Do restrictions apply on the use of public transport in Wales? Are leisure journeys allowed or not?

[AdamWW]

Drakeford's words, not mine.

Stagecoach are changing their rules from Monday. In particular, capacity will increase from less than 25% to nearly 50% of seats.

OK that's good news.

They say it's following new guidance from the Welsh Government.

So maybe TFW Rail will be able to increase capacity at some point too.

Interesting they've chosen to pass on much of the government guidance but not the one that drivers should wait for would-be passengers so that they don't have to run for the bus.

 

[AdamWW]

I see they've gone for the Welsh full list! No newspapers, singing, talking. And, worst of all, no touching litter!

No...they left out the one that bus drivers have to wait so nobody has to run for a bus!

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Thought the rule on Monday was public transport not in shops? Thought Wales hadn't yet announced anything about facemasks in shops? I'm prepared to be corrected on that one.

Well I believe it's mandatory on public transport and recommended in shops from 27th in Wales.
Happy to be corrected of course.
It's difficult to be precise when you get an earful of rule changes all the time without specifying geography.
I cross the border most days too, and part of the family works in England.

 

[Dai Corner]

Here's a Tweet from Newport Transport. On their buses you can only sit in the window seats, but you can read the paper apparently!

https://twitter.com/newportbus/status/1286693662798356482?s=21

 

[AdamWW]

Here's a Tweet from Newport Transport. On their buses you can only sit in the window seats, but you can read the paper apparently!

https://twitter.com/newportbus/status/1286693662798356482?s=21

Very good news that they're increasing capacity too (for people in Newport, anyway).

Interesting phrasing though: Buses won't accept passengers once the "maximum advisory capacity" has been reached. And I see they've also passed on the long list of advice, like the need to travel in "relative silence".

So on Newport Bus you all look out of the window, but if you're on a Stagecoach service half the passengers have to sit in aisle seats. Shame there couldn't have been a little more co-ordination.

 

[Mag_seven]

Buses won't accept passengers once the "maximum advisory capacity" has been reached.

So we are back to leaving passengers behind at bus stops. Might be OK during the summer good weather but come autumn / winter.......

 

[AdamWW]

So we are back to leaving passengers behind at bus stops. Might be OK during the summer good weather but come autumn / winter.......

One step at a time...

It does mean that a bus conveniently filled entirely with families of 4 would have near to the normal seating capacity, now.

 

[anthony263]

Adventure travel increasing services again and starting a new commercial crosscity service in Cardiff from 7th September.

The X1 crosscity service is goung back to its pre lockdown timetable of a 20 minutely frequency mon-sat and every 30 minutes evenings and all day Sundays from 2nd august

 

[yorkie]

Shame we can't be consistent with the actually being allowed to use a train thing.

You are allowed to; it's just that TfW don't want you to (regardless of whether you are in England or Wales!) while GWR are happy for you to travel with them.

 

[anthony263]

You are allowed to; it's just that TfW don't want you to (regardless of whether you are in England or Wales!) while GWR are happy for you to travel with them.

And its backfiring on tfw as ive noticed more people using the buses even those who haven't used the buses before due to them being fed up with train services

 

[trainophile]

Well Newport station is going to see a lot of me whether they like it or not as I gave the Travelodge offer a good bashing! Being based in Hereford there’s not much option for visiting the south west. I know theoretically you can go almost anywhere via Birmingham or London but it’s not very logical and costs a lot more.

Mentioning GWR, it amused me to note that the guard passed through after every station, but checking face coverings - never had a ticket check at all!

 

[talldave]

Here's a Tweet from Newport Transport. On their buses you can only sit in the window seats, but you can read the paper apparently!

https://twitter.com/newportbus/status/1286693662798356482?s=21

But what if that paper is someone else's litter ?

 

[anthony263]

You can't read the newspaper and use your mobile if your on my bus. I just think drakegord and Co are a bunch of idiots

 

[yorkie]

TfW have finally, quietly dropped misleading people with their "essential travel only" message as of today.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You can't read the newspaper and use your mobile if your on my bus. I just think drakegord and Co are a bunch of idiots

The newspaper thing is bizarre. It would make sense not to have shared newspapers (i.e. free ones) stacked up on the bus, but beyond that it's silly. A copy of the Torygraph opened out fully would do a good job of shielding anyone around the reader from their droplets! (Though I doubt the Torygraph is a common bus read!)

TfW have finally, quietly dropped misleading people with their "essential travel only" message as of today.

Thank goodness for that. I might (if I can put up with the mask) celebrate with a train ride to Wales.

 

[Dai Corner]

TfW have finally, quietly dropped misleading people with their "essential travel only" message as of today.

Have they? Maybe in England but at the time of writing their website states 'In Wales our trains are for essential travel'.

 

[yorkie]

I would assume that's going to be removed on Monday; it looks to be a gradual removal of the messaging, which is of course a confusing situation.

They have not tweeted the word so far "essential" today, which is highly unusual, and their message now appears to be:

https://twitter.com/tfwrail/status/1286730367777398784

Travel Safer
Wear a face covering

And then there's this:

https://twitter.com/MrChrisLent/status/1286674107757662210

@tfwrail Hi, can you please tell me when you stopped your ‘essential travel’ only policy? Thanks

So they could have denied having dropped it, but they didn't; their response was:

Hi Chris, if you're travelling in Wales you should still follow the Travel Safer guidance - https://tfwrail.wales/covid-19 ^Anna

It reminds me of Northern at the end of June / early July, when they reluctantly, and very slowly, quietly dropped their "essential" travel messaging (despite the Government dropping it many weeks earlier).

Edit: it seems they have gone from saying "essential journeys only" to "essential journeys or where it is your only option":

https://twitter.com/tfwrail/status/1286984846477320199

The latest guidance from Welsh govt is that people can travel but should only do so for essential journeys or if it’s their only option to travel. If you would like to query this or discuss in more detail you can email [email protected] ^Liv

So that's a vast improvement, though it's still not what I would consider acceptable.

I have low expectations of companies like TfW; this attitude is consistent with my expectations for a company with their reputation, ethos and mindset, so I am not at all surprised at their behaviour.

 

[Dai Corner]

Exploring the website further I find

FAQs | Transport for Wales

Can I use public transport? You can, there are no restrictions on travel in the UK, but the Welsh Government is asking everyone to think carefully about:

trc.cymru

Including

Can I use public transport?
You can, but you should only do so for essential journeys or if it’s your only option to travel. We’re still running reduced services and want to offer people with no alternative means of transport the possibility to travel as safely as possible.

Please help by only making essential journeys on public transport.

 

[AdamWW]

You are allowed to; it's just that TfW don't want you to (regardless of whether you are in England or Wales!) while GWR are happy for you to travel with them.

True. It's not illegal. But it is (or, last time I looked, was) against government advice and based on that TFW Rail have been threatening that people may be questioned as to their purpose for travel and be potentially refused boarding.

 

[AdamWW]

Exploring the website further I find

FAQs | Transport for Wales

Can I use public transport? You can, there are no restrictions on travel in the UK, but the Welsh Government is asking everyone to think carefully about:

trc.cymru

Including

OK that's very good news.

I presume in due course TFW Rail will change the instructions on their web site.

And maybe even the Welsh Government web pages.

I wonder if they're also going to increase seating capacity so people can use each row, as on buses.

 

[Dai Corner]

OK that's very good news.

I presume in due course TFW Rail will change the instructions on their web site.

And maybe even the Welsh Government web pages.

I wonder if they're also going to increase seating capacity so people can use each row, as on buses.

Oops! I didn't notice that the website I quoted from was Transport for Wales, not TfW Rail.

 

[AdamWW]

Oops! I didn't notice that the website I quoted from was Transport for Wales, not TfW Rail.

And actually, if you go to the TFW (not TFW Rail) home page they make it very clear that all public transport is only for essential journeys where you have no other option.

Then right at the bottom. " Read our FAQs to find out more about what we’re doing to make sure essential journeys on public transport in Wales is as safe as possible " (my bold)

Then - as you pointed out earlier, the FAQ says: "Can I use public transport? You can, but you should only do so for essential journeys or if it’s your only option to travel. "

I wonder if the messaging is supposed to change on Monday, but this got updated too early?

It also says that at present they are unable to increase service frequencies - " We must factor in the safety and availability of public transport staff, as well as the availability of actual buses and trains. "

I understand problems with staff availability (a little less clear to me how fewer services increases safety for staff). bit I'm surprised that there are no longer enough vehicles to run a full timetable - or does enhanced cleaning mean that availability is much reduced? I haven't come across this being a limiting factor in England.

 

[anthony263]

last night I drove the last trip 9n the 130 service from Blaencwm to Porth which has been dead since lockdown began but im eased to report i picked up 7 people in Treorchy going to Tonypandy who were very happy to see the bus plus they brought their face masks with them which they put on while they were on the bus

 

[AdamWW]

last night I drove the last trip 9n the 130 service from Blaencwm to Porth which has been dead since lockdown began but im eased to report i picked up 7 people in Treorchy going to Tonypandy who were very happy to see the bus plus they brought their face masks with them which they put on while they were on the bus

Disappointingly, while the bus companies I looked at seem to have dropped their "Stay away" messages, the TFW Rail and TFW web sites are both stridently telling people to keep away from public transport, even though the TFW (not TFW Rail) FAQ then says that non-essential trips can be made on public transport if you really have no choice, even if it's something as frivolous as meeting up with family or having a day out over the summer holidays.

 

[trainophile]

Still a complete lack of Advance tickets for TfW priced routes. Taxing my ingenuity (and Trainsplit’s) to find affordable ways to get where I want to go.

 

[AdamWW]

Just had a nice email from TFW Rail letting me know that I need to wear a face covering on their trains now.

And, while they were there, they wanted to remind me: "in Wales only travel if it’s essential, to help those with no other option, and don’t travel if you’re feeling unwell "

I'm not quite sure what the middle bit means, but it's pretty clear from that they still don't want you on their trains if you just fancy a day out or to see family. (Other opinions may be available on Twitter).

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

TfW Rail web site is still shouting "Essential Travel Only" for me.

The only change to Welsh rail travel today has been the order to wear a face covering.

 

[AdamWW]

TfW Rail web site is still shouting "Essential Travel Only" for me.

The only change to Welsh rail travel today has been the order to wear a face covering.

Sadly, yes.

Likewise the government guidance doesn't seem to have changed.

Though the bus companies I've looked at are no longer making a big point on their home page about not using their services.

And it's curious that the TFW (not TFW Rail) web site has some less restrictive wording tucked away in their FAQ.

 

[Dai Corner]

TfW Rail Services (as opposed to Transport for Wales) have now admitted on Twitter that travel on their services is permitted if it's the 'only option'. Twitter thread

Twitter

You should only travel by train within Wales for essential journeys or if it’s your only option to travel. We recommend following the Travel Safer guidelines which can be found in the link ^Anna

 

[AdamWW]

TfW Rail Services (as opposed to Transport for Wales) have now admitted on Twitter that travel on their services is permitted if it's the 'only option'. Twitter thread

Twitter

Am I missing something?

What I saw from that link was TFW Rail saying their services could be used in England for non-essential travel. Which is something I suppose.