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London Underground unit numbers?
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causton
Established Member
Only individual carriages. Some newer units will stay together e.g. 21001/21002 etc etc on the Met line, but older lines will have the stock swapped about every so often so you can never be truly sure unless you get up to 4 numbers off each train!*
*IIRC 92 stock is made up of four 2-car units...
*IIRC 92 stock is made up of four 2-car units...
1995 stock on the Northern line is made of 2 x 3 car units, so each unit will have a number. Since the withdrawal of the Chesham Shuttle, there is not one stock currently in passenger service that is made up of only one unit, although the 2009 Stock and S7/S8s (all of which are made of 2 units) are semi-permanently coupled.
causton
Established Member
Personally? I just get the front one. I know some people do get all of them though, which must take a long time considering the sort of journeys the Tube is designed for!
It's possible to work out the unit number by looking at any individual car number (some maths required on certain stock) and with car numbers being displayed both inside and outside of the cars it isn't too difficult, although slightly more challenging for Central line and C stock trains which are made up of 4 and 3 units respectively.
bronzeonion
Member
I normally go by the lowest number shown or the number on the driving car. Problem is every stock has a different bloody system!
A stock is formed for example: 5054-6054-6055-5055. Personally I would say that unit is 5054 because its the lowest numbered driving car, some will say whichever end they saw leading but in general it is always the driving car. Most people will understand what you mean either way.
A stock is formed for example: 5054-6054-6055-5055. Personally I would say that unit is 5054 because its the lowest numbered driving car, some will say whichever end they saw leading but in general it is always the driving car. Most people will understand what you mean either way.
Peter Mugridge
Veteran Member
Personally I use a slightly non standard system for clarity because in some cases - D and 1973 Stock - a small number of units have two driving vehicles which means the regular numbering system breaks down a bit with them.
With those two types I use the centre car as the unit number as that avoids any ambiguity.
For the C Stock I use the 5xxx car.
For the 1972 Stock, the 32xx and 34xx cars.
For the 1992 Stock, as mentioned above made up of four two car units per train, the 92xxx sequence is common to all units, so I use that one.
1995, 1996 and 2009 Stock, the end cars.
I use the same for the S Stock, treating it as two units, although officially they are single units of 7 or 8 cars with French style dual numbering - but ( and I suspect I am not alone here ) I do not trust them to never break that rule and would not be surprised to find a mid unit split and re-matching taking place at some point...
With those two types I use the centre car as the unit number as that avoids any ambiguity.
For the C Stock I use the 5xxx car.
For the 1972 Stock, the 32xx and 34xx cars.
For the 1992 Stock, as mentioned above made up of four two car units per train, the 92xxx sequence is common to all units, so I use that one.
1995, 1996 and 2009 Stock, the end cars.
I use the same for the S Stock, treating it as two units, although officially they are single units of 7 or 8 cars with French style dual numbering - but ( and I suspect I am not alone here ) I do not trust them to never break that rule and would not be surprised to find a mid unit split and re-matching taking place at some point...
theblackwatch
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LU stock formations are quite complex and difficult to get your head round! There's a useful book on the subject 'Underground and Overground Trains' - see http://astore.amazon.co.uk/rafo04-21/detail/1854143646 for more details.
Peter Mugridge
Veteran Member
I'd disagree that it's complicated; everything is in a nice neat sequence.
Where it gets difficult is their habit of renumbering vehicles when they switch them between units as this can result in carriages swopping numbers for no good reason other than to keep their lists looking neat and tidy!
Where it gets difficult is their habit of renumbering vehicles when they switch them between units as this can result in carriages swopping numbers for no good reason other than to keep their lists looking neat and tidy!
Dstock7080
Established Member
Sadly let down by the omission of C Stock numbers and a few inaccuracies.
bb21
Emeritus Moderator
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The LU asset list is contained in the response to this FoI, however be warned that the list is not complete, with some 96 stock not included. In addition the recent introduction of S7 stock means that the listing is not complete for them either.
I am firmly in the camp of those who write down every little detail. However for most lines where trains are composed of two half units, I just stand in the middle of the platform so I can write down the number of the two coaches in the middle of the formation, if not before boarding, then once onboard as you can peer into the next carriage to see what number it is.
For C-stock, I tend to stand between the 4th and 5th carriage, so that as the first unit whizzes past me, I can write down what it is, before doing the same as above as the train comes to a stop.
92 stock is a bit of a bitch and same goes with 96 stock in central London, which is part of the reason why I avoid them where I can.
I am firmly in the camp of those who write down every little detail. However for most lines where trains are composed of two half units, I just stand in the middle of the platform so I can write down the number of the two coaches in the middle of the formation, if not before boarding, then once onboard as you can peer into the next carriage to see what number it is.
For C-stock, I tend to stand between the 4th and 5th carriage, so that as the first unit whizzes past me, I can write down what it is, before doing the same as above as the train comes to a stop.
92 stock is a bit of a bitch and same goes with 96 stock in central London, which is part of the reason why I avoid them where I can.
Nym
Established Member
I can safely say that 2009TS isn't 'semi perminantly coupled' by the correct definition.
Autocouplers are used and they are split for several jobs at Northumberland Park...
WinterChief
Member
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They do not have auto couplers in-between the two D cars in the middle of the train. They are semi permanently coupled.
Piccadilly line 73 stock run 1-5-3 or 2-6-4 eg 111-511-311 or 254-654-454
You leading units will be 1 or 2 trailers 5 or 6 and udm coincidently 3 or 4
Double ended units use 8-6-8 but even after 6 years driving I can't remember how to work them out. It's one digit up or down e.g. 865-665 and then it is either 864 or 866
Hope that helps
You leading units will be 1 or 2 trailers 5 or 6 and udm coincidently 3 or 4
Double ended units use 8-6-8 but even after 6 years driving I can't remember how to work them out. It's one digit up or down e.g. 865-665 and then it is either 864 or 866
Hope that helps
Dstock7080
Established Member
I have to agree with WinterChief both '09 & S stock use bar couplers between each car with wedge-lock couplers only at the train end.
S Stock have mechanical only wedge-locks, '09s have non-reversible (A-D only) at the train end.
S Stock have mechanical only wedge-locks, '09s have non-reversible (A-D only) at the train end.
Peter Mugridge
Veteran Member
The even numbered one is the lower one ( same with the double cab D Stock ).
It is for precisely this reason of risk of confusion that I use the middle carriage as the unit identifier on these two stocks!
Nym
Established Member
You mean A to A on the train end of 2009TS...?
2009TS units are formed A-B-C-D and D1-C-B-A with a train formed as A-B-C-D-D1-C-B-A.
There is technically an A1 car, but there isn't much difference any more since the mods.
Dstock7080
Established Member
You are referring to types of cars, I'm referring to the operational ends of the trains: 'A' even/north, 'D' odd/south.
Nym
Established Member
Apologies, BT has really ruined the Acton/Dagenham system...
But on the vic I rearly hear anyone, even the old hats using 'A' end and 'D' end; even on drawings 'A' and 'D' end is reversing, where the D1 is defined as such.
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