First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)

[Goldfish62]

presumably running on PCB operator licences. As yet no new operating centres have been added to that operator licence

Yes. The only difference between PCB and GCB buses is the name on the exterior. Well, it is currently. Presumably the independents will also use GCB livery and names. It doesn't matter what livery and fleet name an operator uses. What matters is the legal lettering and the O disc - which must match.

The TCs will not be hurried when it comes to operating centre approval. It's not their concern that an operator may wish to start urgently. This of course could present an issue....

 

[richw]

Yes. The only difference between PCB and GCB buses is the name on the exterior. Well, it is currently. Presumably the independents will also use GCB livery and names. It doesn't matter what livery and fleet name an operator uses. What matters is the legal lettering and the O disc - which must match.

The TCs will not be hurried when it comes to operating centre approval. It's not their concern that an operator may wish to start urgently. This of course could present an issue....

Known sites from give always in the job ads, Cormac scorrier, Newquay airport, Rilla mill near Liskeard/ callington / Launceston in the caradon hills.... this is the interesting one as it’s on narrow back road.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

44921 at Redruth station this afternoon. Given it still hasn't had branding applied I wonder if it's leaving the fleet with the forthcoming upheaval.
View attachment 73873

Guess it depends what gets registered? How many of the e200mmc are CC owned as well?

 

[richw]

How many of the e200mmc are CC owned as well?

16 are council owned

 

[njlawley]

To put it into perspective, there are two companies based in the building where I work. There are about 100 whose registered address is at the same building.

Why? Because the other company is a firm of accountants. The purpose of a registered address is for legal reasons, where statutory mail from the government is sent - usually relating to tax. Likewise, for Go Ahead, Newcastle is where the financial parts of the business are based (the group's actual HQ is now in Westminster).

 

[Goldfish62]

Guess it depends what gets registered? How many of the e200mmc are CC owned as well?

I believe the 16 council owned ones have been more or less confirmed as leaving the fleet next month.

There's a reduction of about 35 PVR in work. Whatever is registered as suddenly miraculously commercial I can't see it being sufficient enough to use the balance of 20-odd buses. I would certainly expect the Darts and most of the Solos to go. Some will need to stay for Mousehole.

I may of course be completely wrong!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I believe the 16 council owned ones have been more or less confirmed as leaving the fleet next month.

There's a reduction of about 35 PVR in work. Whatever is registered as suddenly miraculously commercial I can't see it being sufficient enough to use the balance of 20-odd buses. I would certainly expect the Darts and most of the Solos to go. Some will need to stay for Mousehole.

I may of course be completely wrong!

Thanks to @richw for that confirmation, and also for your update.

It will be interesting to see what gets registered. I'm guessing that the PZ 5, and some elements of the 46/47 will be retained (along with the mooted retention of some of the Lizard/Helston work). It's Bodmin that I have more of a struggle in wondering what might be retained?

 

[Whiteway215]

Thanks to @richw for that confirmation, and also for your update.

It will be interesting to see what gets registered. I'm guessing that the PZ 5, and some elements of the 46/47 will be retained (along with the mooted retention of some of the Lizard/Helston work). It's Bodmin that I have more of a struggle in wondering what might be retained?

When are the FK registrations likely to be made public?

 

[freetoview33]

When are the FK registrations likely to be made public?

Within the next 2 weeks

 

[richw]

There's a reduction of about 35 PVR in work. Whatever is registered as suddenly miraculously commercial I can't see it being sufficient enough to use the balance of 20-odd buses. I would certainly expect the Darts and most of the Solos to go. Some will need to stay for Mousehole.

I may of course be completely wrong!

More uninformed presumption. There’s nothing going to become ‘miraculously commercial’. A big part of the network in mid Cornwall was tendered because the Council want routes to divert off the main commercial line, or more variants of routes than are commercial, or a higher frequency than is commercial, or extended to take a commercial part further on.
Hence having not won tenders on that basis FSW inevitably will go back to registering the underlying purely commercially parts from March 29th.
There’s nothing ‘miraculous’ about that.

What FSW will also do is to take the opportunity of having resources available (at the start of the season) to bring forward Summer uplifts and a series of plans that have been on the ‘to develop’ list for 14 April and early May.

Similarly, it’s an uninformed assumption
to make that this work is going to use up the displaced Solos or Darts.

A few may end up on contract or similar work (the FSW business model has a significant number of private contracts and other business than local bus), but most of the additional work being developed requires coaches and double deckers as it happens.

Finally, far from using up surplus buses, Kernow is expecting around 50 vehicles to join the fleet in the next few months for a variety of new business and upgrades to exiting fleet.

 

[Goldfish62]

More uninformed presumption. There’s nothing going to become ‘miraculously commercial’. A big part of the network in mid Cornwall was tendered because the Council want routes to divert off the main commercial line, or more variants of routes than are commercial, or a higher frequency than is commercial, or extended to take a commercial part further on.
Hence having not won tenders on that basis FSW inevitably will go back to registering the underlying purely commercially parts from March 29th.
There’s nothing ‘miraculous’ about that.

What FSW will also do is to take the opportunity of having resources available (at the start of the season) to bring forward Summer uplifts and a series of plans that have been on the ‘to develop’ list for 14 April and early May.

Similarly, it’s an uninformed assumption
to make that this work is going to use up the displaced Solos or Darts.

A few may end up on contract or similar work (the FSW business model has a significant number of private contracts and other business than local bus), but most of the additional work being developed requires coaches and double deckers as it happens.

Finally, far from using up surplus buses, Kernow is expecting around 50 vehicles to join the fleet in the next few months for a variety of new business and upgrades to exiting fleet.

That's interesting stuff. Thanks for posting.

As for "uninformed presumption" sorry if you've somehow taken offence at this, but if we can't speculate on this forum then it's going to end up stifling debate. As for "miraculously commercial", yes, this has been replicated throughout the country when operators use tendered routes and is nothing other than a tongue in cheek observation that's common in the industry. I'm not going to apologise for making that comment.

For the record, if there's any side to take I'm on FK's side, not GCB and I wish FK well for their new ventures because they deserve to succeed.

 

[MB162435]

First South West Ltd is a company with its registered head office in Camborne. Therefore it's Cornish.

But is that a concern for passengers, Kernow only started do the 'Real Cornish buses' after GCB came on the scene. Don't they care what their bus service is run by, weather they are Cornish, Iranian or Australian, as long as the bus turns up on time and don't cost them an arm and a leg.

You can't say they're real Cornish buses, when they were built across the Tamar unless Optare or ADL has opened a factory in Cornwall recently?

I'm all for Kernow embracing the Cornish culture, I hope GCB do too but I do hope they don't try and out Cornish each other, there is no award for the most Cornish bus company

 

[Goldfish62]

But is that a concern for passengers, Kernow only started do the 'Real Cornish buses' after GCB came on the scene. Don't they care what their bus service is run by, weather they are Cornish, Iranian or Australian, as long as the bus turns up on time and don't cost them an arm and a leg.

You can't say they're real Cornish buses, when they were built across the Tamar unless Optare or ADL has opened a factory in Cornwall recently?

I'm all for Kernow embracing the Cornish culture, I hope GCB do too but I do hope they don't try and out Cornish each other, there is no award for the most Cornish bus company

It's nothing more or less than a light-hearted promotional campaign, as are the various Cornish dialect phrases on the rear of buses.

 

[carlberry]

But is that a concern for passengers, Kernow only started do the 'Real Cornish buses' after GCB came on the scene. Don't they care what their bus service is run by, weather they are Cornish, Iranian or Australian, as long as the bus turns up on time and don't cost them an arm and a leg.

You can't say they're real Cornish buses, when they were built across the Tamar unless Optare or ADL has opened a factory in Cornwall recently?

I'm all for Kernow embracing the Cornish culture, I hope GCB do too but I do hope they don't try and out Cornish each other, there is no award for the most Cornish bus company

Apparently the next lot of advertising boards are going to carry the message 'The other lot's drivers put the jam on top of the cream.'

 

[Goldfish62]

Apparently the next lot of advertising boards are going to carry the message 'The other lot's drivers put the jam on top of the cream.'

Graham Lightfoot, the poet bus driver, has indeed just written a poem on this subject.

 

[richw]

Graham Lightfoot, the poet bus driver, has indeed just written a poem on this subject.

here it is. He’s illustrated it with the attached images

My latest poem is a take on rivals from Devon coming down to try and take over our bus services.

JAM FIRST (THE CREAM STAYS ON TOP)

If you’ve missed it on your media feed,
You may be wondering what the fuss is;
But a crowd’s coming down from ‘up country’
To take on the cream of Cornish buses.

They’re promising new bells and whistles so
You may think that it’s manna from heaven
But we brought you new buses and ticket machines
And best of all we don’t come from Devon.

They’re being a bit disingenuous,
By saying they're bringing the prices down
As that’s a government initiative
Which has to happen in each Cornish town.

Plymouth Citybus – now called Go Cornwall
Trying to make out that they’re the bee’s knees
When all of us know they can't get it right
With something simple like serving cream teas.

So, think on, because it’s important,
When that Devon bus pulls up at your stop.
Do you really want your transport run
By a company who puts jam on top?

 

[Busaholic]

Apparently the next lot of advertising boards are going to carry the message 'The other lot's drivers put the jam on top of the cream.'

P.S. 'As indeed do our own colleagues in the Cider County'

 

[Busaholic]

But is that a concern for passengers, Kernow only started do the 'Real Cornish buses' after GCB came on the scene. Don't they care what their bus service is run by, weather they are Cornish, Iranian or Australian, as long as the bus turns up on time and don't cost them an arm and a leg.

You can't say they're real Cornish buses, when they were built across the Tamar unless Optare or ADL has opened a factory in Cornwall recently?

I'm all for Kernow embracing the Cornish culture, I hope GCB do too but I do hope they don't try and out Cornish each other, there is no award for the most Cornish bus company

They might have found a Rowe Hillmaster bus, which along with lorries were custom-built in East Cornwall for a few years in the 1950s and 1960s: I believe they were all for local independents, but none of the buses survive that I know of.

On the subject of Cornish dialect, the most well-known book on the subject is 'Oall Rite Me 'Ansum' by Cornish bard Les Merton, published by his own Palores imprint in Redruth, but possibly difficult to obtain since his imprisonment for thirteen years in 2015.

 

[Whiteway215]

THE 95 AFTER APRIL

We're waiting for April Fool's Day
When PCB takes over the bus
New drivers, new buses,some chaos?
Will the passengers make a big fuss?

New drivers will have been route trained
Let's hope they remember the way
I mustn't be rude,but after Bude
Hope they don't miss out Widemouth Bay!

When they get to Wainhouse Corner
They must remember to turn right
Or the folk from Crackington Haven
Will be ready to put up a fight

Worrying about their cream teas
Is it cream on top of the jam?
Drivers must concentrate what they're doing
As they pick up in Otterham

Tintagel,Camelford,Wadebridge
St Columb and Summercourt
Will they be allowed in these places?
Without showing their passport

But when they get to Truro
Capital if the County of Tin
Let's hope the Kernow locals
Will let the PCB drivers in!

 

[MB162435]

It's nothing more or less than a light-hearted promotional campaign, as are the various Cornish dialect phrases on the rear of buses.

I'm not saying it's a bad idea, we all need a bit of light hearted banter even if in Kernow's case that's with the incoming enemy

Let's hope the it doesn't get vandalised like the dialect stickers did on the Tinner seats, I know Kernow said they would be replaced but I seem to see less and less of them on Tinners these days

 

[Goldfish62]

I'm not saying it's a bad idea, we all need a bit of light hearted banter even if in Kernow's case that's with the incoming enemy

Let's hope the it doesn't get vandalised like the dialect stickers did on the Tinner seats, I know Kernow said they would be replaced but I seem to see less and less of them on Tinners these days

Agreed.

 

[83G/84D]

An unidentified E200MMC and open top Olympian 34137 seen heading west along the Hayle bypass at around 1850 this evening. Both not in service of course.

 

[83G/84D]

During a brief venture out this morning 20804 and Lizard Trident 32756 seen on rail replacement services in Camborne. Based on information received previously this operation should be exclusively operated by First vehicles.

I am back inside drying off now and unlikely to provide further updates today.

 

[richw]

During a brief venture out this morning 20804 and Lizard Trident 32756 seen on rail replacement services in Camborne. Based on information received previously this operation should be exclusively operated by First vehicles.

I am back inside drying off now and unlikely to provide further updates today.

33181 and 33173 allocated rail on the Summercourt running board today

 

[83G/84D]

Thank you.

 

[83G/84D]

Uni E400MMC 33476 seen in Camborne on rail replacement.

 

[83G/84D]

Trident 33084 just brought into Camborne courtesy of a Jose Recovery truck.

 

[Goldfish62]

Trident 33084 just brought into Camborne courtesy of a Jose Recovery truck.

Broke down at Rosudgeon this morning.

 

[83G/84D]

Broke down at Rosudgeon this morning.

Thanks for the information. Mousehole Solo 53704 operating out of Camborne on the 47.

 

[devonexpress]

I don't get why Cornish people are so obsessed about everything being Cornish, Having used to live in Cornwall throughout my childhood I used to find it a bit silly really, especially when people complain about First or Go-Ahead being outsiders, yet people seem to forget that the original Great Western Railway was based in Swindon with a office at Paddington, yet it used to operate across Cornwall. The fact is that FK is one of the few First bus subsidiary that actually makes any money and fairly soon will probably have one of the most modern fleets in the entire First bus network, if that's not a commitment to Cornwall I don't know what is.