Grand Central to suspend services from end of Friday 3 April 2020

[tonysk14]

Grand Central has announced it will suspend all operations by the end of today

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/n...ntral-set-suspend-services-north-east-london/

RAIL services between the North-East, North Yorkshire and London are set to be cancelled until further notice by the end of the week.

Grand Central, which operates from Sunderland through to London King's Cross is expected to announce that services will stop on Friday.

The RMT Union has since learned that Grand Central staff will 'lose pay' as 'wealthy' parent company, Arriva are understood to be furloughing staff on the government scheme.

 

[Fyldeboy]

Slightly off topic. Grand Central has announced it will suspend all operations by the end of today

Not surprising as GC are open Access, so not covered by the protection offered to franchise operators. I'n sure the NE routes will be back and because of the investment already spent, Blackpool has to still be in with a chance.

 

[Driver068]

After seeing a headline, but not yet supported in a article. The media seem to be reporting that GC are going to suspend all services due to the ongoing coronavirus pandemic.

Has this news done the rounds anywhere else and/or is anyone aware of this news.

Where would this leave the company as a whole. Being an OAO, will this situation effect them any different to a franchised TOC in terms of current recruitment, wages and job security.

Anyone have any thoughts or experience on this.

 

[Darandio]

Where would this leave the company as a whole. Being an OAO, will this situation effect them any different to a franchised TOC in terms of current recruitment, wages and job security.

In the same position as Hull Trains who have done the same, open access operator propped up by a large parent company. Like Hull Trains, employees will probably be placed on the Government job retention scheme.

 

[Class195]

Not surprising as GC are open Access, so not covered by the protection offered to franchise operators. I'n sure the NE routes will be back and because of the investment already spent, Blackpool has to still be in with a chance.

What about the Bradford’s?

 

[Darandio]

What about the Bradford’s?

I think @Fyldeboy meant those as part of the NE routes.

 

[Class195]

I think @Fyldeboy meant those as part of the NE routes.

Ah, my apologies.

From experience, the Bradford’s are usually full on leaving Doncaster.

 

[ainsworth74]

What's the source for this sorry? Nothing on their twitter or website that I could see?

 

[Alan2603]

What's the source for this sorry? Nothing on their twitter or website that I could see?

https://www.railnews.co.uk/news/2020/04/03-grand-central-expected-to-withdraw.html

SPECULATION is growing that Grand Central is about to become the second open access operator to suspend its services. Hull Trains has already withdrawn its timetable until further notice.

According to the RMT and other sources, the last Grand Central trains will run today.

The services between London, Bradford and Sunderland are understood to be the latest victims of falling passenger numbers caused by the coronavirus emergency. Long distance coach operators have also announced that their services will be withdrawn by the end of Sunday, although Megabus will continue to run in Scotland.

Meanwhile, RMT general secretary Mick Cash said: ‘RMT is frankly appalled that Grand Central is not intending to make up the full wages of the staff who are being stood down and is instead intending to just pay the 80 per cent covered by the Government scheme.

‘Arriva can afford to make up the 20 per cent difference and that is what we are calling on them to do.

‘There are nearly 250 hard working rail staff caught in the crossfire of the Grand Central service suspension plan. RMT's preference was for those workers to be kept operational in an arrangement between the DfT and the company which would have kept trains running. If that isn't possible the very least we expect is for their wages to be covered in full.’

Although Grand Central has yet to comment, Railnews has been told that a statement is due within hours.

 

[ainsworth74]

Aha! Thank you

 

[ainsworth74]

We are absolutely not doing yet another round of "OMG the RMT are terrible!" or "The RMT are there to fight for their members come what may!" or any other variation on that theme. I think individual views of the RMT and their media strategy are well known by this point and we don't need to do it every time they say something. All it does is derail threads.

I have therefore deleted any relevant posts and would strongly encourage everyone else to avoid posting anything further in this thread on that subject.

 

[DarloRich]

There doesn't seem to be any other option. There cant be much trade right now

 

[scotrail158713]

Not much of a surprise

 

[ainsworth74]

Confirmed on their website. They also confirm it's for an initial period of two months:

Suspension of services
Over the past two weeks Grand Central has operated a rail service, under a reduced timetable, in order to keep key-workers moving at a time of crisis. As an Open Access rail operator, this came with all the costs of running a train service, while bringing in no revenue to our business and with no Government support. This situation is unsustainable and, following several days of discussion with the Department for Transport, Grand Central has decided to suspend all its services, for an initial two months, from the end of service on Friday 3rd April.

Link

 

[westv]

It does seem strange that all the other TOCs get Government support but the OA operators (who provide as useful a service as the franchise operators) get nothing.

 

[JonathanH]

It does seem strange that all the other TOCs get Government support but the OA operators (who provide as useful a service as the franchise operators) get nothing.

No, it doesn't seem strange. Open access operators provide a service in excess of that which the government requires through franchises.

 

[Mojo]

No, it doesn't seem strange. Open access operators provide a service in excess of that which the government requires through franchises.

Agreed. Whilst the OAOs might allow people to make shorter journeys the number of these will be extremely limited; their main purpose and the feature that allows them to make money is for long distance passenger traffic, primarily to and from London. These are not really the type of journeys which will be used by essential workers.

 

[westv]

Agreed. Whilst the OAOs might allow people to make shorter journeys the number of these will be extremely limited; their main purpose and the feature that allows them to make money is for long distance passenger traffic, primarily to and from London. These are not really the type of journeys which will be used by essential workers.

If that's so why have LNER reinstated their Hull to London service giving the reason as Hull Trains services not running?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

It does seem strange that all the other TOCs get Government support but the OA operators (who provide as useful a service as the franchise operators) get nothing.

They get the support that all commercial companies get, including the government paying 80% of salaries up to £2500 a month.
The same as, say, EasyJet and BA.

 

[pieguyrob]

Seems logical, that if they aren't making any money to suspend sevices for a temporary period. It is a business after all.

 

[JonathanH]

If that's so why have LNER reinstated their Hull to London service giving the reason as Hull Trains services not running?

The government is prepared to pay for its franchised rail operator to run a service from Hull to London. The Hull Trains service isn't needed.

 

[Starmill]

The screenshot shows how quickly Grand Central changed their messaging. News results just four days apart say that Grand Central will continue operating and that they will close down.

Going from speaking to the media on Tuesday saying you're going to keep going through the crisis, to shutting down operation, albeit temporarily, on the Friday, and with no notice at all, is not remotely the sign of a stable, well-managed firm.

OA operators (who provide as useful a service as the franchise operators

This is certainly not always true. There is almost no case for claiming that Grand Central services from London to Bradford via Brighouse are 'as useful', on any metric, than LNER services from London to Leeds (or indeed London to Bradford via Leeds).

 

[JonathanH]

Going from speaking to the media on Tuesday saying you're going to keep going through the crisis to shutting down operation, albeit temporarily, on the Friday, and with no notice at all, is not remotely the sign of a stable, well-managed firm.

Give them a chance. The number of people travelling has fallen off a cliff - they will have been carrying hardly anyone this week. Companies are reacting to the events and making live decisions. Other bus and train companies are reducing their services on a weekly basis and haven't stopped yet.

Very few people, if any, need the services offered by Grand Central until the virus is beaten and shutting down to take advantage of the furlough scheme is a rational business decision.

 

[MontyP]

The screenshot shows how quickly Grand Central changed their messaging. News results just four days apart say that Grand Central will continue operating and that they will close down.

Going from speaking to the media on Tuesday saying you're going to keep going through the crisis, to shutting down operation, albeit temporarily, on the Friday, and with no notice at all, is not remotely the sign of a stable, well-managed firm.

That’s a ridiculous generalisation. We are going through a crisis that is several times worse than the worst that any business would have done a contingency plan for. So please give them a bit of slack for making it up as they go along - that’s what everyone else is doing.

 

[ainsworth74]

And yet Hull Trains knew to throw the towel on Sunday without even trying to run a service this week. Different outfits serving different areas to be sure but still I'm far from convinced that it required this extra week to really work out that Grand Central's position was untenable.

 

[Starmill]

That’s a ridiculous generalisation.

Is it? They're a small operation. One person, such as Mr McClean, should easily know the ins and outs of the firm, both in practical and financial terms, on a day-to-day basis. And yet there he was on Tuesday, having just observed the only comparable business in the country, and a direct competitor, close down two days previously, speaking to the media saying that they would continue running.

We are going through a crisis that is several times worse than the worst that any business would have done a contingency plan for.

Indeed. If Mr McClean and the others at Grand Central hadn't picked up on that four days ago, mind, I feel a certain lack of confidence in them.

So please give them a bit of slack for making it up as they go along - that’s what everyone else is doing.

Except it's not is it?

 

[philthetube]

The screenshot shows how quickly Grand Central changed their messaging. News results just four days apart say that Grand Central will continue operating and that they will close down.

Going from speaking to the media on Tuesday saying you're going to keep going through the crisis, to shutting down operation, albeit temporarily, on the Friday, and with no notice at all, is not remotely the sign of a stable, well-managed firm.

They tried to continue to run a service and they realised it was not possible, I think they deserve credit for trying.

 

[MontyP]

Is it? They're a small operation. One person, such as Mr McClean, should easily know the ins and outs of the firm, both in practical and financial terms, on a day-to-day basis. And yet there he was on Tuesday, having just observed the only comparable business in the country, and a direct competitor, close down two days previously, speaking to the media saying that they would continue running.



Indeed. If Mr McClean and the others at Grand Central hadn't picked up on that four days ago, mind, I feel a certain lack of confidence in them.

Except it's not is it?

Everyone is making it up as they go along because no-one has ever experienced a global pande,ic before - the last one of this severity/impact was the Spanish flu of 1918/19. Now forgive me if I’m wrong but I don’t think that open-access operators existed back then. So GC don’t have a lot of recent experience of similar situations to fall back on.

Just about every business in the country at the moment, no matter whether they are in the transport sector or not, are going through circumstances that they could never have envisaged or planned for. Even the biggest and most robust corporates (Shell, HSBC, etc) are having to adapt to changes to their business that couldn’t have been foreseen and need to respond on a day to day basis. So cut the guy running GC a bit of slack please.

 

[DoubleO]

They tried to continue to run a service and they realised it was not possible, I think they deserve credit for trying.

This. The reason they continued to run services was to show the DFT they were willing to do so and as such attempt to persuade them to provide some financial assistance for them to continue. And for the people saying it's not an issue as they'll go on the furlough scheme, please consider that some members of staff are looking at a 50% pay reduction - not the only people in the country of course, but also not to be dismissed or belittled.

In addition to this, the fact that the government were unwilling to provide financial support to Hull Trains, yet immediately use their own operator (LNER) to provide a stand in service is, in my opinion, disgraceful.

 

[Starmill]

They tried to continue to run a service and they realised it was not possible, I think they deserve credit for trying.

On the contrary, a lot of people didn't really believe them when they said they would continue, and they've been proven right. I think loyal customers almost always value honesty and realism over blind faith.

Everyone is making it up as they go along because no-one has ever experienced a global pande,ic before - the last one of this severity/impact was the Spanish flu of 1918/19. Now forgive me if I’m wrong but I don’t think that open-access operators existed back then. So GC don’t have a lot of recent experience of similar situations to fall back on.

Just about every business in the country at the moment, no matter whether they are in the transport sector or not, are going through circumstances that they could never have envisaged or planned for. Even the biggest and most robust corporates (Shell, HSBC, etc) are having to adapt to changes to their business that couldn’t have been foreseen and need to respond on a day to day basis. So cut the guy running GC a bit of slack please.

You've hit the nail on the head. It shows that Shell, IAG and HSBC are adapting quickly to an exogenous shock. Grand Central and Arriva are not.