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A career as a signaller

Mi&Li

Member
Joined
19 Dec 2019
Messages
87
Location
UK
I was not sure whether to post this or not but here goes... One thing I wanted to mention on this thread is about feedback for unsuccessful applications. In the last couple of weeks I have had lots of requests passed on to me by the Recruitment team from unsuccessful candidates who have been sifted out, looking for feedback on why they had not been selected for an interview for jobs that closed recently. As hiring managers we are obliged to provide feedback if requested after an unsuccessful interview but before the interview stage it is entirely at our discretion whether we give it or not.

I do not mind doing it on the odd occasion but when lots of candidates are all asking it would actually take a fair chunk of my day to fish out and go through the whole application and CV to write up meaningful feedback for Recruitment to pass on. Frankly I do not have the time to do this for multiple applications and I know most other LOMs are in the same boat.

All I would say is that when lots of people apply for a job (and thanks to Corona I am now seeing 120+ applications for one grade 2 post) we all have to be absolutely ruthless when sifting. If you ask Recruitment for feedback on an application that is terminated before the interview stage do not be surprised if you do not hear anything back from the hiring manager.

I hope this post does not sound too negative. Trying to knock 124 candidates down to just 6 is really hard. Just because you have not made the shortlist for an interview does not mean your application is no good!

I don’t think your post sounds too negative at all and can totally understand your reasoning. I personally wouldn’t expect feedback for an application that didn’t make it to an interview but can see why people would ask. You only need to read the job advert carefully and visit a forum like this to really understand where you’re going wrong though.
 
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Chumba

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13 May 2019
Messages
164
Trying to knock 124 candidates down to just 6 is really hard. Just because you have not made the shortlist for an interview does not mean your application is no good!

Absolutely, I did 10 applications all exactly the same examples and same CV. Had 5 interviews and eventually offered a post. Some of the ones I didn’t get an interview for were seen by the same LOM where I did get an interview, and finally was offered a post. So doesn’t matter how good your application is there may be someone better. You just need to keep at it.
 
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Llanigraham

Established Member
Joined
23 Mar 2013
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6,073
Location
Powys
From experience, and not on the railway, but sifting through a pile of CV's rejection can be as simple as several spelling mistakes or answering a question that doesn't apply. You have to be ruthless sometimes.
 

Woody27

Member
Joined
10 Apr 2020
Messages
155
Location
Plymouth
I totally understand, that’s a lot of people to give feedback too! However, it would be good to know how well ones done on the shl tests, knowing which one, or ones!! You have failed.
 

LOM

Member
Joined
26 Dec 2019
Messages
405
Location
Been and gone.
I totally understand, that’s a lot of people to give feedback too! However, it would be good to know how well ones done on the shl tests, knowing which one, or ones!! You have failed.
Unfortunately the LOM does not get to know anything about the SHL test scores. They are handled by the Recruitment team.
 

Wanderer84

Member
Joined
8 Apr 2017
Messages
32
Location
Fareham
I'm in a position where I'm able to relocate (without too much trouble), to anywhere in the country for the role (and my application history shows it).

I've had a few interviews, but they've mostly been up north (I'm from near portsmouth/southampton area). But every application for Haslemere, Basingstoke, Wokingham, Feltham, 3 bridges, etc are all knocked back.

I'm assuming that the southern area is particularly popular.
 

danners430

Member
Joined
2 Dec 2016
Messages
75
Location
Caledonia
A question if I may - I'm moving house in a few weeks... Not very far, and it doesn't affect my distance to any of the roles I've applied for as such. Should I just email recruitment and tell them that my address has changed, and use the new address on any future applications?
 

Mi&Li

Member
Joined
19 Dec 2019
Messages
87
Location
UK
A question if I may - I'm moving house in a few weeks... Not very far, and it doesn't affect my distance to any of the roles I've applied for as such. Should I just email recruitment and tell them that my address has changed, and use the new address on any future applications?
Someone may correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m fairly certain you just change your details on the portal. I did it with a phone number and have had no issues with being contacted, including already existing applications.
 
Joined
1 Mar 2018
Messages
988
I was not sure whether to post this or not but here goes... One thing I wanted to mention on this thread is about feedback for unsuccessful applications. In the last couple of weeks I have had lots of requests passed on to me by the Recruitment team from unsuccessful candidates who have been sifted out, looking for feedback on why they had not been selected for an interview for jobs that closed recently. As hiring managers we are obliged to provide feedback if requested after an unsuccessful interview but before the interview stage it is entirely at our discretion whether we give it or not.

I do not mind doing it on the odd occasion but when lots of candidates are all asking it would actually take a fair chunk of my day to fish out and go through the whole application and CV to write up meaningful feedback for Recruitment to pass on. Frankly I do not have the time to do this for multiple applications and I know most other LOMs are in the same boat.

All I would say is that when lots of people apply for a job (and thanks to Corona I am now seeing 120+ applications for one grade 2 post) we all have to be absolutely ruthless when sifting. If you ask Recruitment for feedback on an application that is terminated before the interview stage do not be surprised if you do not hear anything back from the hiring manager.

I hope this post does not sound too negative. Trying to knock 124 candidates down to just 6 is really hard. Just because you have not made the shortlist for an interview does not mean your application is no good!

I'm really surprised that you have to give feedback from applications given the number you are likely to receive. Interviews yes, applications no. As Tom says the vast majority of companies wouldn't bother and to be fair its unrealistic to expect it.
 

LOM

Member
Joined
26 Dec 2019
Messages
405
Location
Been and gone.
I'm really surprised that you have to give feedback from applications given the number you are likely to receive. Interviews yes, applications no. As Tom says the vast majority of companies wouldn't bother and to be fair its unrealistic to expect it.
We only *have* to give feedback after interviews if requested but Recruitment will still pass on requests for earlier stages too. I only posted because for some reason I have had loads of requests in the last couple of weeks - normally I might see 1 per vacancy rather than the 6 I have had so far - I thought it would be worth an explanation here why a reply might not be forthcoming. I suspect there are some people on here who have applied for my jobs (which is also why I do not reply to some questions here in case anyone was thinking I am ignoring them).
 
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High Dyke

Established Member
Joined
1 Jan 2013
Messages
4,267
Location
Yellabelly Country
Oh yes, 100% agree with you both, the only way to guarantee not getting the job is not to apply. It’s more that I think I’d prefer to start off as a signaller and perhaps move into that later on in my career.
Keep plugging away. Sadly, just had four new jobs in the Lincoln area taken back off the vacancy list - now to be considered as part of a wider re-org of staff in that area.
 

MUSTANG2428

New Member
Joined
13 Jun 2020
Messages
2
Location
Derbyshire
Hi guys, completely new to this so forgive my ignorance. I’m really interested in getting into a career on the railway and currently being furloughed has only given me the time to start to investigate further. The dream role would be as a driver but after reading some of these threads I like the sound of a career in signalling. I currently work as a research specialist in the field of autonomous and connected vehicles/advanced driver assistance systems. Basically I have 2 questions:

1. Is looking at a career in signalling a wise move at the age of 25?

2. Would a role in signalling help me if I wanted to apply as trainee driver in the future?

Any high level insight into the role would be great and very much appreciated. Thanks.
 

Allaboard78

Member
Joined
16 Dec 2019
Messages
164
Location
Wales
Tom Quinn would you mind sharing maybe two weeks worth if your relief roster? Why do relief do so many night shifts?
 

LOM

Member
Joined
26 Dec 2019
Messages
405
Location
Been and gone.
Hi guys, completely new to this so forgive my ignorance. I’m really interested in getting into a career on the railway and currently being furloughed has only given me the time to start to investigate further. The dream role would be as a driver but after reading some of these threads I like the sound of a career in signalling. I currently work as a research specialist in the field of autonomous and connected vehicles/advanced driver assistance systems. Basically I have 2 questions:

1. Is looking at a career in signalling a wise move at the age of 25?

2. Would a role in signalling help me if I wanted to apply as trainee driver in the future?

Any high level insight into the role would be great and very much appreciated. Thanks.
1. Yes, centralisation is an ongoing thing in railway signalling but there will always be a need for someone to control the network.

2. It would to a limited extent but I would not advise taking a signalling job as a stepping stone to something else. Signalling is a career path in its own right and is completely different from driving. If you want to be a driver then apply for driver jobs.
 
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nom de guerre

Member
Joined
24 Nov 2015
Messages
774
Im going the other way, I’m fed up of the not knowing and messing about as a single location relief on only 4%.

I’ve just gone on the relief for the first time. There are some nice opportunities opening up on my route due to extra ‘ORR’ recruitment. Gift horse, and all that...
 

MUSTANG2428

New Member
Joined
13 Jun 2020
Messages
2
Location
Derbyshire
1. Yes, centralisation is an ongoing thing in railway signalling but there will always be a need for someone to control the network.

2. It would to a limited extent but I would not advise taking a signalling job as a stepping stone to something else. Signalling is a career path in its own right and is completely different from driving. If you want to be a driver then apply for driver jobs.

ok great. Just going to have to wait for signalling opportunities to arrive around the Derbyshire area.
 

LL1

New Member
Joined
11 Jun 2020
Messages
3
Location
St.Neots
Inner London is £3270/yr. Not sure what Outer London is at present (was just over £2K/yr when I last checked).

You’d also get an operational supplement in addition to either Inner or Outer, which is worth £1260/yr.
Thank you for that, much appreciated.
 

Kraken

Member
Joined
22 Mar 2020
Messages
247
Location
Lincolnshire
Keep plugging away. Sadly, just had four new jobs in the Lincoln area taken back off the vacancy list - now to be considered as part of a wider re-org of staff in that area.

Ooh that’s a shame. I’ve got quite a few applications in at the moment though so no shortage of opportunities round me.
 

Thebullet

Member
Joined
23 Apr 2020
Messages
24
Location
North West
I was not sure whether to post this or not but here goes... One thing I wanted to mention on this thread is about feedback for unsuccessful applications. In the last couple of weeks I have had lots of requests passed on to me by the Recruitment team from unsuccessful candidates who have been sifted out, looking for feedback on why they had not been selected for an interview for jobs that closed recently. As hiring managers we are obliged to provide feedback if requested after an unsuccessful interview but before the interview stage it is entirely at our discretion whether we give it or not.

I do not mind doing it on the odd occasion but when lots of candidates are all asking it would actually take a fair chunk of my day to fish out and go through the whole application and CV to write up meaningful feedback for Recruitment to pass on. Frankly I do not have the time to do this for multiple applications and I know most other LOMs are in the same boat.

All I would say is that when lots of people apply for a job (and thanks to Corona I am now seeing 120+ applications for one grade 2 post) we all have to be absolutely ruthless when sifting. If you ask Recruitment for feedback on an application that is terminated before the interview stage do not be surprised if you do not hear anything back from the hiring manager.

I hope this post does not sound too negative. Trying to knock 124 candidates down to just 6 is really hard. Just because you have not made the shortlist for an interview does not mean your application is no good!

120+ applications for one post must be time consuming to sift all of them.
How many applications were you seeing for a grade 2 post pre covid on average?

Also how many positions would you say have gone external in the last year that you have posted yourself?
 

LOM

Member
Joined
26 Dec 2019
Messages
405
Location
Been and gone.
120+ applications for one post must be time consuming to sift all of them.
How many applications were you seeing for a grade 2 post pre covid on average?

Also how many positions would you say have gone external in the last year that you have posted yourself?
Usually getting around 30 applicants for a grade 2 on the external list, and perhaps only around 25 of them would pass the SHL tests. From memory I have had 6 on the external list in the last 12ish months.
 

Thebullet

Member
Joined
23 Apr 2020
Messages
24
Location
North West
Usually getting around 30 applicants for a grade 2 on the external list, and perhaps only around 25 of them would pass the SHL tests. From memory I have had 6 on the external list in the last 12ish months.

Not surprised if LinkedIn is anything to go by, the amount of posts relating to redundancies is huge.

If after the interview stage you have a number of candidates on par with each other how do you choose between them or is it highly unlikely to happen?

In this current climate I guess there will be candidates from a broad spectrum of industries applying hard to tell if they have a keen interest in the job itself or just looking for a stopgap for a while.
 

LOM

Member
Joined
26 Dec 2019
Messages
405
Location
Been and gone.
If after the interview stage you have a number of candidates on par with each other how do you choose between them or is it highly unlikely to happen?

There is a tie-breaker for the interview scoring if two or more candidates get identical scores for their answers.

In this current climate I guess there will be candidates from a broad spectrum of industries applying hard to tell if they have a keen interest in the job itself or just looking for a stopgap for a while.

Definitely but for some types of people its pretty clear that they are not applying because they desperately want to be a signaller. One of my colleagues in another area had an ex FlyBe captain apply for a grade 1 post - I doubt he would stick around if the chance of another airline job came up!
 
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Mi&Li

Member
Joined
19 Dec 2019
Messages
87
Location
UK
There is a tie-breaker for the interview scoring if two or more candidates get identical scores for their answers.

Interesting to hear, is this asked retrospectively? Or something you look for in their previous answers that isn’t usually scored?
 

Tom Quinne

On Moderation
Joined
8 Jul 2017
Messages
2,225
Hi guys, completely new to this so forgive my ignorance. I’m really interested in getting into a career on the railway and currently being furloughed has only given me the time to start to investigate further. The dream role would be as a driver but after reading some of these threads I like the sound of a career in signalling. I currently work as a research specialist in the field of autonomous and connected vehicles/advanced driver assistance systems. Basically I have 2 questions:

1. Is looking at a career in signalling a wise move at the age of 25?

2. Would a role in signalling help me if I wanted to apply as trainee driver in the future?

Any high level insight into the role would be great and very much appreciated. Thanks.

I was about to give you a reply of 25 is ideal to apply for the job, but then read question 2....way to Alienate yourself (with respect).
 

Tom Quinne

On Moderation
Joined
8 Jul 2017
Messages
2,225
Tom Quinn would you mind sharing maybe two weeks worth if your relief roster? Why do relief do so many night shifts?

Last week:
Sunday OFF
Mon Days RDW
Tues Days RDW
Weds Days RDW
Thurs Days Booked
Fri Days Booked
Sat Days Booked

This week:
Sun recover from days last week !
Mon Nights RDW
Tues Nights Booked
Weds Nights Booked
Thurs Nights Booked
Fri RD
Sat Nights RDW

Next Next Week:
Sun RD
Mon RD
Tues RD
Weds RD
Thurs Booked Turn it’ll be a surprise what I get.
Fri Booked Turn it’ll be a surprise what I get.
Sat Booked Turn it’ll be a surprise what I get.

In the last 8 weeks, I’ve had 7 of nights so last week was a real shock to my system.
 

Tom Quinne

On Moderation
Joined
8 Jul 2017
Messages
2,225
Signallers and Drivers are like cats and dogs, we love each other really but to ask on a signaller thread if it’s a stepping stone to driving is like appointing a fox to caretake chickens.
 

LOM

Member
Joined
26 Dec 2019
Messages
405
Location
Been and gone.
Sticking with aviation, I think people would not generally view becoming an air traffic controller as a step towards becoming an airline pilot so I am not sure why anyone would suppose applying for a job as a signaller would get them any closer to becoming a train driver.

No point applying for a job you do not want when you can just apply for the job you do want!
 
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A14Ash

Member
Joined
6 Jun 2020
Messages
6
Location
Ca144ez
Hi everyone.


New to the forum, been reading back to gain some insights. I've applied for a local grade 3 position in Workington, Cumbria.
Passed the application and assessments, got an interview on the 29th June. Any information on the box I'd be working at such as shift patterns, etc if I was successful. Also does anyone know if there is opportunity for progession to higher grades in West Cumbria?
Any help would be greatly appreciated

Regards
 

Tom Quinne

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8 Jul 2017
Messages
2,225
Sticking with aviation, I think people would not generally view becoming an air traffic controller as a step towards becoming an airline pilot so I am not sure why anyone would suppose applying for a job as a signaller would get them any closer to becoming a train driver.

No point applying for a job you do not want when you can just apply for the job you do want!

Exactly, you‘d tick a lot of the competency boxes evidence wise if you went signaller fo driver obviously. But why waste years as a signaller when you can simply apply for driving in the first place?

Anyway, we all know who the real hero’s are on the railway don’t we.....;)
 

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