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First win Intercity West Coast franchise

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Sammy h

Sammy h

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Well, what a day!

We were told the sad news at about 6:30am so it was before the official announcement at 7am. I was quite shocked as I was expecting to hear the official confirmation via the media and not work so that was nice.

Looking at some of the proposals and the bid it looks impressive, time will tell whether all of this can be done.

With the ticket barriers at all stations, I presume these need to he manned at all times? I wonder if they are planning on reducing catering/other staff they will offer them these jobs to try and keep the staff on their side and keep staff morale up?

At the end of the day Virgin staff can be upset and moan or just get on with what we do best. Providing good customer service and enjoying out job.


I will be doing the latter and await news patiently.

Sammy H
 
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PR1Berske

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WCMLaddict said:
Totally agree in regard to impracticalities of the Wigan options.

Are there plans to build two more lines between Oxford Road and Piccadilly? As far as I remeber that is where the congestion happens. Were the 2 additional through platforms confirmed?
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This is a question often asked on these forums

The mythical "platforms 15/16" option at MAN may well be on a drawing board somewhere, though even after posters on this site directed me to some abstract technical drawings, I've yet to be convinced that they could be built without crashing through the Star & Garter and shaving off a couple of rooms from the Macdonald hotel.
 
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Wath Yard

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Pen Mill said:
so ,actually , they are not making any investment , the DFT is ?

The way I read this is : First spend the £350m then withold it from their premium payments result = 0 ,or at best a trickle of interest or have I missed something ?
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You can't have it both ways. No company can be expected to pay hundreds of millions in premiums and invest £100+ million per year at the same time.

People moan that the franchise was awarded solely on how much the DfT is going to receive and that passengers' requirements are being ignored, and then complain that the DfT isn't getting enough money and they are investing too much in the franchise.
 
Tim R-T-C

Tim R-T-C

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Miken said:
Lord preserve us... some of us have to TRAVEL on these trains.. for work... it is not a hobby but a necessity... It's obvious from a lot of 'insider' posts on this forum that the travelling public are at the bottom of the heap and it doesn't matter a jot what we as customers think and feel about this dreadful news.
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Ultimately the only thing we can at this time with certainty is that there will be a new livery. All else is speculation - albeit some more well informed than others. Certainly though to say the news is 'dreadful' for travellers is a little pre-emptive particularly when Virgin often had a very bad reputation.
 
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snail

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PR1Berske said:
This is a question often asked on these forums

The mythical "platforms 15/16" option at MAN may well be on a drawing board somewhere, though even after posters on this site directed me to some abstract technical drawings, I've yet to be convinced that they could be built without crashing through the Star & Garter and shaving off a couple of rooms from the Macdonald hotel.
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Sigh. Can we keep to the subject?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Miken said:
Lord preserve us... some of us have to TRAVEL on these trains.. for work... it is not a hobby but a necessity... It's obvious from a lot of 'insider' posts on this forum that the travelling public are at the bottom of the heap and it doesn't matter a jot what we as customers think and feel about this dreadful news.
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As someone that spent several years commuting on First Transpennine Express trains on parts of the WCML, if they achieve that level of service I will have few complaints. Better time keeping than Virgin for a start.
 
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PR1Berske

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Wath Yard said:
Can you clarify why it is dreadful news, why customers are at the bottom of the heap (when some fares are being cut, and service improvements are being promised), and who the 'insiders' you are referring to are please?
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I think he is referring to the tendency on this forum for people who work for TOCs (in every capacity) to act....somewhat....what's the right way to put it...."overly self-confident" perhaps...towards members of the public.

You've no way of proving fares will be cut, by the way, so don't act clever-clever either.
 
F

Firestarter

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RPI said:
According to DfT website First will pay £5.5bn over the life of the franchise so quite a lot less than was being bounded about before! No mass job cuts and if they intend gating 21 stations then that will actually create a load of jobs, not all doom and gloom afterall and at last services between brum and scotland will be electric and have more capacity! First are also claiming to be introducing an enhanced catering offer so possibly a travelling chef type thing? but that is pure speculation. Just have to hope now that our first group free travel will be expanded to WC!
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Your presuming first keep thier other franchises
 
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Wath Yard

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PR1Berske said:
You've no way of proving fares will be cut, by the way, so don't act clever-clever either.
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Really? No proof except the published franchise commitment to cut some fares that is. Perhaps you should bother reading and understanding some of the available documentation before commenting.
 
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PR1Berske

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Wath Yard said:
Really? No proof except the published franchise commitment to cut some fares that is. Perhaps you should bother reading and understanding some of the available documentation before commenting.
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You might want to take notice of the news about rail fare increases yesterday, or do you have short term memory loss?

Or maybe you believe everything a private company tells you in a publicity document?
 
Y

YorkshireBear

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PR1Berske said:
You might want to take notice of the news about rail fare increases yesterday, or do you have short term memory loss?

Or maybe you believe everything a private company tells you in a publicity document?
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Or perhaps he believes something that is a contractual agreement as part of a franchise!
 
W

Wath Yard

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The annual across the board fare rise, set by the Government, for regulated fares has precisely what to do with what FirstGroup will do on the ICWC?

I hadn't realised the DfT were part of FirstGroup or that a franchise commitment is a company's publicity documentation.

Seriously, give up. You're not making yourself look very intelligent.
 
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PR1Berske

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Wath Yard said:
The annual across the board fare rise, set by the Government, for regulated fares has precisely what to do with what FirstGroup will do on the ICWC?

I hadn't realised the DfT were part of FirstGroup or that a franchise commitment is a company's publicity documentation.

Seriously, give up. You're not making yourself look very intelligent.
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And you're coming across as tedious, shall we have a tit-for-tat fight along these lines for the rest of the thread?
 
172212

172212

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On a local stopping service near you
172212

172212

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On a local stopping service near you
If these promises of extra seats, improved journey times and more direct services from London to Blackpool, Shrewsbury and Bolton are fulfilled, it will be a very exciting time for passengers of the WCML, I'm quite excited to see what First will do
 
Pen Mill

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Wath Yard said:
You can't have it both ways. No company can be expected to pay hundreds of millions in premiums and invest £100+ million per year at the same time.

People moan that the franchise was awarded solely on how much the DfT is going to receive and that passengers' requirements are being ignored, and then complain that the DfT isn't getting enough money and they are investing too much in the franchise.
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I don't want anything both ways.

All i want to know is if First are being reimbursed for their investment by Dft because that's what it sounds like to me. If so they (First) are not making an investment.

Armed with that knowledge I will then make a decision as to whether to moan or not.
 
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Wath Yard

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They’re not being reimbursed. The investment is in lieu of premium payments. If the investment wasn’t in the bid the DfT would probably have demanded higher premiums. So if you so desired you could argue the DfT is paying for the investment by accepting lower premiums in the earlier years, or you could argue that the DfT has actually done a pretty decent job in balancing premiums and passenger benefits. It all depends on how you look at it – glass half full or glass half empty.
 
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Zoe

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LNW-GW Joint said:
It's the frequency that goes up, the interval goes down...
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Are they not basically just saying "Up to every 12 minutes" as how often the buses run during the day rather than a change in frequency. One route I used had "up to every 15 minutes" on the side of the bus but the service ran every 30 minutes in the evening.
 
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YorkshireBear

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Pen Mill said:
I don't want anything both ways.

All i want to know is if First are being reimbursed for their investment by Dft because that's what it sounds like to me. If so they (First) are not making an investment.

Armed with that knowledge I will then make a decision as to whether to moan or not.
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They invest heavily in early years and pay lower premiums then as the investment starts to pay back the premiums go up. Makes sense, they are not getting out of paying government. They could equally average out investment and average out the payments.
 
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YorkshireBear

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Blindtraveler said:
3 words, I'm not happy!

It had better be mini pendos, 395s or even 6 car IEP But knowing first itl be 350s or something daft. I hope to be proved rong
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They said 125mph, to do that it has to tilt, so i wouldn't worry about it being anythign sub standard.
 
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snail

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PR1Berske said:
Or maybe you believe everything a private company tells you in a publicity document?
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Do you ever accept anything you read or are you being deliberately provocative? You don't think Manchester Piccadilly can be extended despite all the evidence to the contrary; now you are accusing First of telling lies about reducing fares.
 
Hazlehead

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Blindtraveler said:
3 words, I'm not happy!

It had better be mini pendos, 395s or even 6 car IEP But knowing first itl be 350s or something daft. I hope to be proved rong
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It will be mini pendos as Alstom and First won't want a mixed fleet. Bad enough having voyagwrs and pendos without another class to add to it
 
T

The Ham

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Sammy h said:
Well, what a day!

We were told the sad news at about 6:30am so it was before the official announcement at 7am. I was quite shocked as I was expecting to hear the official confirmation via the media and not work so that was nice.

Looking at some of the proposals and the bid it looks impressive, time will tell whether all of this can be done.

With the ticket barriers at all stations, I presume these need to he manned at all times? I wonder if they are planning on reducing catering/other staff they will offer them these jobs to try and keep the staff on their side and keep staff morale up?

At the end of the day Virgin staff can be upset and moan or just get on with what we do best. Providing good customer service and enjoying out job.


I will be doing the latter and await news patiently.

Sammy H
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I hope that when First said that staff levels would be broadly the same over the first 5 years that they stick to that promise and that those with a job at Virgin retain their job when First take over, maybe with just a little natural wastage. Mostly for the benefit of the staff but partly for the benefit of the wider economy.
 
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