No one is going to re-fit the Mk4s for tilt so let's leave it there. If anyone is truly desperate to talk about it then please do so on a new thread not this one.
Interesting movement appeared in RTT for Monday 3rd February running from Worksop sidings to Alstom Technology Centre at Widnes. Things starting to happen?
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K00227/2020-02-03/detailed
Probably revenue extraction from Preston that they are targeting but this can't be seen to be their main aim.I do think this service might be a white elephant. The Avanti service isn’t the busiest either, practically carts fresh air. Is there really that much demand from Blackpool to London, of course it provides an alternate from Preston, but I feel it won’t be heavily used by people from Blackpool, which I’m assuming is where they are targetting
For Derby would it not be easier and quicker to go via Birmingham or Crewe as you will still have to change at either Leicester or Tamworth to get to Nuneaton?Avant's service isn't busy due to the fact that it was started up by Virgin Trains as a means to essentially block and cause damage to proposed GNWR service - an attempt to get some sort of passenger flow before Grand Central start. That is also the reason why their trains are dead - it's what is essentially left over stations which they can call such as Rugby as GC already have what I call the good stops which I believe VT weren't allowed to use as part of that service.
Grand Central will have a good flow of people as their stopping pattern allows for better connections to services up north.
Milton Keynes - will open up better, faster connections for people between Watford and Northampton
Nuneaton - connections to Derby, East Midlands and Stanstead Airport
Preston - connections to everywhere up north along with commuters who do travel to Blackpool.
It would be quicker but you can get tickets issued NOT VIA Birmingham which makes it cheaper. Perfect for those who are on a tighter budget ie students.For Derby would it not be easier and quicker to go via Birmingham or Crewe as you will still have to change at either Leicester or Tamworth to get to Nuneaton?
Avant's service isn't busy due to the fact that it was started up by Virgin Trains as a means to essentially block and cause damage to proposed GNWR service - an attempt to get some sort of passenger flow before Grand Central start. That is also the reason why their trains are dead - it's what is essentially left over stations which they can call such as Rugby as GC already have what I call the good stops which I believe VT weren't allowed to use as part of that service.
Grand Central will have a good flow of people as their stopping pattern allows for better connections to services up north.
Milton Keynes - will open up better, faster connections for people between Watford and Northampton
Nuneaton - connections to Derby, East Midlands and Stanstead Airport
Preston - connections to everywhere up north along with commuters who do travel to Blackpool.
Probably revenue extraction from Preston that they are targeting but this can't be seen to be their main aim.
Imagine it has huge potential as a Fleetwood and Cleeveley Parkway with its massive 20 spaces car park.I imagine Poulton-le-Fylde will be a popular pick up/drop off destination for services to Eus. Especially as VT and Avanti service does not call at PFY
I imagine Poulton-le-Fylde will be a popular pick up/drop off destination for services to Eus. Especially as VT and Avanti service does not call at PFY
Avant's service isn't busy due to the fact that it was started up by Virgin Trains as a means to essentially block and cause damage to proposed GNWR service - an attempt to get some sort of passenger flow before Grand Central start. That is also the reason why their trains are dead - it's what is essentially left over stations which they can call such as Rugby as GC already have what I call the good stops which I believe VT weren't allowed to use as part of that service.
No it wasn't.
Virgin was specifically asked by Patrick McLoughlin (Transport Sec) to introduce services to Blackpool (and Shrewsbury) as part of their direct award.
It's part of the agreed franchise spec.
It was not a Virgin blocking raid (any more than the moderation of competition 1997-2012 was of their making).
The service to Wrexham is a bit different and I think it is on an open access basis.
Avanti now picks up those franchise commitments.
Absolutely correct. Poulton-le Fylde is a no brainier, which Virgin and now Avanti have ignored. In particular the mid morning departure from Blackpool would have a good number of 'people of a certain age' who travel to London for a few days away etc. Poulton and Kirkham have good catchment areas in terms of prospective outward passengers whereas Blackpool is much more limited to returning passengers. Additionally Virgin and now Avanti have the off peak trains calling at Preston Wigan and Warrington 4-6 minutes behind a Southbound Euston(via West Midlands) Service, odd to say the least. I do get the impression that there must be another reason why these trains are run. Personally I find them useful, but not many of us do!I imagine Poulton-le-Fylde will be a popular pick up/drop off destination for services to Eus. Especially as VT and Avanti service does not call at PFY
I don't think they have been Ignored by Virgin and Avanti as the daily Voyager services call there, I think it is because the Pendolinos are to long for the platforms, I may be wrong though.Absolutely correct. Poulton-le Fylde is a no brainier, which Virgin and now Avanti have ignored. In particular the mid morning departure from Blackpool would have a good number of 'people of a certain age' who travel to London for a few days away etc. Poulton and Kirkham have good catchment areas in terms of prospective outward passengers whereas Blackpool is much more limited to returning passengers. Additionally Virgin and now Avanti have the off peak trains calling at Preston Wigan and Warrington 4-6 minutes behind a Southbound Euston(via West Midlands) Service, odd to say the least. I do get the impression that there must be another reason why these trains are run. Personally I find them useful, but not many of us do!
That's certainly been stated on this forum before.I don't think they have been Ignored by Virgin and Avanti as the daily Voyager services call there, I think it is because the Pendolinos are to long for the platforms, I may be wrong though.
Yes i'm sure it has but the point is that there must be a way of stopping the trains if the will was there as they have selective door opening do they not? I think Alliance are onto a good move here since they are intending to run trains which fit the stations.That's certainly been stated on this forum before.
The Avanti BPN-EUS services barring the Voyagers are too long to call at Poulton-le-Fylde and Kirkham & Wesham, and the early morning services that do call to London are too early for the older passengers.
What GC are doing IMHO is providing a decent service for not only those wanting to to to Blackpool for the activities there but also older passengers from the South East, Midlands and Staffordshire that want either a few days away in somewhere like Lytham, St Anne's on the Sea, Blackpool or Fleetwood as there are good connections by rail or tram to all.
Similarly the southbound services would convey these to London for a day trip or weekend away.
Sorry but the OAP market to locations such as Lytham from the south east must be close to Non existence.The Avanti BPN-EUS services barring the Voyagers are too long to call at Poulton-le-Fylde and Kirkham & Wesham, and the early morning services that do call to London are too early for the older passengers.
What GC are doing IMHO is providing a decent service for not only those wanting to to to Blackpool for the activities there but also older passengers from the South East, Midlands and Staffordshire that want either a few days away in somewhere like Lytham, St Anne's on the Sea, Blackpool or Fleetwood as there are good connections by rail or tram to all.
Similarly the southbound services would convey these to London for a day trip or weekend away.
Sorry but the OAP market to locations such as Lytham from the south east must be close to Non existence.
This type of holiday screams coach trip but Shearings the market leader only offer the occasional weekend in Blackpool, the weekend mostly seems to consist of getting out of Blackpool with Day Trips to the Lakes and Liverpool. Cant see many people swapping a local departure to hotel coach for dragging luggage on to a commuter train up to London and then across London on the tube for a Grand Central Service to Blackpool and then a taxi to the hotel tbh.
I think they'd be better off running to Lancaster, Oxenholme, Penrith and Carlisle, linking those places (and Preston) with some of the stops which the Virgin/Avanti Glasgow service skips: MKC, Nuneaton and Stafford.
Many more possibilities than Blackpool - tourism to Lakes, uni traffic to Preston and Lancaster, and onward rail connections from all of them. Blackpool offer no rail connections, only Fleetwood.