Frequency of Checking Railcard Onboard Trains

[headshot119]

Split from this thread.

I'm not criticizing the OP, but I'm very surprised that someone would buy a Railcard-discounted ticket without a Railcard. Ticket checks are very frequent and you are always asked for your Railcard.

Furthermore, to get away with buying a Railcard-discounted ticket without holding a valid Railcard, you would have to rely on not having your ticket checked. If that's the case, why on earth buy a ticket in the first place - Railcard-discounted or not!?

I just find it quite amusing that someone who doesn't want to pay the full fare, and is relying on there not being a ticket check, still fancies paying 2/3 of the fare. I've never come across it before!

Don't quite I agree with the bit in red. I've had an Arriva guard rant when checking my advance tickets that I'll need to pay if I'm on the wrong train. Then not check my railcard.

I did nearly 1400 miles on a heart of England rover and had my railcard checked once over three days.

I did 1000 miles on a Freedom of the Southwest rover and had my railcard checked twice.

I went to London and back and got my railcard checked once and that was at the Euston barriers not on the train.

Need I go on?

 

[Mojo]

On the other hand, on on-train inspections, I have never not had my Railcard checked.

 

[All Line Rover]

Don't quite I agree with the bit in red. I've had an Arriva guard rant when checking my advance tickets that I'll need to pay if I'm on the wrong train. Then not check my railcard.

I did nearly 1400 miles on a heart of England rover and had my railcard checked once over three days.

I did 1000 miles on a Freedom of the Southwest rover and had my railcard checked twice.

I went to London and back and got my railcard checked once and that was at the Euston barriers not on the train.

Need I go on?

That's very, very surprising. How along ago was this? In all these years, not once has our Family Railcard not been checked. (Occasionally it's just been a quick glance - they may even not have checked the date - but it's always been asked for nonetheless.)

 

[Intermodal]

With regards to having my railcard checked - I have a DSB and have had one for a year and a half. It has been checked ONCE in all that time and I travel by train very frequently on a wide variety of services and operators. I quite often now make a point of not displaying my railcard immediately just to see if someone will ask for it - they never do!

 

[headshot119]

*snip* How along ago was this?)

That's all been since March this year when I bought the railcard.

 

[All Line Rover]

That's all been since March this year when I bought the railcard.

Amazing, I must say. (Although we do travel on InterCity services mainly.)

 

[headshot119]

Amazing, I must say. (Although we do travel on InterCity services mainly.)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


A Railcard discount makes sense if you buy a Railcard for the minute sum of £20(ish) quid!

Surprisingly it's a mix with what I've been checked on.

a 153 on the Matlock branch was the only occasion on the Heart of England. ( A rather overstaffed train as well with 7 staff for one carriage.)

A rather empty HST on the Paignton branch, and a jam packed 150 somewhere between Bristol and Taunton on the Freedome of the South west.

 

[Tomonthetrain]

I usually offer my ticket and YP railcard in a clear A5 wallet (along with plans, travel documents, reservations, any bus tickets/passes/oyster that happen to be in it) I find it's up to the train staff to check the card and some give it a good inspection, others just have a quick peek and a few don't bother with the RC.

 

[LondonJohn]

I have rarely had my ticket inspected when travelling between Waterloo and Southampton and I travel at least 4 times a month on this route. Indeed on the last journey the guard made his way to the drivers end cab where he remained for the whole of the journey ignoring the fact that a party of 3 had taken up 8 seats for them and their luggage leaving people standing.

He was probably tweeting in his views are my own capacity like a lot of SWT seem to do whilst they are at work at the moment as he had an iphone in his hand.

 

[SS4]

Like Mojo I've never not had my railcard checked on the train. Even the barrier staff at BHM ask for it more often than not

 

[scotsman]

I have rarely had my ticket inspected when travelling between Waterloo and Southampton and I travel at least 4 times a month on this route. Indeed on the last journey the guard made his way to the drivers end cab where he remained for the whole of the journey ignoring the fact that a party of 3 had taken up 8 seats for them and their luggage leaving people standing.

He was probably tweeting in his views are my own capacity like a lot of SWT seem to do whilst they are at work at the moment as he had an iphone in his hand.

You wouldn't be the delightful @johnonamonday, would you?


I'd like to point out that the South West Trains staff who tweet, do so when they are off duty or on a break .

 

[scot_rail]

Except when actually purchasing tickets, Scotrail have not once asked to see my railcard. Not by ticket inspectors or the line of staff standing at the platform entrances at Glasgow Central / Partick.

 

[WillPS]

On the other hand, on on-train inspections, I have never not had my Railcard checked.

Really?! On regional services I used to get asked for the rail card maybe half the time? InterCity staff always seem pretty on the ball though.

I seem to get asked much more recently, dunno if it's because I look older now or something though?

 

[CarterUSM]

I always inspect railcards , though some people take exception to producing them on polite request.

 

[bb21]

My experience says that over the course of the last couple years, on-train staff have been getting more and more on the ball regarding railcards, particularly with intercity operators.

 

[Solent&Wessex]

I always inspect railcards , though some people take exception to producing them on polite request.

I ALWAYS ask to see Railcards, and it is surprising the number of people who have one, but who say they didn't have it out as nobody ever asks to see it. Many people, often Senior Railcard holders tell me I am the first person to ask to see it for months.

Although why some people ask then not bother enforcing the railcard rules is beyond me. Only the other day I was travelling around off duty and overheard a conversation on an adjacent seat. The conversation went basically like this:

Guard - Can I see your ticket please?
Passenger produces ticket.
Guard - Can I see you Railcard please?
Passenger - oh sorry, I've left it at home.
Guard - Oh ok, don't forget to bring it next time. Guard then stamps ticket and walks off.

 

[bb21]

Guard - Can I see your ticket please?
Passenger produces ticket.
Guard - Can I see you Railcard please?
Passenger - oh sorry, I've left it at home.
Guard - Oh ok, don't forget to bring it next time. Guard then stamps ticket and walks off.

Northern by any chance? I can't imagine employees from other TOCs doing this, as it is clearly against the rules to leave your railcard at home and still claim the discount.

 

[bnm]

I take the view that my railcard (DSB) is a privilege afforded to me by the rail industry.

Therefore I always show it on board, or at a gateline when a ticket is refused by a barrier, whether asked or not. That, to me is the courteous thing to do.

I've no desire to go around testing staff to see whether they are on the ball or not.

 

[rail-britain]

Not by ticket inspectors or the line of staff standing at the platform entrances at Glasgow Central / Partick

When I was working as an external auditor for First Group the briefing was simply to ensure the passengers passing through have a ticket

In a three month period I managed to pass through several checks with either invalid or expired tickets, although on some occasions this was spotted but this was typically where the number of passengers was quite low
The report did outline this, but no action appears to have been taken (probably knowing that automated barriers were going to be installed)

Different on-train, the standards were much higher
Although on one occasion the Conductor recognised me and did not ask for my ticket

 

[WillPS]

Northern by any chance? I can't imagine employees from other TOCs doing this, as it is clearly against the rules to leave your railcard at home and still claim the discount.

Before I knew how sticky stuff like this is, I once lost my Railcard half-way through a return journey. The EMT guard (still wearing Central Trains uniform at this point) asked, I explained, and he accepted my excuse.

I very much doubt this would happen today. I'd probably get PF'd!

 

[All Line Rover]

I ALWAYS ask to see Railcards, and it is surprising the number of people who have one, but who say they didn't have it out as nobody ever asks to see it. Many people, often Senior Railcard holders tell me I am the first person to ask to see it for months.

Although why some people ask then not bother enforcing the railcard rules is beyond me. Only the other day I was travelling around off duty and overheard a conversation on an adjacent seat. The conversation went basically like this:

Guard - Can I see your ticket please?
Passenger produces ticket.
Guard - Can I see you Railcard please?
Passenger - oh sorry, I've left it at home.
Guard - Oh ok, don't forget to bring it next time. Guard then stamps ticket and walks off.

And the next time that that passenger travels with Virgin, they will be getting a BIG UPFN!

 

[142094]

A while back Northern used to allow people to buy railcard-discounted tickets on the train from manned stations - one of the hangovers from when ATN and Northern Spirit had the franchise. I often used to buy it from Newcastle on the train when travelling locally (before the barriers were in place). Then they started to crack down on it, probably a good 5 years or so ago.

These days I always seem to have the railcard checked, but I normally keep the tickets in the top pocket of the railcard holder anyway so always have it out.

 

[AlterEgo]

I'm never asked for my railcard, because I always display it with my ticket, like I'm supposed to...!

 

[RJ]

I'm never asked for my railcard, because I always display it with my ticket, like I'm supposed to...!

But some people take pleasure in making someone else's job that little bit more difficult . Once had a spotter type with no valid ticket refuse to show me his ID so I could issue the Penalty Fare more quickly - he said that he'd waste my time by letting me call the police. Given that I still had 7 hours to go til hometime, it was only himself he was putting out.

 

[SS4]

And the next time that that passenger travels with Virgin, they will be getting a BIG UPFN!

And an entirely legitimate one

 

[WestCoast]

A while back Northern used to allow people to buy railcard-discounted tickets on the train from manned stations - one of the hangovers from when ATN and Northern Spirit had the franchise. I often used to buy it from Newcastle on the train when travelling locally (before the barriers were in place). Then they started to crack down on it, probably a good 5 years or so ago.

I don't know what its like on the East side, but on the West some guards do still seem to allow it, it just depends. I've seen Duos sold from Wigan Wallgate (fully manned in the middle of the day with G4S with an Avantix!), railcards from Preston e.t.c.

I always present the railcard with the ticket, in a rather dog-eared SWT ticket wallet, so I am never asked for it!

As for frequency of checking, from what I've observed, it's down to the TOC it seems, intercity operators without fail, others are perhaps not so rigorous.

 

[142094]

I don't know what its like on the East side, but on the West some guards do still seem to allow it, it just depends. I've seen Duos sold from Wigan Wallgate (fully manned in the middle of the day with G4S with an Avantix!), railcards from Preston e.t.c.

Doesn't happen anymore, all seemed to change very quickly. Think management must have been laying down the law.

 

[WestCoast]

Doesn't happen anymore, all seemed to change very quickly. Think management must have been laying down the law.

It was just a few weeks ago, I observed this. The guards do also seem to be lenient when the ticket office is single manned, which is fair in my opinion, since the clerks occasionally do disappear from the window for whatever reason.

 

[Flamingo]

I always ask for all railcards (the most surprised to be asked are DSB and NSE railcards), will usually charge up unless there are some really good explanations.

The number of DSB who say they are never asked are quite large.

The odds of ending up in court for not having a railcard or a ticket when asked )or an adult on a child ticket) is about the same as being hit by lightening whilst clutching a winning lottery ticket.

The basic reason for this on my routes is that
- there are not many RPI's (I can use one hand to count the ones I know, one finger to count the one I usually see out on-train, and the same finger to count how often I see him every month - no fault of his, he only works 35 hrs a week and can't be everywhere)
-Guards have neither the time, training, (or inclination in most cases) to do anything about sending people for prosecution.
- we get told on NO account to delay a train over a ticketing issue, even to chuck them off, let alone to call BTP. Management grudgingly say if it is a safety issue then we can delay the train to have them removed, but in my experience, it usually results in "advice" that it was my fault for causing the situation to escalate.
- ticketing irregularities are not a priority of BTP.
- Even at Pad (largest main station) ringing ahead to get someone to meet the train, on two out of three occasions can be a waste of time.

Once we go through the tunnel into South Wales, we are in ATW territory, who do not even employ any RPI's, so that shows the priority they give to revenue protection. They have barriered stations, and some individual gateline staff are very good, but the overall situation is "who cares".

 

[TTI]

When I was responsible for this, as a matter of (good) habit, I did always ask to see railcards and it is surprising how many I did catch with no railcard/expired railcard.

Many punters (esp YP lot), risk this & then beg/plead with the guard just to charge them the difference rather than the (correct) full single/return fare. Any "scammer" or "blagger" can press a few extra buttons on a TVM to get their cheaper railcard ticket, as there's no-one to check.
So, therefore I (nearly always) used to correctly treat them as having no ticket. One or two who still argue get immediately handed their railcard leaflet and are directed to the relevant rule on the back of the leaflet. That usually shuts them up.

I have found that up to 15% have been caught out by on-board staff asking for railcards.