A career as a signaller

[Tom Quinne]

Slightly surprised to see some of the wage figures being bandied about. I work a Grade 7 box and come nowhere near earning £80k p.a.- and I do a decent wedge of o/t.

G7, my YTD is just over 80.

I've had most of December off as well with AL + CLs to use, so only came in for rest day working, basically

At the moment there’s very very little overtime, but I live within my basic pay, unlike a lot of my colleagues who are really really struggling with car finance etc.

 

[bouff34]

Slightly surprised to see some of the wage figures being bandied about. I work a Grade 7 box and come nowhere near earning £80k p.a.- and I do a decent wedge of o/t.

Yeh, I agree... not sure it helps to attract those that are genuinely interested in the job when they see these figures.

I work a G5 with Outer allowance on 8hr shifts plus 12hr Sundays, take overtime when offered but not at the expense of a life outside... I gross low £50k's in an average year...

I would also be concerned that consistently working 6x12hrs every week is a sure way to become fatigued. Any sort of incident that needs investigating and you can guarantee that RAIB will be looking at the hours that have been worked by the signaller in the lead up to it...

 

[SignallerJohn]

Yeh, I agree... not sure it helps to attract those that are genuinely interested in the job when they see these figures.

I work a G5 with Outer allowance on 8hr shifts plus 12hr Sundays, take overtime when offered but not at the expense of a life outside... I gross low £50k's in an average year...

I would also be concerned that consistently working 6x12hrs every week is a sure way to become fatigued. Any sort of incident that needs investigating and you can guarantee that RAIB will be looking at the hours that have been worked by the signaller in the lead up to it...

I think fatigue is only an issue if you’re not managing your free time effectively. Us on 12h rosters know the day is pretty much written off and when you finish you’re probably going straight to bed on either rotation.

But agreed some of these figures are mad. I would recommend nobody to rely on overtime to sustain your livelihood!

 

[nom de guerre]

I would also be concerned that consistently working 6x12hrs every week is a sure way to become fatigued. Any sort of incident that needs investigating and you can guarantee that RAIB will be looking at the hours that have been worked by the signaller in the lead up to it...

It's a valid concern. Hence the incoming max 60hr working week - yes, there'll still be exemptions for 'exceptional circumstances' or whatever, but the days of routinely working 6 x 12 will soon be gone.

G7, my YTD is just over 80.

At the moment there’s very very little overtime, but I live within my basic pay, unlike a lot of my colleagues who are really really struggling with car finance etc.

Never topped 70 as a 7, but then I hardly did any OT. You must be doing a fair bit of RDW to reach 80+.

Has your route been recruiting lots of extra bodies in preparation for the max 60hr working week? We have, and there's historically low levels of OT as a result. Most of the boxes in my area are now either fully-staffed, or have enough trainees to provide full staffing once Covid allows them to finish training.

It's good you aren't reliant on OT 'cos I fear those who do are in for a rude awakening over the next year or so.

I think fatigue is only an issue if you’re not managing your free time effectively. Us on 12h rosters know the day is pretty much written off and when you finish you’re probably going straight to bed on either rotation.

But agreed some of these figures are mad. I would recommend nobody to rely on overtime to sustain your livelihood!

Hear you re 12s but even if you manage a decent night's kip, working 6 x 12 week after week can't fail but wear you down after a while. One of my former colleagues working this kind of schedule had several incidents at work, nearly crashed his car a couple of times (1hr commute each way) and ended up needing time off for health reasons (although the latter may have happened regardless).

Punishing.

 

[Tom Quinne]

It's a valid concern. Hence the incoming max 60hr working week - yes, there'll still be exemptions for 'exceptional circumstances' or whatever, but the days of routinely working 6 x 12 will soon be gone.



Never topped 70 as a 7, but then I hardly did any OT. You must be doing a fair bit of RDW to reach 80+.

Has your route been recruiting lots of extra bodies in preparation for the max 60hr working week? We have, and there's historically low levels of OT as a result. Most of the boxes in my area are now either fully-staffed, or have enough trainees to provide full staffing once Covid allows them to finish training.

It's good you aren't reliant on OT 'cos I fear those who do are in for a rude awakening over the next year or so.



Hear you re 12s but even if you manage a decent night's kip, working 6 x 12 week after week can't fail but wear you down after a while. One of my former colleagues working this kind of schedule had several incidents at work, nearly crashed his car a couple of times (1hr commute each way) and ended up needing time off for health reasons (although the latter may have happened regardless).

Punishing.

I don’t really do that much overtime to be honest, well it doesn’t seem it anyway.

We’ve had a steady stream of new guys arrive since October, but they’ve been populating the grade 4 & 5 link. Our link hasn’t seen a fresh bodies other than those coming across from the historic recruitment internally from about 18 months ago.

My link is 95% still from the former panel box, with I’d say a good 5-10 who are approaching the point where their looking at retiring in the next 24 months.

At the moment there’s little overtime on offer to me and others as we operate the infamous “tick list” so those who work throughout the year effectively get barred from overtime from Jan to Apr as our counts (number of overtime days worked) is high compared to those fair weather people who only do overtime when it suits.

 

[Tom Quinne]

It's a valid concern. Hence the incoming max 60hr working week - yes, there'll still be exemptions for 'exceptional circumstances' or whatever, but the days of routinely working 6 x 12 will soon be gone.



Never topped 70 as a 7, but then I hardly did any OT. You must be doing a fair bit of RDW to reach 80+.

Has your route been recruiting lots of extra bodies in preparation for the max 60hr working week? We have, and there's historically low levels of OT as a result. Most of the boxes in my area are now either fully-staffed, or have enough trainees to provide full staffing once Covid allows them to finish training.

It's good you aren't reliant on OT 'cos I fear those who do are in for a rude awakening over the next year or so.



Hear you re 12s but even if you manage a decent night's kip, working 6 x 12 week after week can't fail but wear you down after a while. One of my former colleagues working this kind of schedule had several incidents at work, nearly crashed his car a couple of times (1hr commute each way) and ended up needing time off for health reasons (although the latter may have happened regardless).

Punishing.

Regards fatigue, I wouldn’t say it’s the actual work that’s tiring it’s the people you have to work with an their drama that grinds you down.

Im sure you’ll know if you have a bad shift on it feels like a 18hr shift not 12!

An extremely rare external opportunity (well two) at Gloucester Panel, Grade 7.

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A little further West in Wales at Carmarthen Junction SB Grade 4.

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I think fatigue is only an issue if you’re not managing your free time effectively. Us on 12h rosters know the day is pretty much written off and when you finish you’re probably going straight to bed on either rotation.

But agreed some of these figures are mad. I would recommend nobody to rely on overtime to sustain your livelihood!

I agree with you, off nights I’m not up until circa 1500hrs and days I’m home, food, hour of tv if I can stay awake then bed. I do hate days with a passion though, I can easily do 6 nights with no issue, but after day 3 I’m the walking dead!

With regards to pay and attracting the “wrong sort” ie those who don’t care, we’ve enough of those who’ve been doing the job since BR. It’s nice to see the odd new body come in who is actually interested, but that is soon knocked out of them by the old boys who simply don’t care anymore, along with a fair number of younger blokes.

 

[Defenestrate]

Does anyone work at/have experience of Doncaster PSB or York ROC (specifically the King's Cross link(s))?
If so, would you be able to send me a PM, so I can ask some questions?
I've seen the jobs advertised internally only, so don't want to clog up the thread!
Thanks in advance!

 

[cogload]

I applied for a position at Gloucester years ago. Sadly I came 2nd in the applicant list - but the atmosphere in the box was lovely when I went for a visit.

Hello all,
Long time lurker, first time poster! After the decimation of the aviation industry, and getting made redundant from my training to be an Air Traffic Controller, I was looking for something with some transferable skills, and Signaller seemed perfect!

I just wanted to thank everyone that’s posted over the years, recently been successful in my application for G7 Signaller at Feltham. The help on this forum is invaluable!

I start IST at Basingstoke on the 22nd (is anyone else on it?)

Thanks!

There are lots of ex NATS types applying for jobs as signallers.

 

[Tom Quinne]

I applied for a position at Gloucester years ago. Sadly I came 2nd in the applicant list - but the atmosphere in the box was lovely when I went for a visit.



There are lots of ex NATS types applying for jobs as signallers.

There isn’t a lot left at Gloucester now, may even be single manned on nights.

Strange location, could well be pulled apart three ways if the place is ever reaignalled - TVSC, WMSC & SWCC all taking a chunk.
TVSC - Thames valley Signalling Centre - Didcot.
WMSC - West Midlands Signalling Centre - Birmingham.
SWCC - South Wales Signalling Centre - Cardiff.

Although that’s left is strictly in Western route area, but seeing as Western & Wales are in the same happy equally respected family who knows.

 

[cogload]

Oh yeah..another reason I would be very chary of advertising how much I earned on a forum like this is if a **** stirring paper decided to use the gen if there was a wholly theoretical chance of industrial action..

 

[ArkUTD]

An extremely rare external opportunity (well two) at Gloucester Panel, Grade 7

I've gone for this, even tho i live in the midlands, i've always been interested in the railway, good old model one's or ones on PC, spent so much time trying to get my timetables right, really enjoyed it. I hope i can join to do just a small part of a bigger network.

So i hope to give it a good go and see what happens. This Forum has been a super great insight to this world and i'm excited to try and get in!

 

[BigRob21]

I've gone for this, even tho i live in the midlands, i've always been interested in the railway, good old model one's or ones on PC, spent so much time trying to get my timetables right, really enjoyed it. I hope i can join to do just a small part of a bigger network.

So i hope to give it a good go and see what happens. This Forum has been a super great insight to this world and i'm excited to try and get in!

Best of luck buddy

 

[Rockhopper]

Don't mention your interest in railways at your interview if you get one. It may well work against you.

 

[ArkUTD]

Don't mention your interest in railways at your interview if you get one. It may well work against you.

Really? i would have thought it would be the other way round.

Care to give me a little insight into this?

 

[Rockhopper]

First and foremost they are looking for people who can display all the skills they demonstrate by answering the NTS questions and the NR safety vision. An interest in railways (other than knowing what TOC's or freight operators use the route you are applying for and anything interesting about that particular line) isn't really desirable.
There have been a few posts about this but they were some time ago now. They come up in a search on this part of the forum and its generally though to be a bad thing to mention it at interview.

 

[nom de guerre]

Oh yeah..another reason I would be very chary of advertising how much I earned on a forum like this is if a **** stirring paper decided to use the gen if there was a wholly theoretical chance of industrial action..

I don’t disagree, but the tabloids have other sources too. The Daily Heil does at least one knocking piece per pay talks and it’s always fairly stat-heavy. I suspect they submit a FOI request to NR.

 

[SWTurbo]

Hello All!

Just wondering if there is anyone that would be able to give some guidance/pointers for the Signaller Scenario Test? I've had a look on the forum and can't find any references to it thus far.

I'm applying for the Anglia Ops Apprentice role, which involves Signalling as a large chunk of the role.

any help relating to the tests or the apprenticeship in general would be much appreciated!

The scenario is york based so any tips/tricks for york stuff would be appreciated too!

 

[Tom Quinne]

I don’t disagree, but the tabloids have other sources too. The Daily Heil does at least one knocking piece per pay talks and it’s always fairly stat-heavy. I suspect they submit a FOI request to NR.

A “news” paper ran a story via a FOI request about NWR pay in general, 220 on over £120,000 or there about outside the top team.

Maybe a Freelance should run a story how much journalist earn each year, and their expenses !

 

[Littlestu]

Hey, id been applying for jobs local ish for a while with no joy. Over the last 6 months havent seen many advertised external for yorkshire area. Is this due to virus or have positions been taken or is it internal advertised?
Thanks

 

[Rockhopper]

There is a recruitment freeze on at the moment unless it’s to fill an essential post.

 

[nom de guerre]

Don't mention your interest in railways at your interview if you get one. It may well work against you.

It hasn’t done me any harm.

 

[Yorks1179]

Hey, id been applying for jobs local ish for a while with no joy. Over the last 6 months havent seen many advertised external for yorkshire area. Is this due to virus or have positions been taken or is it internal advertised?
Thanks

I’m based in West Yorks (had to look further afield for my post), and while there were a few Yorkshire posts advertised externally last year, a fairly significant number of signalling posts in Yorkshire are already at the York ROC, so more likely to be advertised internally.

There is a recruitment freeze on at the moment unless it’s to fill an essential post.

I don’t think the recruitment freeze is really affecting signalling as it’s an area that is operationally essential. While the number of advertised posts is variable, there is still recruitment going on. My LOM took a few of us on in Dec/Jan, and in my case it’s on a FTC in anticipation of future requirements (one or two posts probably coming along in the next few months).

 

[ChrisRS]

Don't mention your interest in railways at your interview if you get one. It may well work against you.

Who on earth told you that? If anything it will work in your favour as you'll take an interest in the job.

 

[Rockhopper]

like I said, it’s been mentioned multiple times in the past, including by at least one poster who actually does the interviewing.

 

[Horizon22]

A “news” paper ran a story via a FOI request about NWR pay in general, 220 on over £120,000 or there about outside the top team.

Maybe a Freelance should run a story how much journalist earn each year, and their expenses !

Always odd when they do this when its a company (not exclusive NR either) with 40,000+ individuals! Of course there will be some very high earners.

 

[olilee2]

Who on earth told you that? If anything it will work in your favour as you'll take an interest in the job.

Who on earth told you that? If anything it will work in your favour as you'll take an interest in the job.

I’m no expert on recruitment but I’d imagine it’s a question of tempering interest with enthusiasm. An interview is entirely about proving to a hiring manager that you’ve got the personal qualities to do the job well and work together with colleagues. If when asked why you want the job you simply reply with an ‘I love trains etc etc’ answer then depending on whose interviewing you it may be possible to fall foul of that line. In competency based interviews such as for signallers it’s all about demonstrating your skills and experience rather than simply passion for the job. I can’t deny that I was interested in railways before I started working on them. I started off as a platform dispatcher at clapham so in my signalling interview I was able to talk about how firstly I’d dipped my toe into the industry and found I enjoyed working in it, and also about how I was able to develop a genuine concern for the quality of service that uses of the railway received and how colleagues were treated (thereby helping to tick the conscientiousness NTS). Also I talked about how what I specifically found interesting about working on the railways was the impressive and complex logistics involved and how such a large system fitted together (teamwork NTS and one of the core functions as a signaller).

Also, I’m not saying this is a rule but from the people I’ve met and what I’ve seen, I don’t get the impression that ‘train spotters’ are exactly fashionable among those in the industry in part due to (and I mean this in the politest possible way) some of the negative stereotypes attached to them. Being interested is certainly excellent but in terms of interviewing it will only count in your favour if you can use it it complement your skills and experience and show them how it will make you a good signaller from their point of view. Certainly when I was interviewing for the signalling job I have now I made sure to refer to my interest in the railways only in those professional terms

 

[Trainthetrain]

Would anyone recommend a secondment to Doncaster PSB for 12 months - Grade 9?

 

[nom de guerre]

like I said, it’s been mentioned multiple times in the past, including by at least one poster who actually does the interviewing.

Obviously the parts of your interview that will actually determine the outcome - NTS/safety etc - need to be on point, but providing they are, a judicious mention of an interest in railways isn’t damaging. I’m living proof!

Also, I’m not saying this is a rule but from the people I’ve met and what I’ve seen, I don’t get the impression that ‘train spotters’ are exactly fashionable among those in the industry in part due to (and I mean this in the politest possible way) some of the negative stereotypes attached to them. Being interested is certainly excellent but in terms of interviewing it will only count in your favour if you can use it it complement your skills and experience and show them how it will make you a good signaller from their point of view. Certainly when I was interviewing for the signalling job I have now I made sure to refer to my interest in the railways only in those professional terms

I don’t disagree with the above. All I would add is that having an interest in railways doesn’t necessarily mean you’re a trainspotter.

 

[Tom Quinne]

Would anyone recommend a secondment to Doncaster PSB for 12 months - Grade 9?

Yes, I assume your internal and already a bobby?
All good experience for later in your career as well, you might be lucky that you can keep it in your ticket once the placement finished as well.

 

[Tom Quinne]

Obviously the parts of your interview that will actually determine the outcome - NTS/safety etc - need to be on point, but providing they are, a judicious mention of an interest in railways isn’t damaging. I’m living proof!



I don’t disagree with the above. All I would add is that having an interest in railways doesn’t necessarily mean you’re a trainspotter.

Ive an interest in the railway, and a model railway but once Ive book off that’s it no taking numbers or pictures.