Trivia: National Rail platforms where doors can open on both sides

[liamf656]

I’ve looked for threads on this topic and I’m surprised to not find any! Looking at Finsbury Park online earlier there seems to be two platforms with one track running through it, giving the possibility that trains can stop and open its doors on both sides, although I’m unsure if it actually happens in practice as I’ve never visited.

I know it happens on Underground lines quite a bit but is there anywhere on the National network where doors actually open on both sides, or has done in the past?

 

[Ashley Hill]

Yeovil Pen Mill between platforms 1 and 2. However the doors are never opened for the platform 2 side and AFAIA that platform face has no advertised service.

 

[mmh]

I'm pretty sure it never happens on National Rail services. In times gone by there were places where it happened when unlocked slam door trains were used, for example Norwood Junction had much use of people knowing they could leave their slow line train to a fast line one by getting out on the wrong side. It was frowned upon by staff, but there was no way to stop it.

 

[Ashley Hill]

Indeed you had to keep your eyes open on both sides before dispatching on slam door stock.

 

[Railsigns]

I’ve looked for threads on this topic and I’m surprised to not find any!

Here's one:
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/trivia-stations-that-have-two-platforms-for-one-track.176856/

 

[liamf656]

Here's one:
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/trivia-stations-that-have-two-platforms-for-one-track.176856/

Quite a comprehensive list there - thank you

 

[swt_passenger]

It would be highly unusual to make any use of a double platform, because IIRC from earlier discussions having doors open both sides would be incompatible with safe dispatch procedures. In the earlier linked thread I asked if modern onboard systems would even allow both sides to be routinely opened, can a guard key in at two panels for instance? With DOO I doubt there’ll be cameras functional on both sides.

 

[geoffk]

Ulverston? Same procedure as at Yeovil PM I expect - boarding and alighting on one side. Away from National Rail, Horsted Keynes station has one track served by two platforms but not sure if you're allowed to board or alight on both sides.

 

[Hadders]

I’ve looked for threads on this topic and I’m surprised to not find any! Looking at Finsbury Park online earlier there seems to be two platforms with one track running through it, giving the possibility that trains can stop and open its doors on both sides, although I’m unsure if it actually happens in practice as I’ve never visited.

I know it happens on Underground lines quite a bit but is there anywhere on the National network where doors actually open on both sides, or has done in the past?

You’re correct about Finsbury Park having one track between two platforms but in reality platforms 3 and 6 are never used.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Ulverston? Same procedure as at Yeovil PM I expect - boarding and alighting on one side. Away from National Rail, Horsted Keynes station has one track served by two platforms but not sure if you're allowed to board or alight on both sides.

Might have happened back in the day to allow cross platform connections to the Lakeside branch before Beeching, but doubt that "Platform 2" at Ulverston (if indeed it's still so designated as such) has legitimately been used anytime recently.

 

[ashkeba]

It would be highly unusual to make any use of a double platform, because IIRC from earlier discussions having doors open both sides would be incompatible with safe dispatch procedures.

Surely not incompatible but slower, because one side would have to be despatched then the other? That may be reason enough not to do it much.

 

[Dave W]

You’re correct about Finsbury Park having one track between two platforms but in reality platforms 3 and 6 are never used.

I’ve made this point before but it’s within the decade I’ve been living in London that platform 1 and 2 were brought back into use, until such time platform 3 was very definitely used!

I find (anecdotally) that station calls seem to happen more often on the up fast (p4) than down fast (p5), so the 3-4 island sees more footfall than the 5-6 island, which I don’t think I’ve ever personally used. I must caveat I’d rarely head north on a fast train.

 

[175001]

Bay platform at Blackburn
Platform 7 at Sheffield

 

[Hadders]

I’ve made this point before but it’s within the decade I’ve been living in London that platform 1 and 2 were brought back into use, until such time platform 3 was very definitely used!

I find (anecdotally) that station calls seem to happen more often on the up fast (p4) than down fast (p5), so the 3-4 island sees more footfall than the 5-6 island, which I don’t think I’ve ever personally used. I must caveat I’d rarely head north on a fast train.

I also remember platforms 3 and 6 being used extensivey. What is now platforms 1 and 2 was an unsightly overgrown structure for many years.

 

[Forty29]

READING before it was redeveloped had two bay platforms either end of platforms 5and 8, namely platforms 7and 6 where you could alight either side. Haven't been since it was rebuilt but l guess this has changed. Do bay platforms count?

 

[Elecman]

Am I remembering correctly but I’m sure the bay at Derby had 2 platform faces in the 70’s?

 

[ValleyLines142]

Greenford heavy rail bay. Guessed that boarding would be opposite the eastbound Central Line platform and was right thankfully!

 

[swt_passenger]

READING before it was redeveloped had two bay platforms either end of platforms 5and 8, namely platforms 7and 6 where you could alight either side. Haven't been since it was rebuilt but l guess this has changed. Do bay platforms count?

At Reading they were both removed, P7 was removed quite early in the project, P6 remained in use for a while but renumbered temporarily as P16, a new P6 bay had opened on the Southern lines. But I think with Turbos and Voyagers only one side of doors was ever opened.

 

[ijmad]

Scarborough, Sheffield and Carlisle all have bays with platforms on both sides

Norwood Junction physically has a single line with P1 and P2 on either side but doors are only ever opened on the P1 side. Same with Finsbury Park, I think.

 

[bramling]

I’ve looked for threads on this topic and I’m surprised to not find any! Looking at Finsbury Park online earlier there seems to be two platforms with one track running through it, giving the possibility that trains can stop and open its doors on both sides, although I’m unsure if it actually happens in practice as I’ve never visited.

I know it happens on Underground lines quite a bit but is there anywhere on the National network where doors actually open on both sides, or has done in the past?

I have used Finsbury Park for several decades, and never once seen the doors opened both sides. On the down side the doors are always opened on the platform 7 side, whilst on the up side it is always platform 2. Indeed when the additional island was reinstated a few years ago, a point was made that the side was going to switch over, with platform 3 no longer used.

 

[roadierway77]

In theory it could happen at Edinburgh platform 18, but as far as I know this has never happened - the doors only open on the south side of the platform.

 

[bramling]

I’ve made this point before but it’s within the decade I’ve been living in London that platform 1 and 2 were brought back into use, until such time platform 3 was very definitely used!

I find (anecdotally) that station calls seem to happen more often on the up fast (p4) than down fast (p5), so the 3-4 island sees more footfall than the 5-6 island, which I don’t think I’ve ever personally used. I must caveat I’d rarely head north on a fast train.

Platform 5 has been used more frequently in some timetables over the years. In the current timetable there are a very small handful of services which stop there, mainly in the early morning. My train stopped there first thing this morning.

Regarding platform 4, at one point this was used by pretty much all up WAGN/FCC/GN services which approached London on the up fast. Crossing over to platform 2 was not scheduled and rarely done. Things changed when the new platform was built (presumably to make interchange to the Moorgate services easier), and now the vast majority of services cross to the up slow and use platform 2. There are some exceptions however, and this latest timetable has slightly increased the number of services which has platform 4. From what I gather, there has been a bit of fuss about last minute platform changes, so the signallers have been told to use the booked platforms as far as possible. This never used to be an issue, but two things have changed - firstly more people use Finsbury Park to travel south now there’s Thameslink destinations as well as just King’s Cross, and secondly crew reliefs occur.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Was at Ulverston earlier in the week, have to say that it doesn't look as if the platform edge (previously numbered as platform '2') on the island platform is currently ever used or indeed is being maintained.

 

[skyhigh]

Surely not incompatible but slower, because one side would have to be despatched then the other? That may be reason enough not to do it much.

It is very much incompatible with safe dispatch. Yes, you can close the doors on one side, check nobody is trapped and the platform/train interface is clear, then do the other side... but what if someone starts leaning on the first side of the train or attempting to board? You can't observe both sides at once before moving the train, so it's definitely less safe.

In the earlier linked thread I asked if modern onboard systems would even allow both sides to be routinely opened, can a guard key in at two panels for instance?

On all the units I signed as a guard you could release the doors on both sides (14x through to 195s). You can't key in at 2 panels but can release the doors at one side, key out then key in the other side to do it that way.

 

[Brooklands]

Platforms 6 & 7 at Guildford (7 is never used).
In ‘slam door’ days a stationary train could be used as a short cut from platform 6 to 7/8!!

 

[DelW]

It is very much incompatible with safe dispatch. Yes, you can close the doors on one side, check nobody is trapped and the platform/train interface is clear, then do the other side... but what if someone starts leaning on the first side of the train or attempting to board? You can't observe both sides at once before moving the train, so it's definitely less safe.

But surely that's the case even when the doors on the opposite side haven't been opened? For instance at Guildford as mentioned above, there's nothing to prevent someone on the platform 7/8 island leaning against a train about to depart from the track in 6/7, with the guard of course watching the platform 6 side where the doors had been open.

 

[Pete_uk]

Swindon platform 2?

 

[Ashley Hill]

Swindon platform 2?

No,the opposite face is not a platform and is fenced off from platform 1.

 

[mmh]

It is very much incompatible with safe dispatch. Yes, you can close the doors on one side, check nobody is trapped and the platform/train interface is clear, then do the other side... but what if someone starts leaning on the first side of the train or attempting to board? You can't observe both sides at once before moving the train, so it's definitely less safe.

Hmm, that doesn't fit I'm afraid. Once the doors are closed all bets are off. The guard (if there is one) can no longer see anything, and there are countless platforms where the driver is sat on the opposite side, numerous train types where they physically can't look out, platforms where their view is non existent anyway, and if they're moving forwards they need to be looking forwards.

 

[Pete_uk]

No,the opposite face is not a platform and is fenced off from platform 1.

Right ok, it's been a while!