Landslip on the East Grinstead line

[Murray J]

Moderator note: Split from https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/landslip-between-redhill-and-tonbridge.197165/

Not sure if this is related or not but there has been a landslip between Hurst Green and East Grinstead, and that line is pretty close to the section of track involved in the landslip between Tonbridge and Redhill.

 

[tsr]

Not sure if this is related or not but there has been a landslip between Hurst Green and East Grinstead, and that line is pretty close to the section of track involved in the landslip between Tonbridge and Redhill.

The East Grinstead Line landslip is just south of Cooks Pond Viaduct, which is between Dormans and East Grinstead. The landslip on the Redhill to Tonbridge Line is some distance north, by several miles (though in a worst-case scenario, that one could also eventually start to impact the East Grinstead route as well... hopefully not!).

 

[Murray J]

The East Grinstead Line landslip is just south of Cooks Pond Viaduct, which is between Dormans and East Grinstead. The landslip on the Redhill to Tonbridge Line is some distance north, by several miles (though in a worst-case scenario, that one could also eventually start to impact the East Grinstead route as well... hopefully not!).

Ok thanks, found out after I'd wrote that post on the southern website it says the landslip was "in the east grinstead area" just didn't know where.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Hurst Green-E.Grinstead also closed currently due to landslip although looks far less destructive than Crowhurst site but further draw on replacement buses and potentially will take priority over Crowhurst if remediation required due to traffic levels.

 

[tsr]

Hurst Green-E.Grinstead also closed currently due to landslip although looks far less destructive than Crowhurst site but further draw on replacement buses and potentially will take priority over Crowhurst if remediation required due to traffic levels.

Yes, this incident has already been mentioned (but no blame on you as it is hardly the main topic of the thread!). We should know fairly soon if one or both lines can reopen at a limited speed through the Dormans area. It's not yet as destructive, but is a very complex site, with about 3 or 4 separate actual landslip locations - a couple of historic ones and a new one. Progressively more and more senior engineers have been drawn from across the country to try to figure out what's happening.

(Funnily enough, although it's not really near Crowhurst, the marshy ground west of the railway at the Dormans site is also something which feeds the same River Eden. Probably not related, but interesting nonetheless.)

 

[Horizon22]

Yes, this incident has already been mentioned (but no blame on you as it is hardly the main topic of the thread!). We should know fairly soon if one or both lines can reopen at a limited speed through the Dormans area. It's not yet as destructive, but is a very complex site, with about 3 or 4 separate actual landslip locations - a couple of historic ones and a new one. Progressively more and more senior engineers have been drawn from across the country to try to figure out what's happening. Funnily enough, although it's not near Crowhurst, the marshy ground east of the railway at the Dormans site is also something which feeds the same River Eden.

There were minor concerns that the two incidents could affect each other as track was suspended in the air close to the bridge over the East Grinstead lines but this seems to have been alleviated. Clearly the entire area is very saturated and prone to movement.

 

[Chrisgr31]

Network Rail and Southern tweeted several hours ago they were going to run test trains through the East Grinstead landslip area but there have been no further reports. Seems a rather odd way of testing a track, to send a train to see if it gets through. If it doesnt you presumably have a very big problem!

 

[Murray J]

As far as I'm concerned no test trains have run so far, I'm assuming there'd need to be a path up on RTT first?

 

[tsr]

There were minor concerns that the two incidents could affect each other

Not quite. The two landslips are miles apart. There were concerns the Crowhurst landslip could result in the displaced track causing damage to the bridge over the East Grinstead line near Sunt Farm, but this concern didn’t last long at all, as there was no actual apparent problem.

Network Rail and Southern tweeted several hours ago they were going to run test trains through the East Grinstead landslip area but there have been no further reports. Seems a rather odd way of testing a track, to send a train to see if it gets through. If it doesnt you presumably have a very big problem!

The delay has been down to arranging additional specialist surveys. Test trains will hopefully now start running soon - they are to check for the performance of the track, rather than seeing if it will collapse outright! First few runs will be at 5mph max, then a little higher if conditions allow.

As far as I'm concerned no test trains have run so far, I'm assuming there'd need to be a path up on RTT first?

RTT has no bearing on whether a train can run. Some of the VSTP paths have appeared on there, but at least 6 more will be needed.

 

[DazCM]

Our house is just south of Hurst Green junction, and alongside the EG line. A train has just headed towards Lingfield.

 

[Horizon22]

Our house is just south of Hurst Green junction, and alongside the EG line. A train has just headed towards Lingfield.

A 5L66 seems to have made its way successfully to East Grinstead.

Edit: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O75832/2019-12-29/detailed

 

[Surreytraveller]

Our house is just south of Hurst Green junction, and alongside the EG line. A train has just headed towards Lingfield.

There is a ground frame there which can be used to reverse trains

 

[Surreytraveller]

Network Rail and Southern tweeted several hours ago they were going to run test trains through the East Grinstead landslip area but there have been no further reports. Seems a rather odd way of testing a track, to send a train to see if it gets through. If it doesnt you presumably have a very big problem!

They'll likely run a train with P-Way on board to see how bad the ride is

 

[tsr]

There is a ground frame there which can be used to reverse trains

It was used yesterday, but not today. The train in question was a test train.

They'll likely run a train with P-Way on board to see how bad the ride is

It’s actually so the engineers can check what happens to the track after the train has passed. Ride quality shouldn’t be an issue at the moment.

 

[Glenn1969]

RTT is showing 30 minute service from East Grinstead to Victoria to resume at 0636 tomorrow but is that realistic?

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Southern Railway

RTT is showing 30 minute service from East Grinstead to Victoria to resume at 0636 tomorrow but is that realistic?

SouthernRailway website says NO but its same message that was posted 6+ hrs ago so well see in the morning

 

[tsr]

Southern Railway

SouthernRailway website says NO but its same message that was posted 6+ hrs ago so well see in the morning

Still to be confirmed. Will be half-hourly trains or buses. At this rate, hopefully trains. We’ll see.

 

[Murray J]

services to east grinstead have resumed, with a 20mph speed limit in place in the affected area after network rail deemed the site to be safe

 

[hwl]

services to east grinstead have resumed, with a 20mph speed limit in place in the affected area after network rail deemed the site to be safe

Service will be a mess for a good while even thought there is now a "plan".

Luckily no track movement just a small slip at the base of the embankment

 

[tsr]

Service will be a mess for a good while even thought there is now a "plan".

Luckily no track movement just a small slip at the base of the embankment

No significant service disruption today on the East Grinstead line whatsoever, and if anything changes, buses are booked anyway.

The slip is actually quite big, and was thought to be on the borderline of whether or not trains can run, but numerous assessments have been carried out (and still are being undertaken regularly), and the line is safe to use at the moment. Fortunately it is still some way away from the Up line and the Down is basically completely unaffected.

Hopefully, the most notable disruption will only be when the permanent repairs need to be undertaken. This will take a little while to be planned and implemented. I should think a couple of full weekend possessions may be in order - possibly a long weekend or part of a week instead, if unlucky - unless it can be dealt with from outside the railway boundary. This would involve carving a path through woodland (might do anyway) which has some boggy ground in it, so not the quickest job in the world.

 

[Murray J]

Yeah, the worst delay today due to the speed restrictions I saw was 5 minutes so I don't believe the line is being affected much.

 

[DazCM]

The landslip now appears to have got worse overnight last night and the line is closed south of Hurst Green again.

There was a message on Southern’s website early this morning saying the line would be closed from Lingfield southwards from Sat 15 Feb until 2 March, with most trains reversing at Lingfield apart from early morning/late evening where they would reverse at Oxted. I presumed this was related to needing someone to operate the ground frame at Lingfield and I think there are some overnight possessions next week due to platform works at Hurst Green.

Seems this morning the landslip moved significantly due to last night’s heavy rain and the line has been closed with everything reversing at Hurst Green again.

 

[al78]

You will probably have to get used to this over the coming days, Amber weather warnings for rain over SE England. The rain overnight and this morning has made the land sodden again, and 2-3 inches of rain over the weekend is just right for further landslips and flooding, never mind any trees weakened from last weekend's storm coming down in 50-60 mph gusts.

 

[Murray J]

Trains now being turned back at Hurst Green.

 

[Murray J]

effective tomorrow, trains will be turned back at Lingfield, with rail replacements running between EG and Lingfield/three bridges.

 

[RichJF]

Potential landslip on the Uckfield line now. According to Southern a railway embankment has seen severe deterioration near Edenbridge Town.

 

[Murray J]

yeah I heard, also there's been a second landslip on the EG line a few days ago, a few hundred metres away from the first.

 

[James H]

Nice gesture from the Spa Valley Railway
http://www.mynewsdesk.com/uk/govia-...-strain-during-emergency-line-closure-2977416

Passengers travelling to London, affected by an emergency closure of the Uckfield line this weekend, can use their tickets on the steam and diesel heritage Spa Valley Railway at Eridge to reach alternative services from Tunbridge Wells.

The scheduled Spa Valley Railway service will supplement a direct replacement bus service Southern will have in place between Eridge and Tunbridge Wells.

Southern Rail’s community partner the Spa Valley Railway has made the offer at no additional cost to Southern ticket holders who hold a ticket from the Uckfield route to London.

 

[Chrisgr31]

There is no replacement bus service on the Uckfield line this weekend, they cant get accessible buses. There is a 2 hourly train service on the line between Uckfield and Ashurst, the 29 bus to Tunbridge Wells/Lewes, the Spa Valley train, or driving to Tunbridge wells/ Wadhurst or Lewes / Haywards Heath.

There are other areas they are worried about on both lines. Network Rail are already doing planned work at Hever and between Oxted and Oxted Tunnel and then the now have Edenbridge Town, and the East Grinstead issues. Plenty of the embankments and cuttings on the line have monitoring posts on them.

 

[Murray J]

No, there are replacement buses running between Eridge and Tunbridge Wells.