle
2100 to Huddersfield, Leeds, York, Northallerton, Darlington, Durham, Chester-le-Street and Newcastle
0724, 0824, 0924, 1124, 1424, 1724 & 1824 to Liverpool Lime Street
1924 & 2124 to Lea Green and Liverpool Lime Street
0026 to Manchester Piccadilly and Manchester Airport

Monday to Friday until 03 January

2353 to Stalybridge, Huddersfield, Dewsbury, Leeds, York
A replacement coach will depart at 0008 (Tuesday to Saturday mornings) to York (arr 0253) calling at Stalybridge (0028), then as required to set down only at Huddersfield (0113), Dewsbury (0138) and Leeds (0203).

Saturdays until 04 January

1900 to Huddersfield, Leeds, York, Darlington, Durham, and Newcastle
2345 to Stalybridge, Huddersfield, Dewsbury, Leeds, York
A replacement coach will depart at 0008 (Sunday morning) to York (arr 0253) calling at Stalybridge (0028), then as required to set down only at
Huddersfield (0113), Dewsbury (0138) and Leeds (0203).


Sundays until 05 January

1201, 1300, 1600 & 1700 to Huddersfield, Leeds, York, Darlington, Durham, Newcastle, Morpeth and Edinburgh
2147 to Stalybridge, Huddersfield, Dewsbury Leeds, York, Thirsk, Northallerton, Darlington, Durham, Chester-le-Street and Newcastle
2345 to Stalybridge, Huddersfield, Dewsbury, Leeds, York
A replacement coach will depart at 0008 (Monday morning) to York (arr 0253) calling at Stalybridge (0028), then as required to set down only at Huddersfield (0113), Dewsbury (0138) and Leeds (0203).

1424, 1523 & 2023 to Liverpool Lime Street
2124 to Lea Green and Liverpool Lime Street
with the explanation
An apology to our customers

Leo Goodwin, Managing Director for TransPennine Express said, “I am truly sorry for the continued disruption to journeys this week. I know what a busy time it is with everyone juggling work, visiting loved ones or trying to go out and enjoy the party season. As we bring in our new trains, it has had an associated impact upon our training schedule and our train maintenance plan which is having a big knock-on effect to our services. Our current performance is not acceptable and we are working hard to fix this.”

Liverpool to Edinburgh Services

We are making a number of temporary changes to services along this particular route to enable us to roll out our new fleet of trains. We had expected to be operating a few more of our new trains at this stage but due to a maintenance backlog and infrastructure issues, which has caused a delay in crew training, along with the late delivery of some of our new trains, we are a little behind with this. We are working hard to bring in the new trains as soon as we can and as soon as we do, we will be reintroducing these services.
 

2L70

On Moderation
Joined
18 Feb 2019
Messages
355
Location
Barnetby
I’ve been to a quite a few Newcastle United games this season and there is ALWAYS cancellations on TPE on Saturday. Nothing new.
 

rg177

Established Member
Associate Staff
International Transport
Joined
22 Dec 2013
Messages
3,692
Location
Newcastle-upon-Tyne
I have never seen the TPE service from Newcastle be quite this bad- to the extent that I simply cannot book onto their services because I cannot trust that it will run.

I'm lucky that there are alternatives, but the folk of Chester-le-St must be sick. This isn't just a case of a few trains being cancelled- TPE managed to run five trains all day yesterday southbound from Newcastle.
 

Bletchleyite

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Oct 2014
Messages
97,540
Location
"Marston Vale mafia"
I have never seen the TPE service from Newcastle be quite this bad- to the extent that I simply cannot book onto their services because I cannot trust that it will run.

That isn't just that part of it - it's all like that. Today the Scottish services near enough didn't run (some did, but a good many didn't).

It's good that they have (unlike Northern and LNR) published an emergency timetable, but I think they haven't lopped enough.
 

Bertie the bus

Established Member
Joined
15 Aug 2014
Messages
2,781
It's good that they have (unlike Northern and LNR) published an emergency timetable, but I think they haven't lopped enough.
No it isn't good. The fact they have issued an emergency timetable and are still cancelling so many services just shows:
a) how bad the situation is
b) how long it is likely to last
c) what little grasp of the situation TPE have
By cotrast, last summer when Northern's services were in meltdown they almost immediately stabilised when they introduced an emergency timetable.
 

mrmartin

Member
Joined
17 Dec 2012
Messages
1,011
I'm really struggling to understand what ticket acceptance TPE has in place. Their website says that they have pretty reasonable ticket acceptance in place with Avanti, LNER and Northern, but the journey check website only refers to road transport.

At Pic the tannoys were saying take northern to Preston, but at Preston there was road transport booked?
 

greyman42

Established Member
Joined
14 Aug 2017
Messages
4,894
Yesterday (Sat 21st Dec) was a very bad day for TPE services from Liverpool - Manchester and York - Newcastle in particular. TPE had announced a reduced service earlier in the week but then cancelled many more trains on the day. The service was particularly poor later in the afternoon and evening. Two services from Newcastle were cancelled between 1730 and 1830 which would have been disastrous for those trying to get back from St James Park.
I was on my way home from the match to York, and the 1727 LNER was rammed with first class declassified as far as York.
 

Foxcover

Member
Joined
14 Nov 2015
Messages
152
Does anyone know what all this is doing to First’s/TPE’s revenue line with respect to the core Transpennine routes? It must be fairly devastating and I’d guess a long time before they rebuild the credibility they’ve completely lost there.

It would be interesting to see how that current and projected continuing revenue loss compares to the ORCATs share from the Scottish routes, which the TPE boardroom is clearly totally focused on (or it would have paused the Scottish routes for six months and focused on getting the core delivered).
 

NEDdrv

Member
Joined
23 May 2016
Messages
60
I posted this in Aug last year, maybe just as well it didn’t happen but nice to see some XC trains have been speeded up from Derby

Have seen quite a few comments about Newcastle terminating trains being curtailed at York as TPE are running more services, people need to to careful what they wish for as there have been so many of their trains cancelled or terminated short at York, Northallerton or Darlington in the last few months at least most of the time XC do make it to Newcastle. XC trains suffer due to poor timetables, at Doncaster most arrive outside early only to be held for late running LNER trains, then they can be delayed by late running TPE trains from York. With the Derby work finished running times should be improved and would be interesting to see what the performance figure would be if XC train left Doncaster before the LNER and York in front of the TPE
 

Nicholas Lewis

Established Member
Joined
9 Aug 2019
Messages
5,996
Location
Surrey
Does anyone know what all this is doing to First’s/TPE’s revenue line with respect to the core Transpennine routes? It must be fairly devastating and I’d guess a long time before they rebuild the credibility they’ve completely lost there.

It would be interesting to see how that current and projected continuing revenue loss compares to the ORCATs share from the Scottish routes, which the TPE boardroom is clearly totally focused on (or it would have paused the Scottish routes for six months and focused on getting the core delivered).

Well the MD got a hefty 331k last year for running this TOC so there's an easy option for an ORCATs raid https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/...M4NWFkaXF6a2N4/document?format=pdf&download=0
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top