Train horns and train prep?

[GB]

Ive had a quick look through the rule book but may of missed it, but is testing the horn of a multiple unit part of the train prep and are there any rules pertaining to the use of horns in depots during the night/early morning?

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Ive had a quick look through the rule book but may of missed it, but is testing the horn of a multiple unit part of the train prep and are there any rules pertaining to the use of horns in depots during the night/early morning?

I hear them testing them on Stockport Carriage Sidings at 4am so I don't think so (I maybe wrong tho)

 

[142094]

I've seen (well heard) them tested during the first start up of the day, but not usually after that. Plus in some cases you can't use the horn between certain times.

 

[pendolino]

TW5 says:

37.1 Entering service from a maintenance depot

You must not allow a train or traction unit to enter service from a maintenance depot if you are aware the warning horn is defective in any cab which needs to be used.

37.2 Entering service from somewhere other than a maintenance depot

A train or traction unit can enter service from somewhere other than a maintenance depot if the warning horn is partially defective (for example, one tone not working) in a cab which needs to be used.

So I suppose technically, yes, the horn must be tested as part of a prep. Otherwise how can you tell if the train is entering service with a defective horn. Whether this happens in practice is another matter.

 

[Old Timer]

Ive had a quick look through the rule book but may of missed it, but is testing the horn of a multiple unit part of the train prep and are there any rules pertaining to the use of horns in depots during the night/early morning?

The restriction on the use of the horn at nights only applies to level crossings which exhibit a W sign, and then the ruling does not apply if is necessary to operate the horn as a means of giving a warning.

So, just simply passing the W sign does NOT require the horn to be operated, but if the Driver for example can see people or vehicles at the crossing and considers it necessary then he may operate the horn.

In the same way the Driver can (must) operate the horn normally when there is a need to, such as to warn people on or about the line, as part of the audible signal to a Signalman/ground frame operator, and when loading / unloading or starting a train.

It is perefectly permissible to operate a horn in a TMD as part of the train preperation but operating the horn in such a way as to cause a disturbance is not.

 

[Aictos]

I can't comment on other companies when when drivers come down to Hertford to prep a train stabled overnight, part of the duties do include a short blast on the horn.

Am I right in thinking that a speed restriction of 20mph applies to trains with a defective horn?

 

[scotsman]

I can't comment on other companies when when drivers come down to Hertford to prep a train stabled overnight, part of the duties do include a short blast on the horn.

Am I right in thinking that a speed restriction of 20mph applies to trains with a defective horn?

All I know is no tones = no train

 

[driver9000]

I can't comment on other companies when when drivers come down to Hertford to prep a train stabled overnight, part of the duties do include a short blast on the horn.

Am I right in thinking that a speed restriction of 20mph applies to trains with a defective horn?

Correct for a complete horn failure, if one tone fails the train can continue at linespeed. If the horn fails in service it is removed from traffic at the first available location, it cannot leave a depot with no working horns at a cab that will be required to be used.

 

[O L Leigh]

Yup. The horn must be sounded as part of the train prep and, as has already been pointed out, this is not covered by the "quiet hours" restrictions. The horn is a safety system and must work.

O L Leigh

 

[boing_uk]

Am I right in thinking that a speed restriction of 20mph applies to trains with a defective horn?

As a passenger I can vouch for that one. The train horn failed between Preston and Lostock Hall; was held at Bamber Bridge for about 10 minutes - presumably for the traincrew to call their control - (with barriers down as well, which I thought was a bit bad) and then proceeded to Blackburn at around 20mph, slowing at each crossing to walking pace.

The train was changed to a Manchester Victoria service at Blackburn, with the original Clitheroe - Vic service turning back to Colne.

 

[westcoaster]

We have local instructions covering train prep at cauldwell depot, the depot is a quiet depot between 2200 and 0700, so no testing of the horn during prep in the above times, as the depot is in a resudential area. But once out on the main line you can then have a blast if you so feel.

 

[Clip]

But what about trains that are stabled at a station overnight? Ive never heard them test this but im not sure if that counts.

 

[Aictos]

But what about trains that are stabled at a station overnight? Ive never heard them test this but im not sure if that counts.

Trains are sometimes stabled overnight at Hertford especially when there's engineering works on the Welwyn route and they certainly count as they get tested when the driver arrives in the morning to prep their set of units as it's usually a 6 car 313 that's left overnight although there has been times Hertford has been very lucky to host a 8 car 365 before!

 

[GB]

Thanks for the replys.

The reason I asked was becuase the other night there was a fair bit of two tone noise activity coming from the local carridge sidings (which is in a residential area) between midnight and 0300.

 

[route101]

Ive noticed in Queen St they sound the horn , but not 2 tone. Anyone know why?

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Ive noticed in Queen St they sound the horn , but not 2 tone. Anyone know why?

The horn has many tones, they are not separate

I would imagine that the driver only needs to ascertain that one tone is working - then he can travel at linespeed, and if there are no tones then he must travel at no more than 20mph.

 

[O L Leigh]

New Rules on the use of the horn at W boards. It's low/soft tone only now. However, you can still give it both tones if you see someone on or near the line.

O L Leigh

 

[Clip]

Trains are sometimes stabled overnight at Hertford especially when there's engineering works on the Welwyn route and they certainly count as they get tested when the driver arrives in the morning to prep their set of units as it's usually a 6 car 313 that's left overnight although there has been times Hertford has been very lucky to host a 8 car 365 before!

but at Kings Cross they didnt when i was working there so hence why i asked.. Unless it is something new...

 

[TDK]

but at Kings Cross they didnt when i was working there so hence why i asked.. Unless it is something new...

The horn MUST be tested on prep of any train no matter what the time, if it is not then the prepper is not abiding by the rule book

 

[ralphchadkirk]

The horn MUST be tested on prep of any train no matter what the time, if it is not then the prepper is not abiding by the rule book

Where does it say that in the rule book?

 

[TGV]

Says so in our book.

 

[Old Timer]

Where does it say that in the rule book?

It does not.

The train is prepared in accordance with the Driver's train preparations instructions/procedures which will ensure that the traction unit horns are working.

Rule Book Module TW5 Clauses 1.2 and 32 specify the action to be taken should one or more of the tones fail.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

It does not.

The train is prepared in accordance with the Driver's train preparations instructions/procedures which will ensure that the traction unit horns are working.

Rule Book Module TW5 Clauses 1.2 and 32 specify the action to be taken should one or more of the tones fail.

Ah thank you. I had looked but couldn't see it the rule book, hence why I asked. I did't realise the TOC would have their own prep procedures.

 

[Old Timer]

Ah thank you. I had looked but couldn't see it the rule book, hence why I asked. I did't realise the TOC would have their own prep procedures.

Yes, each TOC has a detailled set of Instructions relating to how the train is prepared, and this will include the need for checks/verification of safety critical systems, such as horns, etc.

Under the terms of the TOC Operating License, no train that has defective equipment may be allowed to enter service except as authorised in the Railway Rule Book and in accordance with the Defective On Train Equipment (DOTE) Contingency Plan.

 

[CarterUSM]

We call them "working instructions".

 

[depablo]

Craigentinny has noise restrictions due to local housing estate, maintenance staff cannot sound horns or carry out DEPT tests on Voyagers (Run engines at full throttle).